polkinghornbd

Have Parachutes Changed?

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I've been doing a stockish career mode, and I've been finding that putting <5 parachutes on my basic capsule, materials, and goo setup always ends up just destroying anything on the bottom of the craft, because I'm falling at about 15 m/s.  Was there any change to parachutes I didn't notice, or am I just messing something up?

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Depends on what parachutes you're using, some are incredibly weak, with others being quite strong.  Parachutes like the Mk2-R Radial Mount Parachute are pretty good.  It also depends on what kind of capsule you use.  I assume you're using the Mk16 parachute, which is a bit weaker, I wouldn't recommend it using it. 

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I find that 1 parachute works fine for a basic command pod, and 2 works for a command pod and all science, so long as I don't land on the Science Jr. That thing has a crash tolerance of about -80.

One trick: flip your last decoupler around so it stays stuck to your pod. Those things can hit pretty hard and stay alive.

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i think the "safe speed" of the parachutes was changed recently. i'm pretty sure the indicator went from yellow to grey around 260 m/s in the 1.05 version. now in 1.1 the safe speed seems to be somewhere around 350 m/s.

didn't notice that they are weaker than before, though. there is a min altitude slider in the setup of the chutes which can be tweaked to control when the chute goes from partially deployed to fully deployed. maybe the setting is messed up and the chutes are only partially deployed or the full open happens too late to properly slow the capsule down?

also - it's often a good idea to have a service bay at the bottom of a return capsule. those things are almost indestructible. their heat tolerance is almost on par with a heatshield and the crash tolerance is better than most landing gears. and you can pack small delicate things like expensive science sensors, batteries and probe cores in there to shield them from all sorts of environmental dangers.

 

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1 hour ago, mk1980 said:

also - it's often a good idea to have a service bay at the bottom of a return capsule. those things are almost indestructible. their heat tolerance is almost on par with a heatshield and the crash tolerance is better than most landing gears. and you can pack small delicate things like expensive science sensors, batteries and probe cores in there to shield them from all sorts of environmental dangers.

I've found another interesting use for them, my current rescue/tourism pod setup has, from the bottom up: Mk1 capsule, HECS, 1 or 2 Mk1 crew cabins and a service bay with drogues and radial chutes inside.  The service bag is nice and light and I'm not sure if it's just the added surface area or if the doors open act like fins but it's beautifully stable in re-rentry, and if I set the chutes up properly (I think I've got the drogues deploying at 0.6 and 0.65 and the main chute at 0.75) I can stage them before re-entry and therefore not need any of my own crew on board despite using RemoteTech and not being in control of the craft on re-renty.

The chutes however seem a lot better than in 1.05, I can open them way higher and the above stack can land safely with just one drogue and one radial chute (the second drogue is a backup in case I get the altitude/speed wrong)

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I haven't noticed any problems with the 'chutes in 1.1.2. In fact, they seem a lot better now. A single Mk.1 'chute was adequate for me to land a Mk.1 pod, Science Jr, 2 goo experiments, and thermometer.

If you're using 5 chutes and still coming down at 15 m/sec, I think there's something wrong at your end. Maybe one of your mods has altered the aerodynamics or you're using drogue chutes instead of mains?

Best,
-Slashy

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2 hours ago, mk1980 said:

i think the "safe speed" of the parachutes was changed recently. i'm pretty sure the indicator went from yellow to grey around 260 m/s in the 1.05 version. now in 1.1 the safe speed seems to be somewhere around 350 m/s.

didn't notice that they are weaker than before, though. there is a min altitude slider in the setup of the chutes which can be tweaked to control when the chute goes from partially deployed to fully deployed. maybe the setting is messed up and the chutes are only partially deployed or the full open happens too late to properly slow the capsule down?

also - it's often a good idea to have a service bay at the bottom of a return capsule. those things are almost indestructible. their heat tolerance is almost on par with a heatshield and the crash tolerance is better than most landing gears. and you can pack small delicate things like expensive science sensors, batteries and probe cores in there to shield them from all sorts of environmental dangers.

 

I agree, I find that the safe speed are a bit higher. For now I've only tested Kerbin SOI returns, I'm not in interplanetary yet.

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I am sure the min altitude slider is at 1 km, and my first craft had a mk1 pod, the little SRB, and three starter parachutes, and my SRB still blew up.  I don't think I have any atmospheric mods, but I'll check when I get home.

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In stock, each parachute is good for about 4 tons on Kerbin. Using that number should bring you in at (just) under 10 m/s. I agree with Slashy -- if you need five chutes, you are either bringing in something very heavy, or your mods have drastically changed your aero properties.

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So I looked in my GameData folder, and all I have is Final Frontier, a mod that gives Kerbals ribbons for achievements, X Science, and KER.  I have no other mods installed.  I seem to be flying normally with no other problems in flight.

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5 hours ago, polkinghornbd said:

I am sure the min altitude slider is at 1 km, and my first craft had a mk1 pod, the little SRB, and three starter parachutes, and my SRB still blew up.  I don't think I have any atmospheric mods, but I'll check when I get home.

Are you sure you're not using drogue parachutes here rather than Mk16 Radial chutes? Drogues won't slow you down nearly as much as a full-sized chute. 

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What do the aerodynamic indicator lines look like with the parachutes deployed?

It should show a huge amount of drag from the parachutes, but maybe something's not working right there, maybe the aero system thinks the four on the wings are occluded?

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Looks like since you're landing a whole aircraft with parachutes, the plane's aerodynamics will also factor in how fast you descend. Try to use the cabin's tourque to set it level, that should slow it down more. If that's too hard to do, try turning the nose down and pitching up. Doing that will turn some vertical velocity into horizontal velocity.

Edited by Yellowburn10

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2 minutes ago, Yellowburn10 said:

Looks like since you're landing a whole aircraft with parachutes, the plane's aerodynamics will also factor in how fast you descend. Try to use the cabin's tourque to set it level, that should slow it down more. If that's too hard to do, try turning the nose down and pitching up. Doing that will turn some vertical velocity into horizontal velocity.

It's not only the plane, though.  With the first available stock craft with no other unlocks, it is visible down below.

 

I still end up hitting the ground and destroying the SRB on the bottom.

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I tried to make your plane in the SPH but got mad at the wheels (again) so gave up. I tried to make it launch from launch clamps but it never got enough speed from decoupling them to get positive lift before crashing into the ground.

I alt-f4'd the game before thinking I cold have just dropped it from high launch clamps with the chutes engaged, and now I can't be bothered to go back in. But I wanted you to know I tried.

EDIT: For the capsule with SRB, I know there's something wrong with your game. I'd backup all your saves, wipe, and reinstall from scratch. If a pure stock game still does it after that, open a bug report on Squad's bug tracker.

Edited by 5thHorseman

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1 minute ago, polkinghornbd said:

Question. How did you install KSP? Steam?

 

When you installed it, did you upgrade from an older KSP version with some type of updater? Or did you download it fresh as 1.1?

Edited by OddFunction

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18 hours ago, 5thHorseman said:

 

EDIT: For the capsule with SRB, I know there's something wrong with your game. I'd backup all your saves, wipe, and reinstall from scratch. If a pure stock game still does it after that, open a bug report on Squad's bug tracker.

How would I reinstall through Steam?

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1 hour ago, polkinghornbd said:

How would I reinstall through Steam?

Back up your saves, then uninstall the game (Delete local content) and then install. Then copy your saves back if Steam deleted them (I'm not sure if it would but I suspect it will)

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7 hours ago, 5thHorseman said:

Back up your saves, then uninstall the game (Delete local content) and then install. Then copy your saves back if Steam deleted them (I'm not sure if it would but I suspect it will)

Steam not only saved my saves, it saved my mods, too.  Is there any other way to get it?

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