The Sharing of the KSP game

[J_Man_X_663]

Hello,

i am just wondering in the new update coming out, .17 if someone could please put a secure file or something for the KSP game on mac. This is because one of my friends at school has bought the game and he is sending it to everyone else, all i want is the best for SQUAD. these guys work way to hard and i think they are loosing big money because of this. If you could adjust the file so that you cannot send it or copy it or something to prevent this,

Best regards

[Capt'n Skunky]

Your friend is no friend at all. HarvesteR and Squad have always maintained that there will never be any DRM in KSP as it only hurts paying customers and never stops pirates. Just remind your "friend" that by giving away copies of the game, he is only hurting the continued development of the game and taking money from the few actual employees that work on KSP. There is no large publishing house that's losing money from the loss of sale, instead it's coming directly out of the pockets of the few people they have working on the game.

I suggest you also find new friends.

Cheers!

Capt'n Skunky

KSP Community Manager

[FCC]

DRM doesn't help games. A small group like Squad simply doesn't have the time or money to waste only to hear some pirates cracked it hours after release. At least he bought his own copy and is spreading the KSP name. Eventually the friends who are just copying it might just gain enough interest to go ahead and purchase their own key. In the end he may be "hurting" the devs, but the poeple who aren't paying may have not paid anyways but will at least talk about the game to their friends.

[segaprophet]

I used to pirate apps/games when I was younger, then I grew up.

Any software which you use frequently and enjoy is worth the cost of a license, especially if it's from a small independent developer.

[Vanamonde]

never be any DRM in KSP as it only hurts paying customers and never stops pirates

Why do so many game companies fail to acknowledge this PAINFULLY OBVIOUS point? Hackers just see the protections as challenges to their skills, while legitimate purchasers have to work around the inconvenience and glitches that arise when you make software more complex than it needs to be to get the job done. I can't tell you how refreshing it is to hear someone being SANE about this!

[Nikolai]

legitimate purchasers have to work around the inconvenience and glitches that arise when you make software more complex than it needs to be

So much this. When you operate on a business model that makes an illegally-gained product superior to the product you have to pay money for (because you don't need to type in nuclear launch codes or keep the DVD in the drive or whatever), you've set yourself up for failure.

Personally, I wish the transaction were simple. I don't want to be a jerk; here, I'll give you my money if you give me your game. Done and done. But as long as we continue to treat piracy as if it is a technological problem and not a social one, I fear software companies are going to continue to waste piles of money on protection schemes that are cracked in a very short time and only serve to drive up the price of their final product.

Long story short: Thanks for the no-DRM. I won't betray your trust.

[EndlessWaves]

DRM is generally for the situation the OP describes, to stop people casually duplicating the game. Companies don't generally expect it to stop people determined to crack it, they're just trying to prevent the above and dodgy dealers burning copies to sell from the back of a van. Some companies have been known to go too far and chose DRM that's far too visible to the user *coughsteamcough* but in general it's not a bad thing and it's up to a company to decide whether it makes sense for them based on how likely it is to restrict awareness of the game and the extra support costs against how many extra sales it might deliver.

[sal_vager]

Guys, Squad are not going to implement DRM, HarvesteR has issues with it, about the most DRM KSP will likely ever have will be when it is released on Steam, but that wont affect the Squad store version.

[Nikolai]

Companies don't generally expect it to stop people determined to crack it

It's hard to tell how much of the general opinion among companies this represents, but I can recall various companies touting their latest DRM scheme as hacker-proof. Nolan Bushnell of Atari back in 2008 (at the link below), the designers of SecuROM, the designers of the Sony UCD, and several others. Every once in a while, some CEO will come out and announce the imminent end of software piracy. Some companies clearly do expect DRM to stop piracy in its tracks.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/84079-Atari-Founder-PC-Piracy-About-to-be-Eradicated

From a technical standpoint, of course, claims like these are ridiculous, because software manufacturers can't wrest control of the end-user's machine. In the meantime, large amounts of money are spent (an article estimated $1 billion in 2007 and $9 billion in 2012; I don't know where to get accurate and more current numbers, but even a tenth of that seems disproportionate to the problem) that do nothing but jack up the price for legitimate customers.

http://www.defectivebydesign.org/blog/964

I expect that we'd be closer to getting piracy to stop (though I doubt we'll ever stop it completely) if we could shift our view from seeing companies as some faceless entity (so that it can be justified as "not really stealing"). From that point of view, I'm grateful for the willingness the devs have had to poke in here from time to time to say something, or to write an entry in their dev blogs. I think it makes them look more human to the end-user. But I'm not a sociologist of any stripe, so take my musings with a planet-sized grain of salt.

EDIT: The report on DRM spending the blog post above seems to have gotten its information from is "Wireline and Wireless Digital Rights Management: Securing Content Distribution 2007-2012", published by Insight Research.

http://www.insight-corp.com/reports/WWD.asp

Edited August 29, 2012 by Nikolai
Misspellings, better references

[CaptRobau]

I've always seen piracy more of a reaction to the user-unfriendliness of companies/games (ie. bad ports, draconian DRM, over-priced, etc.). Companies who seem to be doing well in terms of piracy are the ones with good support, reasonable price, no invasive DRM. Squad/KSP are both very user-friendly. DRM would only work against the game.

Edited August 29, 2012 by CaptRobau

[Master]

There are probably no loss of sales in this situation as those kids who are sharing a copy probably would have never bought the copy themselves anyways (probably don't have extra money for stuff like that, I know I didnt when I was in school).

[OdinYggd]

Of the different DRM types out there, the only ones I have seen to be even close to effective are Steam, and the login server approach used by Minecraft.

But even they are not perfect, I've heard of people successfully pirating Skyrim for instance and Minecraft's login system is easily bypassed.

KSP might be okay with a login type system similar to Minecraft, as it is casual enough that it discourages blatant copying, while not being inconvenient to the end user either as long as they remember their info.

Such a feature might go well if KSP ever does get a SMP mode, because as the admin of a minecraft server I can tell you that the central login system has a huge effect in controlling abuses. Kids upset about being banned aren't going to pay for another account just to abuse the admin some more, they'll throw in the towel and shop somewhere else. Again its not perfect though, particularly when exploits exist that let people crack account passwords and then use the hacked accounts in an abusive manner.

But that's as close as I dare go to actual DRM, anything more than that either is horribly inconvenient to deal with or blatantly ineffective at controlling piracy.

[SkyHook]

Why would you ri off squad, a small company? The price of 15 is WELL worth the enjoyment that I get out of the game. We get free content updates, and all the extra parts that you could ask for ABSOLUTELY FREE. Why would I even think to pirate? I believe in products that are worth their weight in gold, and KSP is one of them.

[air805ronin]

Tell your friend to give out copies of the demo and pimp his friends on buying the full version. Just saying.

Or get new friends. I would have bought KSP with my monthly allowance as a kid.

[samstarman5]

The CEO of Ubisoft is another example of why your argument is weak, and quite possibly the best as he recently spoke up again for his company's draconian DRM and all the so-called good it has done. Except it doesn't do any good, as it is still able to be circumnavigated and hackers probably have a cookie cutter code made by now for each new release from Ubisoft that includes the DRM. The other bit being the obvious expense for the online servers that probably cuts into the developers and other lower employees' salaries.

The only good DRM is absent DRM. The best you get is the likes of Steam or the one-time registration requirement with zero limit on downloads or installs. But even then the obvious speedbumps in those can provide a hindrance on many a player with questionable online connections. True, Steam can operate offline, but that is only when an update or synchronization isn't required. But those are rare most of the time.

The best defense is making a game that encourages people to want to invest in it. Those same people should feel the desire to tell anyone they know who have pirated the game that they best get their act together. Regardless of any on-going arguments, software piracy is a crime, which can be prosecuted in criminal court, although it is more likely to be done in civil court, where the penalty can end up being much more expensive. Ask your friend if the cost of lawyer's fees, court fees, and judgments is worth the risk at pirating a game that can end up more so bug-riddled or even virus-riddled than a legitimate copy as to render his PC an expensive paper-weight.

[Dizzle]

I really doubt Squad is going to lose out based on this. If someone is sharing the game, I doubt they'd bother to update the game for each person every time a new one comes out. That said, I'm glad Squad isn't going the DRM route. I personally don't pirate indie games, and I have to wonder why one would pirate a game that is still in development. Considering how, you know, widespread pirating would mean YOU DON'T EVEN GET A FINISHED PRODUCT.

[samstarman5]

There are probably no loss of sales in this situation as those kids who are sharing a copy probably would have never bought the copy themselves anyways (probably don't have extra money for stuff like that, I know I didnt when I was in school).

That's one of the prime attitudes that supports piracy. I have to question how kids who can afford smartphones, Xboxes, and what other kinds of gadgets can complain they can't afford a $15-$20 game that is also available in a free complete demo version. There are plenty of places out there that will pay actual cash for used console games instead of store credit. That is one easy method of raising the money. Then they can just go grab a Visa gift debit card.

There is plenty to be lost, as that argument only encourages others to not bother paying for the game who otherwise have the means and the will. It's called peer pressure, the same thing that gets you into wearing your pants around your ankles, stupid tattoos, and not bothering with college because McDonald's pays more than minimum wage. It only stunts your own potential, besides any obvious detriment caused against developers and other people trying to make a buck.

[Commander Zoom]

In a situation like this, guilt is likely to be as effective as any other reasonably/affordably implementable DRM.

[Master]

There is plenty to be lost

I disagree. I would be willing to bet money they are only playing it because they could get it for free. If they couldn't they wouldnt go out of their way to buy it. They would just find something else. I know many people with this mentality. You wont see one increase in sales by coming up with a way to prevent people like that from playing. They just wont play. Be it because they dont have the money or because they dont feel the product is worth their money. (has nothing to do with what you or I feel the product is worth.)

The average pirate wont spend even 1 penny on the software they pirate if that meant they could get it legit. They pirate it because they want to pirate it not because of any other reason. You dont loose sales over people who are not going to buy your product anyways.

[MaxMurder]

Piracy is more of a social problem than a technical one. No amount of DRM will stop pirates from cracking and distributing it. Some people just believe that if they can get the product for free on the internet why bother purchasing it at all. A while back i remember hearing that a Pay-what-you-want for-charity humble indy bundle was cracked and being distributed free (which imo is essentially kleptomania).

Draconian DRM only serves to compound the problem, making games near unplayable for many legitimate users while pirates play worry free. For example i have had to download cracks for Spore multiple times even though i purchased the game legitimately, i lost the cd key long ago and there is no way i can play without the crack. Other games i have bought and am completely unable to play because i do not have a 1Gbps internet connection and time out the authentication servers. Now i make a habit of researching games before I buy. Do they have intrusive DRM? Do I need to be connected to a server in order to play? Is it a Ubisoft game ? If so i will avoid it all together as this causes more headaches than it is worth. Most DRM strategies only exist to convince shareholders that they are fighting the pirates and safeguarding their investment.

I applaud Squad and all other devs who are anti-drm. It is humbling to know that there are still developers who actually trust their customers enough to let them play their without a full cavity search beforehand.

[swiftgates24]

Guys, Squad are not going to implement DRM, HarvesteR has issues with it, about the most DRM KSP will likely ever have will be when it is released on Steam, but that wont affect the Squad store version.

That reminds me, how would people who bought KSP before it was on Steam get it on Steam? Would we all receive a code for a free version of KSP so we can add it?

[Moustachauve]

That reminds me, how would people who bought KSP before it was on Steam get it on Steam? Would we all receive a code for a free version of KSP so we can add it?

It would still be disponible on the KSP website's store as it is actually

[Master]

That reminds me, how would people who bought KSP before it was on Steam get it on Steam? Would we all receive a code for a free version of KSP so we can add it?

Easy solution is to just buy it again.

[swiftgates24]

It would still be disponible on the KSP website's store as it is actually

No I mean like get the icon on steam and not just had it as a non-steam game.

Easy solution is to just buy it again.

Your solution is the best

My next post is my 100th, what shall I do for it?

Edited August 30, 2012 by swiftgates24

[Mr. Scruffy]

I disagree. I would be willing to bet money they are only playing it because they could get it for free. If they couldn't they wouldnt go out of their way to buy it. They would just find something else. I know many people with this mentality. You wont see one increase in sales by coming up with a way to prevent people like that from playing. They just wont play. Be it because they dont have the money or because they dont feel the product is worth their money. (has nothing to do with what you or I feel the product is worth.)

The average pirate wont spend even 1 penny on the software they pirate if that meant they could get it legit. They pirate it because they want to pirate it not because of any other reason. You dont loose sales over people who are not going to buy your product anyways.

That´s the point that always makes me seriously doubt, each time when there are new number released on how much damage media-piracy did on the economy in year X. I doubt they account for this phenomenon, which i can testify for myself in my much younger years: I never ever could have attained a full disc box of c64-games if it hadnt been for schoolyard-piracy and it would be rediculous to chalk every copy i had back then up as ´loss to the economy´. Plus, i probably wouldnt have gotten the hardware in the first place, if the software hadnt been known to be ´free´, beforehand. That was a major selling point of home computers back then, over the consoles (and even let to the tempory demise of the later - but that was an extremity). Plus the empty discs, the disc boxes... I wonder what made tapes so popular in the 80´s (esp. 2x tape-decks)... or a bit later: What did people need all those CD-burners and empty CDs for? All private photo collections? And TB-discs, today contain tons of privately generated, or ligitely purchased media, and nothing else, of course...

Dont get me wrong - i am not trying to advocate pro-pricacy at all. I just doubt that the damage done overall by it is highly overestimated. Pirates do the wrong thing - no doubt - and thus i wont support them getting medals for what they do, but it remains a fact, that the whole media industry probably wouldnt quite be where it is today, without them.