totm dec 2019 Russian Launch and Mission Thread

[tater]

 

[Kulebron]

9 hours ago, DDE said:

Well, they might as well go after Russian Railways. Or shoot themselves in the head - same difference. The current course with regards to the space industry is towards a system of government-owned monopolies and monopsonies.

Things change over time. Not quickly, but they do.
1) We have society that learns to act collectively and pursue common interest or social interest. In mid-00's people were expecting to get into business or bureaucracy and earn money alone or with close friends. Now, there's a whole new  culture of collective action, unthinkable back in 2005.

2) More transparency and exposure thanks to internet make people make their minds and act. In 90s or 00s there was less transparency and less action: people would only have become cynic about exposed corruption cases back then. 

3) The generation of current government is not going to last forever. Rogozin belongs to the generation of the most soviet people ever brought up with their special traits (sociologist Levada has pointed out them: distrust to society and institutions, relying on friends and relatives, but conformism in public, and I'd add cynicism). All these are going away according to sociology studies, even in older generations.

4) All together, with social psychology changes, this will lead to big changes. Anthropologist Alexei Yurchak has show a similar phoenomenon in 1980s, when up until 1990-91 USSR seemed eternal to us inside.

I guess, I don't need to explain this to you, you must be well informed here of this, but hope this for our foreign readers this might be interesting.

[Kulebron]

More on topic, I think the recent failures with the booster and the hole in the spacecraft show one thing: the personell that does the actual manual job is overworked AND is stimulated to conceive mistakes. This is absolutely a management failure.

In aviation, CRM that has been saving our lifes for 3 decades, clearly states that reporting own mistakes (especially those that can be quickly corrected) must be not penalized. Otherwise, issues tend to accumulate or fire later, in much more dangerous way. 

[DDE]

3 hours ago, Kulebron said:

1) We have society that learns to act collectively and pursue common interest or social interest. In mid-00's people were expecting to get into business or bureaucracy and earn money alone or with close friends. Now, there's a whole new  culture of collective action, unthinkable back in 2005.

Problem is, this cuts both ways.

https://www.opendemocracy.net/od-russia/mikhail-kaluzhsky/you-wanted-civil-society-well-now-you-ve-got-it

[kerbiloid]

That's why the direct democracy is almost never used. Only representative democracy is viable.

[DDE]

Back on topic, whetever Roscosmos has decided in regards to the superheavy, they promise to reveal it “early 2019”.

https://ria.ru/20181219/1548237011.html

You may notice that the article is rather... short. They’re migrating the site or something.

[kerbiloid]

The Presidium of Sci-Tech Council of Roscosmos has approved the draft concept of the heavy rocket.

Stage #1 - from Soyuz-5.

Stage #2 - not mentioned.

Stage #3 - from Angara-5V.

The final version of the draft concept should be presented in the beginning of 2019.

https://translate.google.com.tr/translate?sl=ru&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=ru&ie=UTF-8&u=https://www.interfax.ru/russia/643048&edit-text=

[RedKraken]

Proton launch tomorrow : Blagovest No13L ?

[DDE]

26 minutes ago, RedKraken said:

Proton launch tomorrow : Blagovest No13L ?

Zak seems to think so.

I'm more interested whether they'll goof up with the Fregat on the 27th.

[RedKraken]

19 minutes ago, DDE said:

I'm more interested whether they'll goof up with the Fregat on the 27th.

“The rocket was really programmed as if it was taking off from Baikonur,”

I wonder why that did not trip an exception.....given location coordinates are not hard to access on a rockets GNC.

Does inertial nav not bootstrap itself against glasnost/gps?

Thinking about sensor/state data FUBAR lists for fault-tolerant rocket launch firmware.... but this should have shown up in a pre-launch test or even a simulator.

[RedKraken]

ISS soyuz undock 32min

 

[kerbiloid]

MS-09 has landed, the crew has been evacuated.

[DDE]

8 hours ago, RedKraken said:

Does inertial nav not bootstrap itself against glasnost/gps?

Thinking about sensor/state data FUBAR lists for fault-tolerant rocket launch firmware.... but this should have shown up in a pre-launch test or even a simulator.

Fregat predates Vostochnyi and thus the latitude requirement, and it was also designed at a time when the GLONASS constellation was quite depleted. Come to think of it, the recent Soyuz models are the eariest Soviet/Russian vehicles to use GLONASS, so it would be extremely unexpected for a stage slapped together from Soviet-era equipment to feature satnav.

Quote

glasnost

Giggity.

[sh1pman]

21 hours ago, kerbiloid said:

Stage #2 - not mentioned.

But that's the most interesting part, central core. Everything else we already knew.

[kerbiloid]

1 minute ago, sh1pman said:

But that's the most interesting part, central core. Everything else we already knew.

Probably, that's exactly the part they don't know themselves.
While nobody has objections about 1 and 3.

[DDE]

7 minutes ago, sh1pman said:

But that's the most interesting part, central core. Everything else we already knew.

Lower in that article it says that, to paraphrase, all components must be used in other operational systems. That largely excludes the “fatty”, the various RD-0120 core options.

Or they couldn’t just say that a part of the superheavy comes from Atlas V.

5 minutes ago, kerbiloid said:

Probably, that's exactly the part they don't know themselves.
While nobody has objections about 1 and 3.

They should know it by now. That was the point of the get-together.

5 minutes ago, kerbiloid said:

nobody has objections about 1 and 3.

The hydrolox upper stages have been a quagmire thus far. I’d have prepared to do without them.

Also missing are the prominently featured uppermost stages of the Impuls family - a hydrolox Block D and an oversized Fregat.

Edited December 20, 2018 by DDE

[sh1pman]

7 minutes ago, DDE said:

Or they couldn’t just say that a part of the superheavy comes from Atlas V.

In 2028 it'll be Vulcan with BE-4. Could be interesting to see this hybrid. 

[kerbiloid]

Spoiler

Got it. 
2nd stage is Proton

 

[DDE]

Just now, kerbiloid said:

  Hide contents

Got it. 
2nd stage is Proton

 

Aaand we’re back to basics!

Adding the second layer to the joke, not even Rogozin can make Khrunichev stop building that thing.

[kerbiloid]

Laughing or not, but in fact, everything significant in the Soviet crewed cosmonautics is Proton and its lego station modules.

Soyuz (both ship and rocket) is just a ferry boat used because it was already at hands while all Soyuz-including projects have failed.

Edited December 20, 2018 by kerbiloid

[DDE]

According to an article in Voenno-promyshlennyi Kurier, that little toothpick used to carve up MS-09 is standard-issue kit.

I am impressed. Forget the machete, it’s a proper dagger.

[kerbiloid]

A space scimitar (by purpose).

To grapple and board the attacking ship.

Edited December 20, 2018 by kerbiloid

[DDE]

Lest we forget, the middle member of the Kosmos-2519/2521/2523 constellation is maneuvering again.

https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=43064.320

[tater]

 

[DDE]

While we’re on a militarist note, I’m recanting all of my statements regarding Rudolph ASAT. A recent incident has convinced me that it’s just a mishearding of Nudol.

Said incident was Sberbank’s claim of 6 severe DDoS attacks involving spoofing. A number of second-tier Russian media proceeded to report that the attacks involved a sputnik. I only dug into the subject because certain hacking groups do use hijacked satellite internet, but obviously not for DDoS attacks (at least, not for the actual traffic).