[1.9-1.10] Throttle Controlled Avionics

[Bit Fiddler]

you mean like this? 

 

 

[FirroSeranel]

4 minutes ago, Bit Fiddler said:

you mean like this? 

 

Haha, very close! And very badass! *grins* Was that actually you? Very nicely done if so.

[Bit Fiddler]

no just a random vid on youtube I saw...

 

Solid Rocket Boosters: 400.00

HitchHiker Crew Pod: 4000.00

The look on Bob & Bills face: Priceless

 

 

[FirroSeranel]

@allista, I'm having trouble with manual controlled engine throttles.

I want to make a ship with ventral hover engines on Thrust, RCS-style attitude engines on Maneuver, and then one main aft-facing engine for fast translational movement, kind of like the hover-carrier in Avatar.

I can get everything to work but the aft engine. I have that one set to Manual Control, but when I try to move its throttle slider, it just jumps back to zero unless I also turn off vertical speed control of all kinds, which isn't what I want.

Am I doing something wrong?

[allista]

1 minute ago, FirroSeranel said:

@allista, I'm having trouble with manual controlled engine throttles.

I want to make a ship with ventral hover engines on Thrust, RCS-style attitude engines on Maneuver, and then one main aft-facing engine for fast translational movement, kind of like the hover-carrier in Avatar.

I can get everything to work but the aft engine. I have that one set to Manual Control, but when I try to move its throttle slider, it just jumps back to zero unless I also turn off vertical speed control of all kinds, which isn't what I want.

Am I doing something wrong?

Not sure.

This is another hard-to-explain design decisions: manual engines may be controlled manually, unless you use some sort of horizontal speed control (or autopilots that use it). For example, the Stop program will use manual engines; the Cruise, Path Navigation... anything that controls horizontal movement. So "manual" engines are not so manual after all 

But, if you say that Vertical Speed/Altitude Control has something to do, that it's probably a bug. It shouldn't.

I'll investigate the matter.

[FirroSeranel]

Okay, so I couldn't quite get it in one take... but here's the Harrier-styled Jump Jet I made, thanks to TCA and Mk2 Stockalike Expansion

 

5 minutes ago, allista said:

Not sure.

This is another hard-to-explain design decisions: manual engines may be controlled manually, unless you use some sort of horizontal speed control (or autopilots that use it). For example, the Stop program will use manual engines; the Cruise, Path Navigation... anything that controls horizontal movement. So "manual" engines are not so manual after all 

But, if you say that Vertical Speed/Altitude Control has something to do, that it's probably a bug. It shouldn't.

I'll investigate the matter.

 

Hmm... well I'm not 100% sure I was -only- using vertical speed control. I may have had VTOL assist and/or Level on. Would either of those keep it from working?

[allista]

7 minutes ago, FirroSeranel said:

Hmm... well I'm not 100% sure I was -only- using vertical speed control. I may have had VTOL assist and/or Level on. Would either of those keep it from working?

VTOL Assist -- yes, it explicitly uses Stop.

Level -- no, it only uses attitude control.

[FirroSeranel]

Okay, I'll try it again without VTOL assist.

[allista]

11 minutes ago, FirroSeranel said:

Okay, I'll try it again without VTOL assist.

VTOL assist uses Stop explicitly: it pushes the button for you as soon as you took off to steady the craft. You can push it yourself again afterwards to disable. No need to disable the whole assist program.

[FirroSeranel]

Just now, allista said:

VTOL assist uses Stop explicitly: it pushes the button for you as soon as you took off to steady the craft. You can push it yourself again afterwards to disable. No need to disable the whole assist program.

What else does it do, exactly? I know that with VTOL Mode, ships act kind of like GTA-style helicopters, and with VTOL Assist they act a bit more like a RL helicopter with a good flight instructor along for the ride...

Are those just combinations of modes that you assigned a name and button to? Or do they have something more going on behind the scenes?

[allista]

10 minutes ago, FirroSeranel said:

What else does it do, exactly? I know that with VTOL Mode, ships act kind of like GTA-style helicopters, and with VTOL Assist they act a bit more like a RL helicopter with a good flight instructor along for the ride...

Are those just combinations of modes that you assigned a name and button to? Or do they have something more going on behind the scenes?

Nah, VTOL Assist is just this:

• when you land vertically, it automatically extends landing gear, and when you touch-down, it tries to steady the ship using pitch-yaw-roll controls and whatever torque the ship has.
• when you take off vertically, before you actually took off (engines working, but there's not enough thrust yet) it also tries to steady the ship; when you finally took off, it pushes the "Stop" button to kill horizontal speed and retracts landing gear.
• in any other situation it does nothing.

[allista]

1 hour ago, FirroSeranel said:

Hmm... well I'm not 100% sure I was -only- using vertical speed control. I may have had VTOL assist and/or Level on. Would either of those keep it from working?

I've tested things and this is definitely a bug  Thanks for the report!

[Bit Fiddler]

This one seems to work great

 

 

[allista]

3 minutes ago, Bit Fiddler said:

This one seems to work great

How come the G1 is set to Off, but works?! 

[Bit Fiddler]

oh it pulses on and off  screenie just got it at wrong time

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/rx7v18ucz6wjut4/AACbJ4nOG3sc1CjBrNL_wtowa?dl=0

 

 

Edited October 20, 2016 by Bit Fiddler

[allista]

1 minute ago, Bit Fiddler said:

oh it pulses on and off  screenie just got it at wrong time

It pulses?!?!?! 

Is someone rewriting my code while I sleep?

Oh boy... another bug 

Thanks! 

[Bit Fiddler]

well not sure it is a bug...  it flies like a dream

just burns a metric excrements ton of fuel...   but my prop design was not working so well....  have to go try it again.

 

ok was just a kerbalmoment I guess...

 

 

this one works great as well

 

these are great designs as the VTOL fans are EC only they do not use any fuel.  so the rear engine produces EC that in turn powers the ducted fans and a few intake air RCS jets for some extra stability control.

Edited October 20, 2016 by Bit Fiddler

[Denko666]

Thanks @allista! I tried what you said about toggling TCA together with the engines to switch between different plane modes, and it works! Really well actually... have a gander at this photoalbum of my most recent attempt to get to Duna: https://flic.kr/s/aHskFCVmjm. The spaceplane enters Duna's atmosphere like NASA's shuttle, using its entire lifting body as a brake. Then flies down further as a plane before eventually switching to VTOL mode to find an acceptable landing spot. Deliver the Rover and crew, then take off again into orbit, back to the interplanetary stage to get the rest of the equipment. Wonderful! 

[allista]

4 minutes ago, Denko666 said:

Thanks @allista! I tried what you said about toggling TCA together with the engines to switch between different plane modes, and it works! Really well actually... have a gander at this photoalbum of my most recent attempt to get to Duna: https://flic.kr/s/aHskFCVmjm. The spaceplane enters Duna's atmosphere like NASA's shuttle, using its entire lifting body as a brake. Then flies down further as a plane before eventually switching to VTOL mode to find an acceptable landing spot. Deliver the Rover and crew, then take off again into orbit, back to the interplanetary stage to get the rest of the equipment. Wonderful! 

Cool! 

[Bit Fiddler]

oh hey what is that space plane part pack I have been looking for that for months but cant remember what it is called

[Denko666]

9 minutes ago, Bit Fiddler said:

oh hey what is that space plane part pack I have been looking for that for months but cant remember what it is called

It's Orbit Portal Technology (OPT). maintained by K.Yeon current version has been made KSP 1.2 compatible (v1.8.6) and the K.Yeon plans to have 1.9 ready by end this month with some very exciting changes and new stuff! That, T.G.O.L. Small Radial VTOL engines and the mkII Expansion is what i always use for spaceplanes. I wouldn't want to build one without them.

[Talavar]

On 1/25/2015 at 5:56 PM, allista said:

 

 Allista, did you write an entirely new navigation system, or is this just mechjeb's code being enhanced? because I gotta say..  while I like mechjeb and wouldn't knock the use I get out of it..., these videos of TCA's maneuver capabilities are making Mechjeb look like hammered S**t.

Edited October 20, 2016 by Talavar

[allista]

11 hours ago, FirroSeranel said:

@allista, I have another request.

I would like the ability to have a macro trigger an action group. I have mods with engines that can switch from hover to flight mode, like the Harrier, but no way to trigger the transition as part of a macro. Would this be difficult to add?

Done. Added two macros: Toggle Action Groups and Set Action Groups. Both allow you to control many action groups at once. The first only toggles the ones you have selected. The second sets all of them: enables the ones you have selected and disables the others.

[allista]

3 minutes ago, Talavar said:

 Allista, did you write an entirely new navigation system, or is this just mechjeb's code being enhanced? because I gotta say..  while I like mechjeb and wouldn't knock the use I get out of it..., these videos of TCA's maneuver capabilities are making Mechjeb look like hammered S**t.

Wll, all the high-level staff: the navigation, maneuvering and autopilots are written from scratch.

I did, however, took several things from MJ: it's code for inertia tensor calculation, inertia correction for attitude control, one of its PID controller implementations and several other minor things. Most of which has been more or less rewritten over the time.

[Talavar]

5 hours ago, allista said:

Wll, all the high-level staff: the navigation, maneuvering and autopilots are written from scratch.

I did, however, took several things from MJ: it's code for inertia tensor calculation, inertia correction for attitude control, one of its PID controller implementations and several other minor things. Most of which has been more or less rewritten over the time.

 Been playing with it for over an hour now.. MASSIVE improvement over MJ. Thanks a million, man. Great work you're doing!