[1.9-1.10] Hangar

[pmborg]

Hello @allista I think I need your help here if possible.

I am struggling to launch an Heavy SpaceAirplane inside the Inflatable Hangar (modified to become bigger enough)

@PART[HangarResizeLimit4]
{
    %MODULE[TechTreeResizeInfo]
    {
        @maxSize = 14
    }
}
@PART[InflatableSpaceHangar]
{
    %MODULE[AnisotropicPartResizer]
    {
        maxSize = 14
    }
}

[1] Maybe my question is what are the requirements to do that, maybe I am missing something? there is any video show that?

• The goal is to do this basic steps:
• Activate the hangar, launch the airplane inside hangar, keep the plane attached (docked to hangar) some how.
• Transfer Crew
• Un-dock plane from hangar and fly to do the planet re-entry

 

[2] The airplane need to have a docking port on tail or something, to attach to hangar?

Hangar here:

 

I am also considering to use the airplane attached docked in a normal dock, if this hangar fails like this, I would like to avoid it at all cost:

This test belongs to FreeThinkrer: Alfa Centaury Chalange.

Thanks in advance for your help.
 

Edited November 30, 2019 by pmborg

[allista]

52 minutes ago, pmborg said:

Hello @allista I think I need your help here if possible.

I am struggling to launch an Heavy SpaceAirplane inside the Inflatable Hangar (modified to become bigger enough)

@PART[HangarResizeLimit4]
{
    %MODULE[TechTreeResizeInfo]
    {
        @maxSize = 14
    }
}
@PART[InflatableSpaceHangar]
{
    %MODULE[AnisotropicPartResizer]
    {
        maxSize = 14
    }
}

[1] Maybe my question is what are the requirements to do that, maybe I am missing something? there is any video show that?

• The goal is to do this basic steps:
• Activate the hangar, launch the airplane inside hangar, keep the plane attached (docked to hangar) some how.
• Transfer Crew
• Un-dock plane from hangar and fly to do the planet re-entry

 

[2] The airplane need to have a docking port on tail or something, to attach to hangar?

[1] The MM patch seems right to me; it should effectively increase the maximum allowed size for the InflatableSpaceHangar to 14.

What seems wrong is that on the screenshot I don't see the Inflatable Space Hangar, but the Inflatable Ground Hangar which is not affected by this patch.

[2] No requirements. The plane just needs to fit physically inside.

 

Anyways, I'll consider to increase the resize limits for career game, as it seems often the case that one needs to fit something gargantuan inside.

[pmborg]

34 minutes ago, allista said:

[1] The MM patch seems right to me; it should effectively increase the maximum allowed size for the InflatableSpaceHangar to 14.

What seems wrong is that on the screenshot I don't see the Inflatable Space Hangar, but the Inflatable Ground Hangar which is not affected by this patch.

 

The full list of my changes are here:

@PART[HangarResizeLimit4]
{
    %MODULE[TechTreeResizeInfo]
    {
        @maxSize = 14
    }
}
@PART[Hangar2]
{
    %MODULE[AnisotropicPartResizer]
    {
        maxSize = 14
    }
}
@PART[RadialHangar]
{
    %MODULE[AnisotropicPartResizer]
    {
        maxSize = 14
    }
}
@PART[InflatableSpaceHangar]
{
    %MODULE[AnisotropicPartResizer]
    {
        maxSize = 14
    }
}
@PART[InflatableHangar1]
{
    %MODULE[AnisotropicPartResizer]
    {
        maxSize = 14
    }
}
@PART[InflatableHangar2]
{
    %MODULE[AnisotropicPartResizer]
    {
        maxSize = 14
    }
}

[2] No requirements. The plane just needs to fit physically inside.

Thanks!

 

Anyways, I'll consider to increase the resize limits for career game, as it seems often the case that one needs to fit something gargantuan inside.

Yes that is a good Idea for sure, make a continuous increase of size

 

[allista]

2 hours ago, pmborg said:

The full list of my changes are here:

Tired this patch and it worked both for space and ground inflatable hangers.

And I've changed the tech tree limits as follows:

• generalConstruction: size/aspect [0.75, 1.5]
• miniaturization: size/aspect [0.5
• precisionEngineering: size/aspect [0.1
• advConstruction: size/aspect 3]
• specializedConstruction: size/aspect 6]
• composites: size/aspect 12]
• metaMaterials: size/aspect 1000]

[pmborg]

25 minutes ago, allista said:

Tired this patch and it worked both for space and ground inflatable hangers.

And I've changed the tech tree limits as follows:

• generalConstruction: size/aspect [0.75, 1.5]
• miniaturization: size/aspect [0.5
• precisionEngineering: size/aspect [0.1
• advConstruction: size/aspect 3]
• specializedConstruction: size/aspect 6]
• composites: size/aspect 12]
• metaMaterials: size/aspect 1000]

Looks really nice, Thanks!

[allista]

Version 3.4.1 for Kerbal Space Program 1.8.1

Released on 2019-11-30

• Updated Tech Tree limits for Size and Aspect:
  • General Construction: size/aspect [0.75, 1.5]
  • Miniaturization: size/aspect [0.5
  • Precision Engineering: size/aspect [0.1
  • Advanced Construction: size/aspect 3]
  • Specialized Construction: size/aspect 6]
  • Composites: size/aspect 12]
  • Meta Materials: size/aspect 1000]
• Hopefully fixed aerodynamics of stock cargo bays that are patched to be hangars instead.
• For modders:
  • onLaunchedFromHangar provides additional bool fromFairings == true data field when a vessel is launched from HangarFairings module. This may be needed, because in this case the launched vessel should behave as if it was just the next stage of the carrier.

 Download 

[pmborg]

Hello @allista,

I updated the new 3 mods in a raw:

• Global Construction
• Global Construction Core
• Hangar

But unfortunately now I have a fatal error on Loading, the KSP 1.8.1 don't boot again, like in 1st days:

[ERR 23:30:09.744] MechJeb caught a ReflectionTypeLoadException. Those DLL are not built for this KSP version:

[ERR 23:30:09.744] GC.UI 1.0.0.0 GameData\GroundConstruction\Plugins\GC.UI.dll

Edited November 30, 2019 by pmborg

[allista]

14 hours ago, pmborg said:

[ERR 23:30:09.744] MechJeb caught a ReflectionTypeLoadException. Those DLL are not built for this KSP version:

[ERR 23:30:09.744] GC.UI 1.0.0.0 GameData\GroundConstruction\Plugins\GC.UI.dll

I cannot reproduce this. Just downloaded and installed everything from SpaceDock and all is loading and working well in the game.

Maybe it is not the MechJeb's work to check if another mod's assembly is or isn't "built for this KSP version"?

KSP itself does not complain.

Ok, I've clearly overreacted. MJ just logs the warning. So it's the update process that is at fault, because I have similar reports in the GC thread as well.

Edited December 1, 2019 by allista
Was too quick about CKAN =\

[allista]

13 hours ago, pmborg said:

[ERR 23:30:09.744] MechJeb caught a ReflectionTypeLoadException. Those DLL are not built for this KSP version:

[ERR 23:30:09.744] GC.UI 1.0.0.0 GameData\GroundConstruction\Plugins\GC.UI.dll

Cannot install with CKAN due to SSL error that prevent downloading of any mod for me.

[pmborg]

I am just guessing but it seams that somehow, you are compiling against KSP1.7.3 and not against KSP1.8.1

Edited December 1, 2019 by pmborg

[allista]

7 minutes ago, pmborg said:

I am just guessing but it seams that somehow, you are compiling against KSP1.7.3 and not against KSP1.8.1

No, everything is fine with the releases, if you use SD archives. But it looks like CKAN somehow slips you the older version or something like that.

Try reinstalling manually from SpaceDock, and I'll try to find out what happened with CKAN installation process...

[pmborg]

Just now, allista said:

No, everything is fine with the releases, if you use SD archives. But it looks like CKAN somehow slips you the older version or something like that.

Try reinstalling manually from SpaceDock, and I'll try to find out what happened with CKAN installation process...

Ok , I will do that, give some mins to test it.

[pmborg]

Yes, I confirm with the release from SpaceDock all was loaded with success, without "fatal exceptions".

Edited December 1, 2019 by pmborg

[allista]

13 minutes ago, pmborg said:

Ok , I will do that, give some mins to test it.

Finally was able to install all mods with CKAN from scratch. Everything works fine O_o

[pmborg]

Maybe the problem is the list of mods available yesterday was only 3 now i have 6, or even some sync.

Because I install it manually from SD now CKAN don't know about it, which is normal:

Edited December 1, 2019 by pmborg

[M443556]

Just wonder if this hangars can be patched to double as EL launchpads? Having "dry docks" on vessel and building on external ones (and than docking in hangars) works great, but feels wrong...

[allista]

20 hours ago, M443556 said:

Just wonder if this hangars can be patched to double as EL launchpads? Having "dry docks" on vessel and building on external ones (and than docking in hangars) works great, but feels wrong...

Well, you can always build in the custom-made, single-use shipyard using Global Construction 

As for the integration of Hangars with any construction framework -- I thought about it many times; but it would be very tricky, as hangar's internal space is meant to contain stored ships, so it is only usable as a shipyard if a hangar is empty and, vice versa, if something is built inside, you shouldn't be able to store anything. 

If you think about it, it actually makes sense: consider the difference between a berth in a port or a dry dock for a small boat inside of a big one; and the monstrous floating shipyard 

It would be cool to use hangars for repairs, if such a thing existed in a any meaningful way in KSP. But not for ship building, IMO.

[M443556]

6 hours ago, allista said:

Well, you can always build in the custom-made, single-use shipyard using Global Construction 

GC is a great mod, but it makes "out of home" construction just too complicated IMO, only second to building with KAS. Have you tried attaching K&K Planetary Central Hub to a radial attachment point on an asteroid? You just need 8 kerbals floating tight to it on EVA... After a few asteroid bases built with KAS I now only use it to attach a radial attachment point and EL disposable pad, and than I can build anything (if I have resources, labour and time) without micro-managing EVAs for every single part. Playing game should be fun, not enraging! And taking every build kit from Kerbin without MKS logistics is worse than enraging - it's boring! 

7 hours ago, allista said:

If you think about it, it actually makes sense: consider the difference between a berth in a port or a dry dock for a small boat inside of a big one; and the monstrous floating shipyard 

It would be cool to use hangars for repairs, if such a thing existed in a any meaningful way in KSP. But not for ship building, IMO.

With KSPI & WarpPlugin I can beam power from several singularity reactor cores across the galaxy, and my carrier capital ship have enough resources to build a few colonies with their own industrial chains and travels faster than light. Should it be able to slowly rebuild lost mosquito-fleet?

[bcqJC]

@allista, what are the requirements to get the Asteroid Hangar working? I've managed to catch an asteroid. Then docked an Asteroid Drill+Hatch to it. Set the Hatch to permanent and mined the asteroid. After hollowing out 8000m³, I built tanks and converted the mined ore.

After that, I recycled the drill and built an Asteroid Gateway to use the remaining space. I docked the Gateway to the permanent hatch.

The Gateway is not working. No options to Open or Activate the Gateway are available. I don't know how I managed it, but as you can see from the Recycler window in the image, the asteroid ended up as the root node. Is that significant? I also displayed the PAW for the permanent Hatch so you can see that it still has 7000m³ of space left after I built tanks in it.

Thanks.

[allista]

10 hours ago, M443556 said:

And taking every build kit from Kerbin

Not that far into career to produce your kits on site, are you?

10 hours ago, M443556 said:

Playing game should be fun

Many KSP players just consider engineering challenges to be fun  And in the days I used to use the ELP myself it felt quite cheaty. Don't know how its mechanics changed since.

Anyways, to each their own 

10 hours ago, M443556 said:

With KSPI & WarpPlugin I can beam power from several singularity reactor cores across the galaxy, and my carrier capital ship have enough resources to build a few colonies with their own industrial chains and travels faster than light. Should it be able to slowly rebuild lost mosquito-fleet?

It doesn't change the fact that a wharf is not a shipyard. They don't build cars in garages, not anymore 

1 hour ago, bcqJC said:

@allista, what are the requirements to get the Asteroid Hangar working? I've managed to catch an asteroid. Then docked an Asteroid Drill+Hatch to it. Set the Hatch to permanent and mined the asteroid. After hollowing out 8000m³, I built tanks and converted the mined ore.

After that, I recycled the drill and built an Asteroid Gateway to use the remaining space. I docked the Gateway to the permanent hatch.

The Gateway is not working. No options to Open or Activate the Gateway are available. I don't know how I managed it, but as you can see from the Recycler window in the image, the asteroid ended up as the root node. Is that significant? I also displayed the PAW for the permanent Hatch so you can see that it still has 7000m³ of space left after I built tanks in it.

Thanks.

Thanks for the report.

Itdoes look like a bug, because everything is ok with your setup. Could you share the .sfs and the mod list (preferably .ckan)?

Edited December 13, 2019 by allista

[allista]

@bcqJC also what's in the gateway's PAW?

[M443556]

3 hours ago, allista said:

Not that far into career to produce your kits on site, are you?

Use ELP to build a GC kit from resources, and than use another set of resources to finally build it into a ship\building\e.t.c.? That is what I name "too complicated". USI mods have already patched my ELP to use it's long industrial chains based on CRP resources, and KSPI adds more exotic needs for it's toys. And there is still so many "engineering challenges" out there aside from lifting heavy things from Kerbin's surface to orbit again and again...

3 hours ago, allista said:

They don't build cars in garages, not anymore 

What is the principal difference between a large garage and a small hangar like where Formula-1's are built?

Edited December 13, 2019 by M443556

[allista]

37 minutes ago, M443556 said:

Use ELP to build a GC kit from resources

Use an assembly line form GC to build a kit from Specialized Parts 

It seems you're trying to use that hammer from the wrong end 

37 minutes ago, M443556 said:

Formula-1's are built

They're not built, they're assembled from a few pre-build pieces. Like you would assemble a bicycle that you have transported with wheels taken off.

Both a bicycle and an F1 bolide are built on factory conveyors with complex machinery.

Edited December 13, 2019 by allista

[M443556]

16 minutes ago, allista said:

Use an assembly line form GC to build a kit from Specialized Parts 

Well (as I already said), I'm using USI industrial chains to build Specialized Parts and Material Kits from a longer set of intermediate resources that are refined from a longer set of mineable resources. And than using SP & MKT to build things via ELP... But now I consider adding Global Construction to my set of 95+ mods to see what it breaks, because you got me interested!

28 minutes ago, allista said:

Both a bicycle and an F1 bolide are built on factory conveyors with complex machinery.

I know, in detail. For 6+ years I've been working with CNC-machines as an engineer. G-code, firmware, finding mechanical backlash, because mechanic dude says everything runs smooth and it doesn't... It was a fun time in his own way, but now i'm back in IT. Returning to the topic, that is what construction mods simulate - assembling final crafts from a set of Rocket\Specialized\Whatever parts and your great Hangars look like just the right place...

[allista]

4 hours ago, M443556 said:

that is what construction mods simulate - assembling final crafts from a set of Rocket\Specialized\Whatever parts and your great Hangars look like just the right place.

What I tried to do about this was integrate with KIS to be able to rebuild ships in hangars. Say, you docked a ship, then disassembled it into parts, then constructed something else from them. But at the time KIS didn't provide any public API 

 

4 hours ago, M443556 said:

that is what construction mods simulate

GC actually tires to simulate advanced 3D printing (the assembly line) and then the construction from the built parts. But never mind that; the actual problem is that to properly use a hangar as an assembly or construction space (in GC terminology) I would have to link the Hangar.dll against the GroundConstruction.dll or, at best, to make additional .dll that will only load if the GC dll is present. Because even to simply implement the required interfaces one need to reference the other.

But you made me think if it couldn't be done somehow. Because, despite me joking around, I most certainly see the discrepancy here.

Some way to query other part modules if the part is used in some way that prevents it too be also used as an assembly/construction space...

UPD: ok, nothing short of using bare reflection solves this problem; but there's nothing wrong with this per se

Edited December 13, 2019 by allista