[1.2.2] B9 Aerospace | Release 6.2.1 (Old Thread)

[undercoveryankee]

You know what? Screw it. It would be less work to build a replica. And an unrelated question, it is said that stock engines are overpowered because the game has an unusually high drag model, or "soupy" atmosphere. Considering that, how many times "thicker" is stock kerbins air compared to real life atmosphere?

Air pressure and density at sea level are similar to Earth. The higher drag is because the game approximates a ship's cross-sectional area as a fixed proportion to its mass, and that approximation significantly overestimates the cross-sectional area of typical aerodynamic-looking designs. A more accurate description than "soupy air" might be "having invisible parachutes strapped all over your ship."

[AetherGoddess]

You know what? Screw it. It would be less work to build a replica. And an unrelated question, it is said that stock engines are overpowered because the game has an unusually high drag model, or "soupy" atmosphere. Considering that, how many times "thicker" is stock kerbins air compared to real life atmosphere?

the problem isn't really soup-mosphere, as people like to call it, it's more that the default drag model uses part mass as a proxy for surface area, meaning an empty fuel tank and a full fuel tank have different drag coefficients. add to that the fact that the default drag model doesn't take coverage into account, and a fuel tank under a pointed aerodynamic nosecone has more drag then a bare fuel tank with a flat top. finally, the very gradual default atmosphere gradient results in much thicker atmosphere at higher altitudes, leading to more drag losses over a standard accent profile.

in general, you need about 1000 m/s less delta-V to get to orbit under FAR, so this would equate to around 3/4ths of the stock atmosphere.

[WhiteWeasel]

the problem isn't really soup-mosphere, as people like to call it, it's more that the default drag model uses part mass as a proxy for surface area, meaning an empty fuel tank and a full fuel tank have different drag coefficients. add to that the fact that the default drag model doesn't take coverage into account, and a fuel tank under a pointed aerodynamic nosecone has more drag then a bare fuel tank with a flat top. finally, the very gradual default atmosphere gradient results in much thicker atmosphere at higher altitudes, leading to more drag losses over a standard accent profile.

in general, you need about 1000 m/s less delta-V to get to orbit under FAR, so this would equate to around 3/4ths of the stock atmosphere.

This is wandering out of B9 questions, but at first when I thought that FAR was more "realistic" by making flight more fickle with your aircraft. But the way you put it, it sounds like my planes would fly better, maybe even easier with it.

[AetherGoddess]

This is wandering out of B9 questions, but at first when I thought that FAR was more "realistic" by making flight more fickle with your aircraft. But the way you put it, it sounds like my planes would fly better, maybe even easier with it.

yes, they do, which is why Tav, Bac9, K3, etc only support FAR. building planes that work like planes in the default atmosphere is kinda dumb. it's also why the default turbos are reduced, because the default turbos, the "trashcan-o-explosives" RT-10 SRBs and a lot of other parts are intentionally overpowered to make up for the bad atmospheric model.

at least use NEAR, if your using Stock drag, you're cheating yourself.

Edited October 7, 2014 by AetherGoddess

[Sarda]

Don't know if this has ever been asked but would it be possible to get some of the B9 tanks variants to be able to hold Karbonite? Most of my large B9 ships always stop by Jool with Particle Collectors to refuel and it would look more aesthetically pleasing then just sticking the tiny default orange tanks on the side of the ship like tumours.

[Guest]

Can't you equip them with cargobays and stuff those full of Karbonite tanks?

[AetherGoddess]

Don't know if this has ever been asked but would it be possible to get some of the B9 tanks variants to be able to hold Karbonite? Most of my large B9 ships always stop by Jool with Particle Collectors to refuel and it would look more aesthetically pleasing then just sticking the tiny default orange tanks on the side of the ship like tumours.

So here's a neat trick, the B9 componets all use FSfuelSwitch and FStextureSwitch to change parts. Rover's Asteroid Recycling uses the same tech. all you need to do is modify the part in specific ways. here's the relavant config from my ART MM patch for CRP resources.

@PART[HA_FuelHatch]:After[ART]:Needs[CommunityResourcePack]
{
	@MODULE[FStextureSwitch2]
	{
	@textureNames ^= :$:;ART/FuelHatch/Water;ART/FuelHatch/Ar:
	@textureDisplayNames ^= :$:;Water;Argon:
	@fuelTankSetups ^= :$:;4;5:
	}
	@MODULE[FSfuelSwitch]
	{
	@resourceNames ^= :$:;Water;ArgonGas:
	@resourceAmounts ^= :$:;0.0001;0.0001:
	}
}

Important bits to patch would be textureNames, textureDisplayNames, fuelTankSetups, resourceNames and resourceAmounts. There are some other options, but they're not hard to understand. See the full documentation. As long as you have some passable texture skills, and a reasonable understanding of ModuleManager patches, this is something you can hack together yourself, I DID IT, so how hard can it be?

Edited October 8, 2014 by AetherGoddess
it helps if i remember to actually put the code in

[bioman3]

i have a problem the hx universal modules texture is bugged and i can't change the sub type also when i launch a craft using any of the b9 part's the game crahs's

[WhiteWeasel]

What happens if I use BD armory with this?

[Virtualgenius]

You will probably want to wait for all the dependencies to be updated Firespitter Kinetech etc, its usually a couple of days before everything gets updated, the guys are really quick at updating the plugins once they work out the problems give them a few days

[K3-Chris]

To the best of my knowledge 5.2.4 works with .25 but yeah it will be a day or a couple before all dependencies update for .25, and we'll tweak R&D purchase costs for parts as well.

[skeevy]

Don't know if this has ever been asked but would it be possible to get some of the B9 tanks variants to be able to hold Karbonite? Most of my large B9 ships always stop by Jool with Particle Collectors to refuel and it would look more aesthetically pleasing then just sticking the tiny default orange tanks on the side of the ship like tumours.

Easiest way is to just install Modular Fuel Tanks. Almost all of the B9 tanks will have Karbonite as a selectable resource with MFT installed. For the ones that don't, make a MM config like this

@TANK_DEFINITION[B9_Rocket]:FOR[Karbonite]:NEEDS[modularFuelTanks]{
    TANK
    {
        name = Karbonite
        amount = 0.0
        maxAmount = 0.0
    }
}

Where it says B9_Rocket, change that to whatever tank type you need to hold Karbonite, change Karbonite to whatever resource you need the tank to hold. The above is useless since B9_Rocket tanks will have Karbonite support without doing anything once MFT is installed.

[Conrad]

I apologize if that has already been asked: Are the crafts shown in the kerbalstuff page available somewhere?

I'd pretty much like to try them out.

Apart from that, i express my deepest gratitude for this pack. Just loving it.

[blowfish]

Purely out of curiosity - do you guys plan to reshape the Mk2 parts to fit the new Mk2 shape or keep them the way they are? Given that the B9 parts don't really fit aesthetically with the stock parts (old or new) I don't see any problem with keeping them the way the are but I'm just curious...

[Taki117]

Purely out of curiosity - do you guys plan to reshape the Mk2 parts to fit the new Mk2 shape or keep them the way they are? Given that the B9 parts don't really fit aesthetically with the stock parts (old or new) I don't see any problem with keeping them the way the are but I'm just curious...

The shape of the B9 MK2 stuff fits, it's just the style that is off. (This was tested with .24.2 so may not hold true in .25)

[blowfish]

The shape of the B9 MK2 stuff fits, it's just the style that is off. (This was tested with .24.2 so may not hold true in .25)

Well yes - the shape matched stock before, but the texture style didn't. The shape changed in 0.25.

[Taverius]

PorkJet sent us the source for the new MK2 meshes, but its going to take several weeks before we release an update that converts to that.

[K3-Chris]

We've already gotten reference models for the new shape from PorkJet, it's fairly trivial to modify the existing models, probably won't even have to modify the textures (except the back/front plates that are 1:1 with the shape), it's just a lot of models, pondering the workflow on it, could probably load all the Mk2 models into a 3d editor at the same time and manipulate the mk2 shaped parts to fit the new shape at the same time, though you'll have to re-export all the Mk2 parts in unity still (properly tedious that).

FireSpitter is broken in .25 and Snjo is busy with work, expect an update in 2-3 days, we won't re-shape all the mk2 stuff right off the bat, we'll release a compatibility fix update as soon as we can, then later an update with new features like the FAR RPM stuff, and down the line new mk2 shape.

PorkJet told us about the mk2 change ages ago and we agreed that it was a good idea to make it symmetrical, solves the weird CoM issues the previous stock mk2 parts had, and it looks nicer, though I'm no so keen on his removal of all heat tiles to make the cargobays reversible into bomb-bays. Though I guess stock can't have 2 variants of the same part with different texture/UV to have the heat-shield on the cargo bay door side.

Edited October 9, 2014 by K3|Chris

[Mr.foxy]

Hey guys or mod developers. Can you please update the B9 Aerospace mod to fit in with 0.25 the inside of the cockpit with the fancy data computers in the big and hypersonic cockpits dont seem to work for me. Will you update it so i can enjoy KSP Btw your mod is awesome

[T-Pilot395]

You could always slap heat shield panels onto yours once FireSpitter updates right? And maybe in the process, allow the heat shield panels on the cargo bay to be flipped so that the bomb and cargo bays have heat shielding.

I admire the amount of effort you guys put into B9. Keep it up!

[The Space Man]

I apologize if that has already been asked: Are the crafts shown in the kerbalstuff page available somewhere?

I'd pretty much like to try them out.

Apart from that, i express my deepest gratitude for this pack. Just loving it.

Are these what you where looking for?

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/92630-0-24-2-B9-Aerospace-Release-5-2-4-%28updated-04-10-14%29?p=1432314&viewfull=1#post1432314

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/92630-0-24-2-B9-Aerospace-Release-5-2-4-%28updated-04-10-14%29?p=1436356&viewfull=1#post1436356

[Guest]

Are these what you where looking for?

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/92630-0-24-2-B9-Aerospace-Release-5-2-4-%28updated-04-10-14%29?p=1432314&viewfull=1#post1432314

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/92630-0-24-2-B9-Aerospace-Release-5-2-4-%28updated-04-10-14%29?p=1436356&viewfull=1#post1436356

The first one wont work,ksp detects it as uncontrollable.. I dont know whats wrong though.

[T-Pilot395]

Throw a probe core somewhere obscure, that will work as a temporary solution.

[Grunf911]

I have been experiencing a weird bug.

I am not sure if this is 100% fault of the B9 or something else, but the bug is most manifested on the B9 components.

Sometimes in-flight some airplane parts get semi-transparent. They still work OK, but it's annoying. For example, cockpit on the craft below

Is there a fix or a workaround for it ?

BTW this is on 0.24.2 and B9 5.2.3 in KSP 32 with Active Memory Management On

[smunisto]

KVV - Kronal Vessel Viewer. Unfortunately, despite multiple reports, the author seems to think it's not due to his mod