Better realistic docking node system

[GBLAKEM1999]

I've been playing ksp for about a y at and a half now and am wanting more and more realistic play. With that I'm wanting a docking system that isn't magnets. Something that's like the nasa DNS. The one that they show in all the new module animations.

If anyone can help me post in this or send me a message. I can help with the modeling but I don't have any experience with blender. So if you want me to help with that we might have to skype or something. Message me if you can help! Thanks.

[Padishar]

Here's some more pics

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/webkit-fake-url://abf1caf6-1641-4553-87e7-385b66253ded/imagepng

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/webkit-fake-url://a1cfa3cf-6e22-4c65-ba27-c7c20f6143de/imagejpeg

You image links are completely broken for some odd reason. How did you attach them?

[GBLAKEM1999]

Oh I'm sorry I completly forgot it doesn't work off of my phone I'll try when I get home later today. Sorry about that

[GBLAKEM1999]

There the bottom one has both active and passive the upper one is active

Edited October 19, 2014 by GBLAKEM1999

[weeble]

There the bottom one has both active and passive the upper one is active

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRf_cm_r-sDNqCyHL-w-N-YVS_XV9eVwBolvvyo0m818PWKGC_vuw

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRjrFaawovIaQgyddIJxK1B385l8R3C85BSXInyWi6zlXYNE65oVQ

That is pretty neat idea. I'd love to see this one! Although the magnetic docking is pretty nice when you have .2 monopropellant and 20mins of life support left!

[GBLAKEM1999]

Yeah but I need help with the modeling. Basically do it because I tried and it was a catastrophe. So if you know anyone that wants to id appreciate it

[OrbitusII]

I've gotten an active/passive system to work, but it's based off of the Soyuz or Apollo program's probe/drogue setup:

And the results:

The docking port can be grabbed from here: One-Eye Industries

It doesn't look too impressive but it functions really well, despite being finicky and difficult to dock (more realistic, I suppose).

I'd be willing to package this up so someone can take a look at it in Unity in order to get GBlake's request filled. I can't commit the time to this but I'd be glad to lend a hand any way I could.

[GBLAKEM1999]

Wow that looks really good. I wish I could do that, but I dont have the time or patience to model stuff and get it working sadly that's the opposite kind of docking port I wanted, but good work on it!

[CaptainKipard]

Re: your PM GBLAKEM1999 What is it you need exactly? And what can you do?

[GBLAKEM1999]

I can do the modelling and feel like I can get the animation to work but the programming for me seems to be the hard part

[CaptainKipard]

I can't do programming either. I've had discussions with a couple other modders about more realistic mechanical docking ports before, but the the programmer who expressed an interest is busy with other things and hasn't really come up with anything.

Do you have an idea how you would go about this, with or without a plugin?

[GBLAKEM1999]

well you see im not really knowlegable about modding at first I wanted it super complicated but now im thinking more like a normal docking port that looks like the nasa one and has a buffer that extends, connects and then retracts and seals

[CaptainKipard]

That's more or less what we've been talking about with Sirkut and others. If anything happens it will probably have to be with his help, or someone who's familiar with the Infernal Robotics plugin because this functionality will need to make use of it, or something very closely related to it. It's way beyond me, and as I said Sirkut seems to be not very active lately.

It's not completely out of the question, but we'll have to wait.

In the mean time if you want to get into modding I suggest you practice texturing first. I've been here a while and I can safely say, what's lacking the most in this community is good quality textures.

[GBLAKEM1999]

That's more or less what we've been talking about with Sirkut and others. If anything happens it will probably have to be with his help, or someone who's familiar with the Infernal Robotics plugin because this functionality will need to make use of it, or something very closely related to it. It's way beyond me, and as I said Sirkut seems to be not very active lately.

It's not completely out of the question, but we'll have to wait.

In the mean time if you want to get into modding I suggest you practice texturing first. I've been here a while and I can safely say, what's lacking the most in this community is good quality textures.

I was planning on using this http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/81568-Tutorial-How-to-make-robotic-parts-for-the-Infernal-Robotics-plugin

[CaptainKipard]

That's not enough. Parts for this can only have one axis of rotation or translation.

[GBLAKEM1999]

Yes one for translation is there a reason you would need more

[CaptainKipard]

Oh I think you're right. I thought the active part on the Nasa Docking System translated in all three dimensions, but I can't find any conformation of that.

I can think of a few other problems that you need to figure out. How realistic do you want this to be?

[GBLAKEM1999]

im really just thinking of having one part that can extend and dock and then retract. maybe later allow you to control it on different axis and all that good stuff but first just a simple port. also have the guides work so you can just dock in three positions that would be nice to have but im not truly sure how hard that would be

[CaptainKipard]

I would check with the IR guys to see if you can have a docking port on a robotic part. Post a link to your post so I can read it.

[GBLAKEM1999]

a link to what?

[CaptainKipard]

Your post, which you will make when you ask them about it.

[sumghai]

I was planning on using this http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/81568-Tutorial-How-to-make-robotic-parts-for-the-Infernal-Robotics-plugin

That's not enough. Parts for this can only have one axis of rotation or translation.

Yes one for translation is there a reason you would need more

Oh I think you're right. I thought the active part on the Nasa Docking System translated in all three dimensions, but I can't find any conformation of that.

There isn't any information explicitly stating this, but if you guys look very closely at the rods holding up the docking ring, you'll see that they're actually linear actuators - this is essentially a Stewart Platform, a set of actuators working in parallel to manipulate the same load in sixdegrees of freedom (three translation plus three rotation)*. Because all six actuators are independently attached to the base and the docking ring, this contains their movement greatly, but the parallel arrangement of actuators allows for a much greater push/pull force than possible with a single actuator.

Presumably, the NASA Docking System would allow two spacecraft to dock by actively correctly translational and angular misalignments during the "soft dock" phase; once aligned properly, the active port retracts its actuators to pull the visiting spacecraft in for a "hard dock".

In short: Mere translation along the docking axis will not be enough; you will need three translation and three angular axes in total.

---

Another thing to take note of is the way KSP's ModuleDockingNode treats colliders.

Many people, including myself, have tried to add various guiding fins to help guide both docking ports so that they connect in a fixed or desired angular offset. The problem is that once KSP's stock docking ports are close enough to each other, their magnets activate and they essentially ignore any external guidance colliders - this sudden jolt would cause the ports to be misaligned after docking.

Just something else to think about in your pursuit of a "realistic" docking system in KSP.

(*ASIDE: During my undergraduate years, I did a summer research project involving a Stewart Platform robot, so I recognize one fairly easily)

[GBLAKEM1999]

Yeah I wish that we could make it that realistic but I thought that having a docking port part that's thin and the shape be one part and actually model that. Then have the base with all that stuff be a second. Then have the actuators just be an animation and not actually have a mesh. Do you think that system would work because then you just translate the port to and from the base, ksp doesn't have to have them truly touching

[sumghai]

Yeah I wish that we could make it that realistic but I thought that having a docking port part that's thin and the shape be one part and actually model that. Then have the base with all that stuff be a second. Then have the actuators just be an animation and not actually have a mesh. Do you think that system would work because then you just translate the port to and from the base, ksp doesn't have to have them truly touching

The individual linear actuators don't necessarily have to be animated; in fact, one could hide then under a flexible slinky-like fabric.

What I'm trying to say is, even if we visually hide the linkages, translating along the docking axis is not enough to handle many other types of misalignment in docking. You need to allow the docking ring to move sideways and tilt/twist in all three axis too.

[CaptainKipard]

Yeah I wish that we could make it that realistic but I thought that having a docking port part that's thin and the shape be one part and actually model that. Then have the base with all that stuff be a second. Then have the actuators just be an animation and not actually have a mesh. Do you think that system would work because then you just translate the port to and from the base, ksp doesn't have to have them truly touching

Actually the actuator animations are trivial to implement no matter how you go about it.

Toadicus is/was/will be coding something (for my non-androgynous docking ports) that can restrict docking ports to engage only within user-defined angle and distance ranges, so this could potentially be another problem solved.

The biggest problem is still the robotic aspect, if indeed you'd like a part with six degrees of freedom, as sumghai said, which I would prefer to do.