Personal "Drones" (Multi-Rotors)

[Slam_Jones]

So I just got my first Quadcopter-style drone (NewEgg Link here) and have so far been quite entertained with it.  It's not a fancy one, by any means, but so far I've been enjoying it... and I haven't even gotten to using the camera yet!

I was actually a bit surprised at how small it is, honestly.  It does seem to get affected quite heavily by wind (even though I've only used it inside so far), but maybe that's just something a newbie drone operator has to deal with?  Also since the charge time is approx 130 minutes for approx 5.5 minutes of flight time, would folks recommend I get several (larger size) batteries and swap them out?  Or is it dangerous/damaging to pop batteries in and out right after each other?

Does anyone else on these forums own or operate a personal drone?  Any tips or tricks for a newbie?    (I have heard the DJI series is the best for high-level drones... how much experience should one have before investing in something like that?)

(Oh, and let's try not to make this political or anything, please! )

 

 

Edit: As pointed out below, it is only a drone if it is capable of autonomous operation.  So technically I'm talking about Multi-Rotors here

Edited December 17, 2016 by Slam_Jones

[Fluburtur]

Im on a discord group about rc stuff, we can discuss there because knowing myself, it will get pretty long

https://discord.gg/hm6XWEF

im quite enthusiastic on the subject.

I fly a lot of rc planes and my couz has pretty much the same quad you have, it's basic but works well

[Slam_Jones]

Just now, Fluburtur said:

Im on a discord group about rc stuff, we can discuss there because knowing myself, it will get pretty long

https://discord.gg/hm6XWEF

im quite enthusiastic on the subject.

I fly a lot of rc planes and my couz has pretty much the same quad you have, it's basic but works well

Awesome stuff!  I'll have to get my mic working and hop in there once I get home

I'm pretty excited about getting into this field, too, so it should be a good time I think

[Shadowmage]

Just a technical note --

The term 'drone' implies that it can fly by itself autonomously, for at least a portion of its flight duration.  This usually would include takeoff, landing, and general navigation, and can also imply some manner of autonomous avoidance and self-correction routines.  ( https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/guest-blog/what-is-a-drone-anyway/ ) ( http://www.dictionary.com/browse/drone )   Flying actual drones (fully autonomous vehicles), at least where I'm at (US) requires special licensing and oversight, not easily attainable by hobbyists.

Most quad-copters are not, in fact, drones.  What you link is almost certainly not a drone (unless you've put an autopilot controller in there somewhere; very hard to do with Syma stuff).

Sorry for the pedantry, but terminology can be extremely important when conversing with other people familiar with the subject matter.

Background:  I'm a pretty big RC aviation buff; helicopters, quadcopters, fixed-wing (airplanes); sizes ranging from sub-micro/nano, up to 6ft wingspan and weighing a few pounds.  Collective pitch, fixed pitch, multi-engine, have a good collection of all of them.  None however are drones by the technical definition; all require pilot input for takeoff, maneuvers, and landing (though some have auto-stability features, they cannot fly themselves).

 

Anyway -- safe flying    It can be a very fun and rewarding hobby (even if crashes can sometimes be a bit expensive).

[Camacha]

29 minutes ago, Slam_Jones said:

Also since the charge time is approx 130 minutes for approx 5.5 minutes of flight time, would folks recommend I get several (larger size) batteries and swap them out?  Or is it dangerous/damaging to pop batteries in and out right after each other?

Changing batteries is necessary if you are slightly more serious about flying. Changing them should not be an issue. However, the fact that your drone likely has brushed motors might be an issue. Those wear out sooner or later and are more prone to damage when a motor is blocked by the ground or an object. If your motors give you trouble or your drone tends to pull to one side, one or more motors might need replacement.

Also make sure you have spare parts, especially props. Crashing and not being able to fly any more is frustrating.

 

10 minutes ago, Shadowmage said:

Most quad-copters are not, in fact, drones.  What you link is almost certainly not a drone (unless you've put an autopilot controller in there somewhere; very hard to do with Syma stuff).

Sorry for the pedantry, but terminology can be extremely important when conversing with other people familiar with the subject matter.

Unfortunately, drones and multicopters have become synonymous. Like it or not and incorrect or not, it seems it is here to stay.

Edited December 7, 2016 by Camacha

[Slam_Jones]

19 minutes ago, Shadowmage said:

Just a technical note --

The term 'drone' implies that it can fly by itself autonomously, for at least a portion of its flight duration.  This usually would include takeoff, landing, and general navigation, and can also imply some manner of autonomous avoidance and self-correction routines.  ( https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/guest-blog/what-is-a-drone-anyway/ ) ( http://www.dictionary.com/browse/drone )   Flying actual drones (fully autonomous vehicles), at least where I'm at (US) requires special licensing and oversight, not easily attainable by hobbyists.

Most quad-copters are not, in fact, drones.  What you link is almost certainly not a drone (unless you've put an autopilot controller in there somewhere; very hard to do with Syma stuff).

Sorry for the pedantry, but terminology can be extremely important when conversing with other people familiar with the subject matter.

-snip-

No worries at all!  I expect nothing less from the KSP Forums   So you are correct that it's not a drone, then, in the technical sense.  (Title and OP updated to reflect this)

I have seen the term 'drone' used a lot for quad-copters frequently as Camacha has noted... but is there another simple term that can be used to refer to them?  'Quad-Copter' is a bit verbose, at least compared to 'drone.'

The package I got came with a spare set of blades and some other minor spare parts, so it shouldn't be an issue I think.  Besides I only spent like $30 on it   If I break it, it's not the end of the world   Which is the main reason I jumped for this one... I've wanted to get into this hobby for a while, but couldn't really surmount the paywall.

Edited December 7, 2016 by Slam_Jones

[Camacha]

1 minute ago, Slam_Jones said:

No worries at all!  I expect nothing less from the KSP Forums   So you are correct that it's not a drone, then, in the technical sense.

I have seen the term 'drone' used a lot for quad-copters frequently as Camacha has noted... but is there another simple term that can be used to refer to them?  'Quad-Copter' is a bit verbose, at least compared to 'drone.'

Quadcopter or multicopter (as many have more rotors than four) seem to be the term. No need for CapiTalisation or other-stuff It is slightly more verbose, but not all words need to be one syllable. Some people use quad if it is obvious quadcopters are the subject, though I personally feel that is a bit lazy.

1 minute ago, Slam_Jones said:

The package I got came with a spare set of blades and some other minor spare parts, so it shouldn't be an issue I think.  Besides I only spent like $30 on it   If I break it, it's not the end of the world   Which is the main reason I jumped for this one... I've wanted to get into this hobby for a while, but couldn't really surmount the paywall.

The benefit of more expensive drones is that it is much easier to replace one part, rather than the whole thing. They are a lot more durable too.

[Slam_Jones]

Just now, Camacha said:

Quadcopter or multicopter (as many have more rotors than four) seem to be the term. No need for CapiTalisation or other-stuff It is slightly more verbose, but not all words need to be one syllable. Some people use quad if it is obvious quadcopters are the subject, though I personally feel that is a bit lazy.

The benefit of more expensive drones is that it is much easier to replace one part, rather than the whole thing. They are a lot more durable too.

Hehe I blame the random capitalization on having taken a few German classes (they sure love their capitalization and compound words!)

Also, good to know about the terminology.  Now I won't sounds like as much of a total noob

And assuming I enjoy this investment and endeavor to continue it as a hobby, I'll start looking into more expensive ones    For now, $30 is perfect for me

[Camacha]

Just now, Slam_Jones said:

And assuming I enjoy this investment and endeavor to continue it as a hobby, I'll start looking into more expensive ones    For now, $30 is perfect for me

If you enjoy the hobby, consider building one yourself. Things are easy to put together if you do your homework and buy parts that go together. You will be able to spread the costs and you will be able to fix anything that breaks, because you know how everything works Granted, you will spend a little more than $30, but with the cheap parts on the internet nowadays, it will not cost you an arm and a leg either.

Starting with a cheap drone that you can throw about and crash is actually a very good idea. You need to learn by crashing the thing a couple of times and doing that with an expensive drone you poured your heart in is no fun. When you learn the basics and some proper control, going to something bigger is much easier and less expensive.

[Slam_Jones]

5 minutes ago, Camacha said:

If you enjoy the hobby, consider building one yourself. Things are easy to put together if you do your homework and buy parts that go together. You will be able to spread the costs and you will be able to fix anything that breaks, because you know how everything works Granted, you will spend a little more than $30, but with the cheap parts on the internet nowadays, it will not cost you an arm and a leg either.

Starting with a cheap drone that you can throw about and crash is actually a very good idea. You need to learn by crashing the thing a couple of times and doing that with an expensive drone you poured your heart in is no fun. When you learn the basics and some proper control, going to something bigger is much easier and less expensive.

As KSP has taught me, the best way to figure out how to do something is to just try it until you get it (time/money constraints notwithstanding).  Like you said, each crash teaches me a little more about how to use it correctly

Great idea about building one on my own!  I learned how to put computers together in the same way (order parts I want and give it a shot... after reading 100 tutorials ) so I think building multicopters would be quite a cool and fun hobby alongside flying them

Edited December 7, 2016 by Slam_Jones

[Fluburtur]

The word "drone" has gotten a very bad connotation because of the mainstream media so I never use it and explain to peoples to avoid it as much as possible.

Most flight controllers can support autonomous flying (but you still need to tell them what to do before and you need to keep radio contact with them)

 

[Slam_Jones]

8 hours ago, Fluburtur said:

The word "drone" has gotten a very bad connotation because of the mainstream media so I never use it and explain to peoples to avoid it as much as possible.

Most flight controllers can support autonomous flying (but you still need to tell them what to do before and you need to keep radio contact with them)

 

In most legal texts I've seen them referred to as "drones."  (IE "No Drone Zone" signage, with a picture of a multi-rotor, etc)  Personally, if I'm talking to someone that's not super knowledgeable on the subject (family and friends) I'll call it a "drone" for easyness sake.  Even after explaining to my buddy the difference between a drone and a multi-rotor, he still called it a drone (I assume because it's easy to say and remember).  But if I'm talking to people who know what they're on about (KSP forums in general ) then I need to use the right term.

I've gotten a bit better at handling it too.  Haven't taken it outside yet, but maybe soon if I can keep it under control   (Plus my work is right next to a 6-lane highway, so yeahhh gotta be careful lol)

[Wjolcz]

I have this one: http://www.banggood.com/FQ777-124-Pocket-Drone-4CH-6Axis-Gyro-Quadcopter-With-Switchable-Controller-RTF-p-977881.html

It's packaging is also the controller. Really fun to fly around the flat. A bit problematic outside when there are strong winds, but it also has the 'ultra-whatever' control mode where it turns a lot faster. Can fly for about 5-7 minutes and it isn't that expenesive. Have to repair it though because during a flip one of the cables snapped. It's nothing severe though.

Edited December 10, 2016 by Veeltch

[Slam_Jones]

Here's a question you guys can probably answer:

Why do most quad-copters take on a X-shape?   Would an H-shape not be more efficient and possibly use less materials?  Or is the X-shape more efficient for some reason?

[LN400]

X vs H: I'd think an X shape means less material giving a lighter/cheaper aircraft. There are H shaped quads though. One on the news here is designed for heavy lifting (100 kg up to 500 kg per developement plan). For heavy lifting, an H shape could give a sturdier frame.

[Camacha]

On 15/12/2016 at 8:38 PM, Slam_Jones said:

Here's a question you guys can probably answer:

Why do most quad-copters take on a X-shape?   Would an H-shape not be more efficient and possibly use less materials?  Or is the X-shape more efficient for some reason?

Why do you think the H uses less material?

[Shpaget]

Occasionally, I shoot wedding and corporate videos and the company I gig for has DJI Phantom 4 (and used Phantom 3 previously).

Couple of months ago we were shooting windmills and the wind was quite strong, so strong in fact that we were a bit anxious to tak of with the Phantom 4. Long story short and a few extra steps back in case of a crash we took off. The drone shot up and stayed hovering about 3 m off the ground in such a strong crosswind that the drone had to keep about 10-15° angle just to keep still and compensate. The video from it was as smooth as it gets, though.

The station keeping was completely automatic. Quite amazing actually what modern electronics can achieve in such a small package and for relatively small cost. Just a few years ago, such stability was not possible without huge and heavy gyros, stuff bordering on military tech. Cameras small enough to be flown on RC planes and copters were poor quality and gimbals had no stabilisation, making the video all shaky and next to useless.

As for drone vs quadcopter/multirotor, for me a drone is at least partially autonomous, regardless of the configuration. It can be a plane, a helicopter, quadcopter or a submarine, it doesn't matter.
Quadcopter is a flying device that uses four propellers to generate lift. It can be a drone, but it doesn't have to. The truth is that most quadcopters, even the cheap Chinese ones, have some degree of automation, even if only for stability or flip tricks.

On another, completely unrelated note, I just accidentally discovered/realized that if you press Ctrl + left/right arrow key, the cursor jumps to the beginning/end of the previous/next word. Amazing!

[Camacha]

6 hours ago, Shpaget said:

As for drone vs quadcopter/multirotor, for me a drone is at least partially autonomous, regardless of the configuration.

Define autonomous Quad copters are possible due to advances in controller technology. The pilot pretty much just indicates an intention or direction, the vehicle figures out how to do that exactly. Being off balance is generally not a huge issue for a well tuned craft, the vehicle will cope. Even staying in the air requires hundreds or even thousands of adjustments made by the craft itself.

Quote

On another, completely unrelated note, I just accidentally discovered/realized that if you press Ctrl + left/right arrow key, the cursor jumps to the beginning/end of the previous/next word. Amazing!

I could not live without it. You can combine it with shift to select words too, and some other well known keys or combinations. One of those things you never knew you needed, until it is all you ever wanted.

 

Edited December 17, 2016 by Camacha

[stellargeli]

On 12/7/2016 at 4:36 PM, Slam_Jones said:

 

 

Edit: As pointed out below, it is only a drone if it is capable of autonomous operation.  So technically I'm talking about Quad-Copters here

Technically, you are talking about quad-rotors, quad-copter is a misnomer term since there is nothing "copter" about quad-rotors.

[Camacha]

3 hours ago, stellargeli said:

Technically, you are talking about quad-rotors, quad-copter is a misnomer term since there is nothing "copter" about quad-rotors.

The word helicopter comes from ancient Greek; hélix meaning spiral, and pterón meaning wing. Both are fully applicable to either a quadcopter, multirotor or multicopter. Unless, of course, you mean that actual spirals are not involved, but that applies to any and all remotely modern helicopters. I would (re)interpret it as the wings making spiral movements.

[Wjolcz]

I thought this thread was about unmanned flying machines, not semantics.

[Vanamonde]

Yes, let's talk about little flying things you pilot without being in them at the time. 

[Wjolcz]

And my FQ777 is back in action thanks to my skilled grandpa! It was a task for a true clockmaker.

[TheEpicSquared]

Looks like I'm a bit late to the party () but not late enough to be necro-ing ()!

Is the Cheerson CX-32S a good quadcopter? I'm thinking of buying it, and I want to be sure that it's a good quad (particularly the camera and First Person View, and I've heard that the camera quality is very good). Can anyone help?

Thanks!  

[Slam_Jones]

On 1/10/2017 at 4:14 AM, TheEpicSquared said:

Looks like I'm a bit late to the party () but not late enough to be necro-ing ()!

Is the Cheerson CX-32S a good quadcopter? I'm thinking of buying it, and I want to be sure that it's a good quad (particularly the camera and First Person View, and I've heard that the camera quality is very good). Can anyone help?

Thanks!  

Looks like its got a 5.8gHZ transmitter for the FPV, which is ideal if you want minimal lag.  Looks like it's not stupidly expensive either, which (to a novice like me, at least) looks like a good deal.

Ordered an FPV camera for my Syma X5SC (2.4gHZ Wifi) and until it arrives I've been trying some indoor flying.

I'm getting better, but still decidedly noob-y at the whole thing.  Regardless, here's one of my better runs around the house...