Revolution-420 Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 I have an issue with this mod. For one, it is bundled with mods that do not tell you how to disable it prior to starting the game. So when you first start the game and get the message on how to turn it off, its too late cuz soon as you exit the game its going send a report. That to me at least is stealing. A simple button to opt out before anything is sent seems like a no brainer. But then everyone would opt out (which is prob why there is no such button). And the fact that unless you go through all mods and delete the dlls it will keep reinstalling itself.... kinda like the "V" word. The way this "mod" was implamented is very shady. Why bundle it at all? Just let people who want to participate get it directly. Me personally, I dont want some file that is doing nothing for me eating ANY system resources or bandwidth. Especially one that serves questionable use to anyone. I just hope that this is not a sign of what we can now expect to see come out of the awesome ksp modding community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blizzy78 Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 So when you first start the game and get the message on how to turn it off, its too late cuz soon as you exit the game its going send a report.It says right in the ModStatistics post:When are statistics sent?The plugin generates reports when the game closes and saves them to disk. The next time the game starts, it attempts to send any outstanding reports to the server. ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regex Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 If you're that worried about it vet your mods carefully and ensure that ModStatistics isn't hiding in a mod's folder somewhere before you load the game. Kethane does this; I tried deleting ModStatistics during a diagnosis of an install but it was also hiding in the Kethane folder, so it got put back in on the next load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolution-420 Posted July 21, 2014 Author Share Posted July 21, 2014 (edited) So it only sends reports when it starts the game? I thought it did it on the exit. Guess that is a little less shifty Edited July 21, 2014 by Revolution-420 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regex Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Yes it does tell you on the modstatisics post but what if you got it while downloading ferram.... you would not know how to turn it off until it was too late.From the FAR OP:NOTE: This mod includes ModStatistics, an anonymous mod usage statistics plugin. See the ModStatistics thread for more information and opt-out instructions.So, basically, vet your mods and respond accordingly. This is not an issue if you actually pay attention to what you're installing on your computer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferram4 Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 You would be able to read the notice in the forum thread that says that it's bundled, as well as including a link to the ModStats thread for more info.The only way it would be "too late" is if you started the game, ended, then started again. At that point, you had plenty of time to change the ModStats settings.It kind of doesn't make logical sense to send a report when the game closes anyway; that would prevent reports from being sent when the game crashes. Much more logical to send it when the game starts up if the report exists, and that only happens after the first time it runs. Hence, that's why it waits until the second time you load the game, long after you had the chance to change things, before it sends any data. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolution-420 Posted July 21, 2014 Author Share Posted July 21, 2014 Ok I understand, but the absence of an opt out button when the message pops up tells you alot about the mod writers intent. Please correct me if I missed the button. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regex Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Ok I understand, but the absence of an opt out button when the message pops up tells you alot about the mod writers intent. Please correct me if I missed the button.His intent is to gather anonymous statistics. If you don't like that, you've been given plenty of opportunities to opt-out/uninstall the software. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motokid600 Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 "Vet your mods" been outta the mod loop for a few months now... What does that mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regex Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 "Vet your mods" been outta the mod loop for a few months now... What does that mean?https://www.google.com/search?q=vet+definitionverb1. make a careful and critical examination of (something). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolution-420 Posted July 21, 2014 Author Share Posted July 21, 2014 It means we have to now go through the mods files and delete any offending content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Tao Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 That's "vet" as in check something out. Meaning you should look at what you're installing on your computer before you run it – good advice in general because that's how computer trojans spread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodo Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 "Vet your mods" been outta the mod loop for a few months now... What does that mean?To vet something is a security term. It means to check over something to make sure it is safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eurybaric Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Hasn't this been already discussed thoroughly in the other thread?? I say let's wait for SQUAD's say on the matter , and Majir's as well. In any case, I don't mean to be a back seat moderator but... cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolution-420 Posted July 21, 2014 Author Share Posted July 21, 2014 Yes but that thread is closed. So can't discuss it there anymore, I'm sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motokid600 Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Thanks. Been on these forums for almost two years. Never heard that term before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodo Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Hasn't this been already discussed thoroughly in the other thread?? I say let's wait for SQUAD's say on the matter , and Majir's as well. In any case, I don't mean to be a back seat moderator but... cheersExactly what I was thinking. Thought it had been seperated from that thread at first... nope it is another person complaining about something that they don't fully understand.No I don't like the Modstatistics, but I don't disagree with it. I just think it was handled poorly. I said a much longer version of this in that other thread and don't care to repeat myself to kids having tantrums everywhere they can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharpspoonful Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Not to be speak ill of the KSP forumites, but with stuff like this you need to attempt to make it idiot-proof (until someone makes a better idiot that is). A simple window like the SQUAD request to collect anonymous game data would be along those lines. something where someone who perhaps doesnt read these forums closely, or where they may not know that they've unwittingly added Modstatistics can opt-out without having to dig throught the config files.Personally, I don't mind. I have a facebook, multiple email accounts, and a screen name that hasn't changed since '06. My information concerning my internet activities are already out there, and jumping on Majir's head for trying to get better info to help modding doesn't change that fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolution-420 Posted July 21, 2014 Author Share Posted July 21, 2014 You are correct I do not fully understand it. I'm not a programmer at all, I had to take 30 min out to figure out how to edit a config file. But please help me understand it cuz I for one can't see how knowing how much time I spend in a scene is going to help the modding community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragzilla Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Hasn't this been already discussed thoroughly in the other thread?? I say let's wait for SQUAD's say on the matter , and Majir's as well. In any case, I don't mean to be a back seat moderator but... cheersThis * 100, arguing about Modstatistics only gets threads closed, and until Squad says something (tomorrow hopefully) it's all pointless.Until then delete it, disable it, or use a blocking mod like StillBetterThanSpyware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolution-420 Posted July 21, 2014 Author Share Posted July 21, 2014 Ok understood, But what is squad commenting on? And where can I follow it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandworm Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 (edited) Telling people not to talk about something like this doesn't help. Telling people that they cannot talk now, that they have to wait for some other person to wake up or talk first, says to them that their voice is less important than that other person's. This is particularly irksome when that other person lives a very different time zone and/or work scheduled. Regardless of whether these feelings are reasonable or not, my point is that locking each and every thread or banning discussion of the issue outright will not make the problem, the anger, go away.Lock people out here and they may resort to more aggressive and disruptive means: Twitter, reddit or emails to the developers directly.Anyone tired of listening to this debate remains free not to read the associated threads. Edited July 21, 2014 by Sandworm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragzilla Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 (edited) Ok understood, But what is squad commenting on? And where can I follow it?Maxmaps (Squad PR for KSP) has said Squad are discussing some of the issues raised by Modstatistics (forced call home, opt-in vs. opt-out) in a meeting tomorrow. So until Squad have officially defined their position then, everything stays as is.Telling people not to talk about something like this doesn't help. Telling people that they cannot talk now, that they have to wait for some other person to wake up or talk first, says to them that their voice is less important than that other person's. This is particularly true when that other person is in a very different time zone and/or work scheduled. Regardless of whether that is true or not, my point is that locking each and every thread or banning discussion of the issue outright will not make the problem go away.Except Squad have already heard all the arguments (here and elsewhere), users fighting it out before Squad decides what they want to do is pointless and disruptive. The point has been made, the wizard is back behind the curtain, we all just need to wait for him to come back out and tell us what the rules are going forward.-edit-At this point (IMO) we're well into the "Let old controversies die" guideline from the good conduct guide, until Squad makes an official statement. Edited July 21, 2014 by ragzilla Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandworm Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 You are assuming that once Squad is aware that nothing more can be done. This forum serves purposes beyond simply informing Squad of issues. Allowing people to debate issues in public both helps them feel that they are being heard and allows non-speaking observers to educate themselves on the issue. (see speakers corner). Not everyone reads these forums every day or week. A hotly debated issue should be allowed to continue for some period of time, not forever, but surely more than a couple weeks.I don't see the disruption. Nobody is forcing anyone to read these threads. The mods might have to work a little more, but that is to be expected after any update. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claw Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Hasn't this been already discussed thoroughly in the other thread?? I say let's wait for SQUAD's say on the matter , and Majir's as well. In any case, I don't mean to be a back seat moderator but... cheersYes, it has been discussed. Please also reference the link above.Telling people not to talk about something like this doesn't help. Telling people that they cannot talk now, that they have to wait for some other person to wake up or talk first, says to them that their voice is less important than that other person's. This is particularly irksome when that other person lives a very different time zone and/or work scheduled. Regardless of whether these feelings are reasonable or not, my point is that locking each and every thread or banning discussion of the issue outright will not make the problem, the anger, go away.Lock people out here and they may resort to more aggressive and disruptive means: Twitter, reddit or emails to the developers directly.Anyone tired of listening to this debate remains free not to read the associated threads.Nobody is being ignored. We do not think your voices are less important. This issue has been brought up and is being discussed. Please be patient. As you pointed out, people live in different timezones and this started on a Sunday. It's going to take more than an afternoon to figure out.As such, I will be closing this since it has already been thoroughly discussed.Thanks for your patience,~Claw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts