Starwaster

Here's a tip that will ensure that you NEVER have mismatched {}, (), [] or whatever. Every time you place a {, immediately place the } then move your cursor in between and start putting whatever code is going to go there. (programming tip really but it works for writing configs. So..... MODULE { then I immediately type the } MODULE { } cursor up a few lines, hit enter and press tab then start typing. (indentation is important. Makes your stuff easier to read, especially for others.. Always hit the tab when needed) MODULE { // typed some stuffs. This is a comment line. Indentation makes for easier to read code/configs }

you have an extra }

Yes, spacing bad. the other thing no. where he has !MODULE[ModuleSPU], that's a conditional that tests for the absence of ModuleSPU

I'm sorry you want to call it a rant but coincidence does not equal causality.

No. Absolutely not. This is in NO way a Module Manager issue. You really need to understand how Module Manager works, and when it works. It does all its work at one time when the game first starts up before you even get to the main menu. At that time it goes through every single config node (that the game has already loaded up) and looks for config nodes that can't possibly have been parsed by KSP because of their unique Module Manager syntax. Things like '@MODULE[ModuleEnginesFX]{<stuff>}'. It splices things in or removes things as directed. And then it's done. Barring attempts at the debug menu to reload the database it will not execute again. It's not capable of the sort of interaction where it might cause one plugin from calling another's 'methods'. Perhaps FAR no longer defines the method in question or the method is private now or has otherwise changed how it's accessed. Or has changed enough that Sarbian's FAR Extension simply requires recompiling. But not because of Module Manager. It simply does not work that way.

That's the spirit!!! Remember, it's just a bunch of puny ones and zeroes...

Or at least 'Moderately Intelligent Chris'

What effect (if any) are you noticing on the KSC click bug from adjusting the camera? Is the click bug still present? Or does it occur more often?

No. I'm hard pressed to think what conflicts might occur even hypothetically.

It could be a good idea except that just assuming an implicit :FOR[] is not enough, you'd also have to schedule a parsing pass based on the base directory name regardless of whether it already has one scheduled for its dll. (which dll.... first one found or all?) I see some inconsistent behavior possible if modders through negligence write some of their configs using :FOR and some with :FOR omitted. It will make it difficult for a third party to know for sure whether their desired configs for mod X are actually going to happen :BEFORE/:AFTER mod X's :FOR pass since it necessarily would have to have 2 or more. What I'm really starting to wonder is if it's really such a good idea to use the presence of any of a mod's DLLs to schedule parsing passes at all? Shouldn't it only use the base directory for that mod? That would (should) do more to ensure consistent behavior.

Yes, but if they don't actually use a config that places that mod's desired changes in one of those passes then they don't happen in those passes. Maybe that's a bug and they're supposed to, but they do not. Understand? If for example, Real Fuels does not have something like @PART[b9_Engine_SABRE_S]:FOR[modularFuelTanks]{<changes>} then it will not happen in the pass for modularFuelTanks. (which is where RF passes actually occur because of the dll name) So if I want to do something :BEFORE[modularFuelTanks] or :AFTER[modularFuelTanks] it's pointless. I cannot guarantee that it will happen :BEFORE or :AFTER. My options are :FIRST or :FINAL. I don't know if that's the intended behavior or not but that is what is right now. In fact looking at my output_log.txt, it looks like all configs that aren't using :BEFORE, :FOR or AFTER are happening before those passes. Edit: Which is why, assuming the current behavior is correct behavior, it's imperative that as many mods as possible start making use of :FOR[]

I've asked this before without response, but does anyone have any PF configs for biconic/triconic shapes?

When you are viewing your imgur photos, you should see a link that says 'large thumbnail' click that and you'll get a series of URLs that you can use depending on where you want to post them. I think bbcode is the one you want for here. It will get you a clickable thumbnail.

while researching manned Mars mission proposals (Copernicus, et al) one thing I was struck by was that projected RCS tank dry mass seemed higher than I had thought they might be. But look at the application. These are pressurized bladder tanks and they're going to have extra mass associated beyond the mass of the tank. I'm not necessarily saying you're wrong mind you, just that when you say that the base mass seems a little off.... that's pretty much what I was thinking looking at projected tank masses for real life applications.

Sarbian, today's FAR update seems to have further broken the FARExt plugin. method not found: ferram4.FARWingAerodynamicModel.GetStall @jeffrey: I have no problem with MJ and MM 2.0.3

Sorry Sarbian, but without your magicWand_log.txt file we cant troubleshoot your wand. NOT the magicWand.log file because that doesnt have detailed enough wand diagnostics.

Chris I'm noticing there's a new update for FAR that I haven't downloaded yet so I'm going to grab that and test for that second error again. edit: tested stock chute issue with MM 1.5.7 - stock chute errors persist. same error as reported before.. definitely not looking like a module manager issue. FAR issue: installed new FAR update from today and the error I reported has not reappeared

Maybe, but I'm a little skeptical about that being the cause. I looked at my log and looked at some stock chutes in the database to see what modules they had and it looks like the MM configs did what they were supposed to. But who knows. I do however have some errors to show you: Here's an excerpt from the log starting when I select a chute from inventory in the editor: (the null refs in RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () continue until I delete the part) [RealChute]: Could not find the canopy parachute model within library (Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d3d49558e4d408f4/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 53) [RealChute]: Reloading size nodes for parachuteLarge (Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d3d49558e4d408f4/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 53) [RealChute]: Could not find the case texture at the index [0] within library (Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d3d49558e4d408f4/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 53) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.UpdateScale (.Part part, RealChute.RealChuteModule module) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 at RealChute.ProceduralChute.OnStart (StartState state) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 at Part.ModulesOnStart () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 at Part+ .MoveNext () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object at RealChute.ProceduralChute.Update () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: Line: -1) Edit: More errors! This one seems to be trying to get atmospheric density from FAR. [RealChute]: Encountered an error calculating atmospheric density with FAR. Using stock values. at System.Linq.Enumerable.First[MethodInfo] (IEnumerable`1 source, System.Func`2 predicate, Fallback fallback) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 at System.Linq.Enumerable.First[MethodInfo] (IEnumerable`1 source, System.Func`2 predicate) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 at RealChute.Extensions.CelestialBodyExtensions.GetDensityAtAlt (.CelestialBody body, Double alt) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 (Filename: C:/BuildAgent/work/d3d49558e4d408f4/artifacts/StandalonePlayerGenerated/UnityEngineDebug.cpp Line: 53) InvalidOperationException: Operation is not valid due to the current state of the object at System.Linq.Enumerable.First[MethodInfo] (IEnumerable`1 source, System.Func`2 predicate, Fallback fallback) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 at System.Linq.Enumerable.First[MethodInfo] (IEnumerable`1 source, System.Func`2 predicate) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 at RealChute.Extensions.CelestialBodyExtensions.GetDensityAtAlt (.CelestialBody body, Double alt) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 UnityEngine.Debug:Internal_LogException(Exception, Object) UnityEngine.Debug:LogException(Exception) RealChute.Extensions.CelestialBodyExtensions:GetDensityAtAlt(CelestialBody, Double) RealChute.RealChuteModule:FixedUpdate()

That's pretty much how I always viewed the VAB myself. And yeah, Modular Fuels is your basic 'configure your fuel tank/resource container' however you want. Real Fuels originally was nothing more than a set of config files for Modular Fuels that replaced the generic 'liquid fuel/oxidizer' with real world fuels with realistic densities. Config files only. If you just go with Modular Fuels you stay stock but can do whatever you want to your tanks.

I'm thinking that with this, some conic stretchy tanks and the B9 SABRE engines I could make a Skylon spaceplane pretty easily. cargo bay in the middle, a large conic stretchy on the front, one on the back... (I think that's sort of been done except this cargo bay system didn't exist at the time)

FAR DENSITY SUPPORT?!?? Now that is totally awesome. (but without me, it would just be aweso)

And, don't forget the part where it starts veering to the side as you approach takeoff speed....

the difference between @ and @ only modifies existing nodes and % modifies existing nodes BUT adds the node if it doesn't exist. However.... I think experiment definitions are at the root level which is read only so we're limited in what we can do with it... you can edit the existing nodes within but you can't add a node to it.

seems like this is going to be somewhat painful switching over until modders start implementing the new ordering keywords for their mods. no point in specifying BEFORE/AFTER mod-x until mod-x has been switched over to have its configs using :FOR

There's an option on the ToolBar to configure visible buttons. (make sure you have most recent toolbar plugin from the toolbar thread; if you overwrote it with another mod's distributed version it might be out of date) Click that and see if any MJ buttons show up. Make sure to check off the ones you want.