[Stock Helicopters & Turboprops] Non DLC Will Always Be More Fun!

[qzgy]

45 minutes ago, boomchacle said:

Could you send me a link? I've been trying to find another stock one since I started this but I was unable to.

Not 100 percent sure but this might be what Azimech is talking about https://kerbalx.com/klond/supersonic-helicopter

[boomchacle]

9 hours ago, qzgy said:

Not 100 percent sure but this might be what Azimech is talking about https://kerbalx.com/klond/supersonic-helicopter

I don't believe that that's a synchrocopter though

[Pds314]

11 hours ago, Avera9eJoe said:

@Pds314 That swashplate is incredible... is there any chance you could upload your design so I could build off it? I tried making a 250 ton Osprey but wasn't able to get it fully working and got rather burned out trying to get it to fly in both positions. I also attempted to make a semi-cyclic bearing but that was rather buggy for how much it did. All of this was done before the addition of stock hinges, so I wager it would be possible to do now.
 

A new and improved version that's more yaw stable with a nicer-looking fuselage and less bulk. Also the swashplate can now be copied and moved and such without disassembling it because it is on a plate.

Also I reduced the rotor diameter on this helicopter because it weighs substantially less and a small, fast-spinning rotor can fling it into the air quite aggressively. No need for large and ungainly 4-long blades.

Warranty void if Jeb not onboard.
https://kerbalx.com/pds314/Swashplate-04

Edited July 11, 2019 by Pds314

[Pds314]

Some modest aesthetic, control, and other improvements.
https://kerbalx.com/pds314/Swashplate-04-a

[HafCoJoe]

Man... I can't believe that has no SAS

[Pds314]

1 minute ago, Avera9eJoe said:

Man... I can't believe that has no SAS

You'll believe it when you crash it into something lol.

[Pds314]

Although it's not to say you can't be precise with it. Landing on the top of the Island where the Island Runway is, gracefully enough that no damage was done to the helicopter (I launched from the Island runway itself).

Edited July 11, 2019 by Pds314

[Pds314]

It can also go at partial throttle in the water, allowing it to maneuver in all directions at reasonably good speeds, while neither taking off nor fully landing in the water and reaching high drag associated with that, and it can use the doors as rescue bays for any stranded skydivers.

Or you can be more aggressive. Landing on the Island Runway hanger undamaged within 14 seconds.

Edited July 11, 2019 by Pds314

[Pds314]

Or... through the hanger.

[Pds314]

For another challenge: reduced fuel load version shown.
 

For the same challenge:
 

Showing off:
 

 

Edited July 11, 2019 by Pds314

[HafCoJoe]

3 hours ago, Pds314 said:

It can also go at partial throttle in the water, allowing it to maneuver in all directions at reasonably good speeds, while neither taking off nor fully landing in the water and reaching high drag associated with that, and it can use the doors as rescue bays for any stranded skydivers.

Or you can be more aggressive. Landing on the Island Runway hanger undamaged within 14 seconds.

The problems I had with my mega osprey stemmed from instability with forward momentum. If you tilt too far to one side, the change of plane causes it it to start automatically pitching itself back, making it wobble back and forth until eventually it loses altitude and crashes. Because of how heavy the craft weighed this was pretty slow all things considered, but it was pretty much a guaranteed crash once it started. I tried a lot of things to alleviate this (jet powered SAS, semi-cyclic blades via claws, gimballed rotors), but nothing really worked. I have a feeling too that I won't be able to get the RPMs that my old engines got even with the new motors coming out soon. I expect I still will need to use the old blower jet engine type. The limiting factor I was hitting near the end of my tests was the hardcoded RPM limit 

Edited July 11, 2019 by Avera9eJoe

[IkranMakto]

Well done Pds314, I hope more people will start using new incredible features introduced with breaking ground. I think you can reduce parts in your swashplate so it will work even better. 

 

 

11 hours ago, Avera9eJoe said:

Man... I can't believe that has no SAS

This has no SAS too.
And it's perfectly flying.
And it has cargobay capable to carry 8t load..
And it sank under other topics :c

 

Edited July 11, 2019 by IkranMakto

[HafCoJoe]

17 minutes ago, IkranMakto said:

Well done Pds314, I hope more people will start using new incredible features introduced with breaking ground. I think you can reduce parts in your swashplate so it will work even better. 

 

 

This has no SAS too.
And it's perfectly flying.
And it has cargobay capable to carry 8t load..
And it sank under other topics :c

 

Woah, that looks awesome! Could you link me your post? I'd like to give it a fly if you've shared the craft file too.

Edited July 11, 2019 by Avera9eJoe

[HafCoJoe]

One question too, has anyone tried turning a hinge via engine exhaust? I.E. your standard jet driven props but with hinges instead of decoupling the blades.

[qzgy]

14 minutes ago, Avera9eJoe said:

One question too, has anyone tried turning a hinge via engine exhaust? I.E. your standard jet driven props but with hinges instead of decoupling the blades.

I think Klond has? Or someone else maybe?

I know there are people who've made crafts with ye olde methods of propulsion with BG stuff acting as bearings.

[HafCoJoe]

Gotcha, I might need to try myself. Just using them as bearings would help a ton for action groups and blade angle. Could make it so that with an osprey type craft the blades auto-pitch as the engine rotates too. I have little to no experience with the action window but I might stream later and try to figure it out. I've been dying to rebuild some crafts with the new hinges

Best of both worlds with getting ludicrous RPMS with exhaust, but hopefully retaining some strength/stability with hinges.

Edited July 11, 2019 by Avera9eJoe

[IkranMakto]

2 hours ago, Avera9eJoe said:

Woah, that looks awesome! Could you link me your post? I'd like to give it a fly if you've shared the craft file too.

 I'll upload a minor craft update later. And maybe kind of guide to swashplates

Comment if you like it please! 

Edited July 11, 2019 by IkranMakto

[Pds314]

4 hours ago, IkranMakto said:

Well done Pds314, I hope more people will start using new incredible features introduced with breaking ground. I think you can reduce parts in your swashplate so it will work even better. 

 

 

This has no SAS too.
And it's perfectly flying.
And it has cargobay capable to carry 8t load..
And it sank under other topics :c

 

Nice. I will download and give it a try. Also to cross-reference your design and mine.

[HafCoJoe]

Sharing ideas always makes masterful designs

[jfrouleau]

On 7/10/2019 at 2:11 PM, boomchacle said:

Could you send me a link? I've been trying to find another stock one since I started this but I was unable to.

The only other stock synchrocopter I know is the one I made in 2017. Maybe it's the one Azimech was talking about ? https://kerbalx.com/jfrouleau/Synchropter-Demo
Great job on your synchronization gears, it's not easy to get them to rotate fast enough to fly without invoking the kraken.

[Aphobius]

Helicopter that I've made. I'm not very happy with the new blades, they do strange stuff.

[HafCoJoe]

10 hours ago, Aphobius said:

Helicopter that I've made. I'm not very happy with the new blades, they do strange stuff.

Another thing to note, I found that a few of the new robotics parts have badly placed nodes... either that or they have badly placed textures but the nodes are fine. The small blue servo in particular is atrocious if you use it in symmetry, and the new R7000 turboshaft is not only misaligned in translation, but its twisted too. Here's a link to a moment on twitch to show it. Here's a second clip where I have the realization its the R7000 and not the other parts.

Edited July 23, 2019 by Avera9eJoe

[klond]

On 7/10/2019 at 11:54 PM, boomchacle said:

On 7/10/2019 at 1:56 PM, qzgy said:

Not 100 percent sure but this might be what Azimech is talking about https://kerbalx.com/klond/supersonic-helicopter

I don't believe that that's a synchrocopter though

No, it is not.  The blades are horizontal and do not interfere, one offset above the other in a way that could only work here.

 

On 7/11/2019 at 2:29 PM, Avera9eJoe said:

has anyone tried turning a hinge via engine exhaust?

 Yes and it's frikken amazing!  No need to separate from parent craft either.  I updated the One Juno Turboprop on v1.7.1, right before propeller blades came out.

 If you use a rotor as a bearing you get a free RPM meter on right-click.  It'll help you tune props when flying.  There's also far less reactionary torque vs a rotor-motor so you don't need contra-rotation to have a usable machine.  Good stuff.

 I thought I could use a powered rotor-bearing as WEP, but in my case it hurt more than helped.

[Aratoop]

Hi! First time posting but I've long been a lurker of this thread. The introduction of the rotor parts allowed me to try my hand at reinventing the wheel to make something a bit worse, and I compiled a few screenshots of my efforts into this album (warning, all of the planes look terribly ugly).

https://imgur.com/a/HmmU5k5

The main problem I've encountered is that in shying from actually learning how to make a bearing that works I've subsequently limited the maximum length of the shaft before it starts to oscillate around in an unstable way till it starts to rotate in an entirely different plane (if the shaft droops too much and then droops more when rotating it gets pushed by the engines). I've tried making a crude bearing of sorts after the turbine section by using landing gear and a structural ring, but I've not found it to help in any case (even with having made sure the gear have "same vessel interaction" switched on). Here is an example of the kind of thing I have tried

Spoiler

Has anyone got any advice? Thanks

Also: That's an awesomely small plane klond! How did it handle?

[boomchacle]

2 hours ago, Aratoop said:

Hi! First time posting but I've long been a lurker of this thread. The introduction of the rotor parts allowed me to try my hand at reinventing the wheel to make something a bit worse, and I compiled a few screenshots of my efforts into this album (warning, all of the planes look terribly ugly).

https://imgur.com/a/HmmU5k5

The main problem I've encountered is that in shying from actually learning how to make a bearing that works I've subsequently limited the maximum length of the shaft before it starts to oscillate around in an unstable way till it starts to rotate in an entirely different plane (if the shaft droops too much and then droops more when rotating it gets pushed by the engines). I've tried making a crude bearing of sorts after the turbine section by using landing gear and a structural ring, but I've not found it to help in any case (even with having made sure the gear have "same vessel interaction" switched on). Here is an example of the kind of thing I have tried

  Reveal hidden contents

Has anyone got any advice? Thanks

Also: That's an awesomely small plane klond! How did it handle?

I've got a bit of advice. There's no reason to have the air intakes facing outwards, as an air intake facing forwards gets more air in it, and it also reduces the size of the engine to not have those with the engine itself. You can translate the jet engines outwards so you don't need to have struts directly connected to them, or you could translate them into the struts, whatever you prefer, as it'll make them more compact. Using DLC parts for spinning is actually less stable than legacy bearings, and legacy bearings are considered "better" for performance if you dont care about the extra part count, as they're lighter and can achieve ridiculous rpms, but if you dont want to do that, you wont have to.