Parts clipping - is it immoral?

[Guest]

I think it is OK as long as you don´t use the part clipping cheat.

[Bill Phil]

I'm indifferent. I don't usually use it unless I'm messing about.

[Parkaboy]

Of course it's immoral. Can't you see how many people it hurts? And it sets a bad example for children. Also, it hurts the environment.

[comham]

iirc the pope recently denounced part clipping as the 8th deadly sin.

[TheBrisbyMouse]

I only use clipping if I KNOW a part should be able to fit there, but the game gives me BS and tells me I can't put it there. That's when I ALT-F12 and say I CAN put it there. I try to avoid severe part clipping because that could end in Certain Rapid Unplanned Disassembly. Also dinasours.

[Frank_G]

Here are some examples, i posted sometimes earlier this year on another thread concerning the same topic. I consider this part clipping as legitimate for my style of ship construction:

[Jouni]

Part clipping can improve craft performance, but I don't use it for this purporse, because it doesn't feel reasonable. Some people use clipping for aesthetics, but the effect works in reverse for me. As soon as I see visible part clipping, the entire craft starts looking ugly. On the other hand, if I don't see part clipping, I don't care.

[MartGonzo]

Part clipping can improve craft performance, but I don't use it for this purporse, because it doesn't feel reasonable. Some people use clipping for aesthetics, but the effect works in reverse for me. As soon as I see visible part clipping, the entire craft starts looking ugly. On the other hand, if I don't see part clipping, I don't care.

Yep, I fit into the "all about aesthetics" category

ugly rockets just won't do

[SkyRender]

Just for future reference, we tend to refer to situations where something has more logical and social ramifications as an ethical dilemma, not a moral one. Moral dilemmas stem more from emotional and secular issues.

I personally don't use part clipping. I don't really need it, so why bother? I won't begrudge others the option, of course, though I personally will be less impressed with their achievements if they do. Not that they have any reason to feel obligated to impress me, so it works out well for everyone in the end.

[SpacedCowboy]

Uh-oh, guess I'm goin' to H_ll in clipped hand basket! *clips handle into basket* It won't be too bad though, seeing I'll have a lot of company.

[syfyguy64]

If it is used in making ships that look astetically pleasing while still serving a function, it's not cheating. Especially since the collisions are just a tiny bit off.

[Kerbart]

Isn't it written in the scripture? “And THE LORD spoketh, thou shalt not clippeth parts for enjoyment nor for reason, for thy part clipping is an invention of the satan. And when they went ahead and clippeth anyway, He rapidly and unexpectedly disassembleth their unholy craftsâ€Â

[Madrias]

Upon starting KSP, once I load my save, I hit alt+F12 and enable part clipping because I want to be able to put my fuel tanks and RTG's where I want them.

[Red Iron Crown]

Like the others here have said, I see nothing wrong with clipping to get parts to fit, but I wouldn't use it to do things like putting multiple tanks or engines in the same space. I also don't "enable" clipping in the debug menu.

This, pretty much word for word. I'll clip the edges of parts to make things fit, but I won't clip engine bells or have multiple parts occupy the same space. When making engine clusters I'll clip the bases but not the engine bells. I never use the debug menu part clipping.

[SpacedCowboy]

Hey, isn't that one of the Ten Kommandments? ... "Thou shalt not Klip"

[Axelord FTW]

For structural and utility parts? For the most part I'm okay with that.

Fuel tanks and engines are a big no-no for me, however.

[Frozen_Heart]

I refuse to part clip tanks and engines together. Apart from that fair game.

[Twreed87]

I honestly don't even know why, but I hate clipping. It's weird, I have this unexplainable aversion to it. When I'm messing around, I'll sometimes turn on infinite fuel, or I'll mess with parts and give them crazy stats, but I pretty much never, ever part clip. Maybe it's because I don't like the way it looks?

Or maybe it's because I feel the real challenge in this game is in building and designing, and working with the restrictions you have. It's like playing with Lego's, you can put all sorts of pieces together, but you have to make them fit, and you can't put some Lego's inside of other Lego's!

In conclusion, part clipping is an abomination and you're all heathens who shall be burned at the stake!

[Wallygator]

I will attempt anything the editor will allow - except clipping full tanks completely inside one another - it has be be slightly realistic for me to do it, and it needs to look nice and hold together.

However, that said, I have no problem clipping the LVN into a small or medium tank, since it reality there should be no need for oxidiser so the tank should be partly empty anyway.

[GreeningGalaxy]

I'm utterly dependent on part clipping. I use enough mods containing parts with weird collision meshes that it takes mere seconds into the start of a build for me to have an RCS thruster block refuse to go where I need it, two perfectly-normal inline parts refuse to hook together at all, or, more rarely, to need a bulky part to merge into the hull a bit, such as a spaceplane's VTOL engine. Strangely enough, lots of particularly silly engine-through-tank clipping seems to be perfectly possible without actually turning part clipping on, while perfectly acceptable connections such as RCS thruster blocks on some tanks and nose cones on the tops of boosters just will not connect without part clipping enabled. More often than not, I just turn it on for consistency, since the set of rules for determining when a part is clipping and when it's not just doesn't make any sense.

I have no problem clipping the LVN into a small or medium tank, since it reality there should be no need for oxidiser so the tank should be partly empty anyway.

Well, keep in mind that the oxidizer is still behaving as reaction mass - you can imagine the LV-N treating the fuel/oxidizer mix as just liquid hydrogen (which is notably a lot less dense than kerosene, but whatever). The oxidizer still has mass and is still being fired forcefully out the back of the engine, so you can't just pretend it's not there. Personally, I have no problem with pretending that you've figured out some cool magic way of compressing the fuel into twice the density half the space, since the mass is still all there anyway, and mass is most of what makes ships challenging. (It's also a singleplayer game, so it doesn't matter what I think about your game anyway.) If you really want to be a stickler for accuracy about clipping engines into tanks, you can always just tweak the fuel in the tank down to half full, or just use a smaller tank.

Edited November 30, 2014 by GreeningGalaxy

[keeper]

Sometimes when i clip things they explode, depends on the part so all needs testing but i will if i can get away with it.

i dont go crazy just here and there. Sometimes a design choice sometimes structurals

[RainDreamer]

I think there is a mod that reenable part collider within the same ship, which would make anything with clipping insta-explode. That would be great for those doesn't like clipping at all.

[Overfloater]

How is it cheating if you still carry all the weight?

[RocketPilot573]

How is it cheating if you still carry all the weight?

Also it does not even effect aerodynamics what-so-ever, not even with FAR or NEAR last I checked (Pretty sure in those mods only cargobays and shrouds "shield" parts). Which gives zero benefits to part clipping (except aesthetics).

[Red Iron Crown]

How is it cheating if you still carry all the weight?

Also it does not even effect aerodynamics what-so-ever, not even with FAR or NEAR last I checked (Pretty sure in those mods only cargobays and shrouds "shield" parts). Which gives zero benefits to part clipping (except aesthetics).

It changes the mass distribution in the craft. Clipping tanks inside each other on a lander can lower its CoM and make it less prone to tipping over. Clipping can also reduce the vessel's polar moment of inertia, which makes it easier to turn (and thus requiring fewer reaction wheels and/or use less monoprop). Clipping tanks together also makes balancing spaceplanes easier, as you can have the wet and dry CoM line up perfectly with any fuel capacity.