Hodo

I have been building SSTO spaceplanes for a long long time. And you can build some pretty small simple ones that have no real purpose other than to say "Ha I did it!" but you can also build some pretty functional massive space planes that have a job. Here is one I built with 1 B9 part it has no purpose other than to test out the RAPIER when it came out. This was a SSTO spacefighter that has the capability to be armed and kill things. And the crowd favorite, my heavy hauler SSTO spaceplane with its 108ton lifting capacity. If you look at each one of them you can see they are different, they each have different goals and design theories in mind. The trick is to find what you want it to do before you build it. If you have it do to much it will never work, or will just work poorly.

This is what I get with the latest version... As you can see the rocket engines are being pulled behind the craft. They still work and function but they are dangling by an invisible string from behind the craft. I uninstalled KJR and everything works fine now... odd.

The problem I see is your vertical stabilizer is woefully insufficient for that craft.

The mods involved with this build and several others are as follows. Procedural Wings Procedural Fairings Stretch Tanks B9 Even when using stock parts in place of the B9 parts things just fall apart. KJR loads, then they just collapse, no explosions, doesn't matter what it is, I have had an antenna fall through a whole rocket and that was the only thing on the top. I may remove KJR and see if that fixes the problem.

Having an issue since .23.5 came out. My KJR is causing my craft to just fall apart. My most recent creation an attempt at another Realism Overhaul SSTO, using the AJE engines, and the stretchy tanks. The craft just fell apart on load in. no explosions just bits on the tarmac.

I don't think ANVIL fairings are compatible try using Procedural Fairings or KW parts. Those are two parts packs that I know are FAR compatible.

I love the design, reminds me when I dabbled in the lifting surface designs for a few days.

For me it depends on the design I am going for. If it is a cargo hauler I generally design the wings bigger than needed for the craft empty, that way it still generates more than enough lift for when it is hauling its cargo. But for my crew shuttles and science craft, they can very from the interesting to the boring. Here are a few of my favorite designs. SVO-22 Thrush SP-406 with its 108 ton cargo hauling capacity. SVO-21 my commsat launcher. To my first SSTO for the Real Solar System scaled Kerbin, in other words it is the same scale as Earth. The X-4. And the last working SSTO for the RSS sized Kerbin before I went full Realism Overhaul. X-6 Even my old work horse, which was my first working SSTO, that I just kept improving, SVO-25/SP-301.

I can not agree more with this statement right here. Right now the OP's rocket is just a bad design all around. It has TOO much power, to little fuel, and probably using a nose or parts that are not FAR compitable.

Ok Ironclad, here is your problem with your aircraft. The stability issues on the ground are because your landing gear are off camber. In simple terms they flex out when you are on the ground causing the aircraft to pull one direction or the other. This is caused by the fact they are under the wings, and the wings are not structurally strong enough to handle the load of the craft, thus they flex upwards as the aircraft attempts to pull up. Which pushes down on the landing gear. The other issue is your landing gear are to far back from the CoM of the aircraft, this is crazy considering how short this airframe of this craft is. But it is true, your rotate point is almost in line with your CoL, which is a fair bit behind your CoM. There are several options to fix this problem. You can add struts to the wings which will make them more ridged and fix the flex issue making the aircraft a lot more stable. And you can move the landing gear on the wings foward just a bit to get them closer to your CoM. A couple of other minor fixes I would do for stability sake. I would remove those massive control surfaces and that tail, and go with smaller control surfaces so I can set roll and pitch on different ones so you dont have aileron-elevators, which will cause stability issues while flying. I would also ditch the leading edge control surfaces, there is a reason why you dont see many aircraft out there with leading edge control surfaces. Sure you see planes with slats, leading edge flaps but not control surfaces. As for the tail there is a winglet/canard part that has a built in control surface and doesnt move the whole part. This is perfect for a tail for an aircraft this small as it would reduce your loss of stability on sharp yaw meneuvers. Good luck, and dont worry I have lots of experience with FAR+DRE, just look at my sig, that is ALL of the mods I run.

I have to suggest this plugin be added to the list for the RO. http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/70008-0-23-Advanced-Jet-Engine-%28AJE%29-v1-0-3-28-14-Compatibility-fix The Advanced Jet Engine mod does to jets what Farrem does to the aerodynamics and is a must have.

You should consider imgur.

You don't have drain the fuel to get the balance right unless you are looking to keep the current shape. You could do something as simple as move the wings forward a bit, or just extend the inner edge of the wings just a bit forwards. Right now your SSTO looks more like a rocket that takes off horizontally. This is fine if it has enough body lift to overcome gravity. But currently it does not. The thing is if you look at the SSTO I posted the album of, the Center of Lift (CoL) is right behind the Center of Mass (CoM), and not by a large amount. You want it right behind it, so the cross lines touch it at the furthest, and at the closest, you dont want it more than just behind the center of the CoM ball marker. Now mind you the CoM will shift as your fuel drains, I did not notice if you have the RCS build aid plugin. It helps a lot when figuring out the dry CoM and the wet CoM. And looking at the second craft you posted, there are some other issues that will come up. -all of the solar panels on the wings will cause excess drag, which will slow down the aircraft in the atmosphere. If they stay on during re-entry (if you have DRE) will be a miracle. -The landing gear are to far behind the CoM rotate point. Ideally you want the landing gear just behind the CoM+CoL this gives you the rotate point for take off. -Your tail stabilizers, are WAY to small for that craft, and they are canted at an odd angle that will actually cause them to act more like a spoiler than a rudder/stabilizer. Their current angle will cause the aircraft to pitch down. -You also have to many intakes for that aircraft. From a quick count you have 10 intakes for 4 air breathing engines. That is a lot of excess drag that really isnt needed. The inline intakes you have on the engine nacelles and the stock turbine intakes are useless at the speeds you will need to be going to achieve orbital velocities. Sorry to pick apart your craft, but I have a fair about of experience with SSTO, and space planes. I have built a few dozen of them if not a hundred, and a few that even work in the Realism Overhaul plugin.

Ok looking at a few of your designs, you have issues with these problems. Your landing gear are not straight, they have to much camber, which in KSP is bad. It causes random steering issues. Next your CoL is to far back, it should be right behind your CoM. This keeps your craft pretty stable at super sonic speeds and gives you room for the CoM to shift while fuel drains. Here is one of my OLD SSTOs.

What troubles? That is the easiest plugin I have ever installed.

You can post your album here in this thread, it is pretty simple, [ imgur ] album code [ / imgur ] No spaces in the code script. One last thing, you should really update your FAR.

F-3 Dragon (Realism Overhaul+AJE) P-3 Cyclops (Realism Overhaul+AJE) XF-145 Tomkat (SSTO for stock sized Kerbin with FAR+DRE) C-1 Starhauler (Realism Overhaul+AJE) F-1 Dart (Realism Overhaul+AJE) These are my current military aircraft, the only one not in use now is my XF-145, which was built for a challenge, which it tied for first on. I have no current pictures with armorment because I went through and revamped all of my missiles after the 23.5 patch, I make them with the stretchy tank mod to cut down on parts counts. All of my Realism Overhaul aircraft use the Real Jets mod (AJE), which makes the airbreathing engines react like REAL jet engines. So all of the RO+AJE craft react like you would expect real aircraft of that type to react.

I love answers like this. Because they are answered with a simpler response. Don't like it, don't use it. Simple as that. It applies to the whole ARM patch, if you don't like something DON'T use it! I personally don't like the stock KSP, so I don't use the stock KSP, I have more mods than some of you have hairs on your chin. Arguing and crying about updates is like screaming at the clouds because they are blocking the sun when you are at the beach or crying because it is raining outside on your day off. It is pointless and a waist of everyones energy listening to it. So suck it up, drive on, and cowboy the f* up!

I would love to see pictures and see how it compares to my heavy lifter SSTO, the SP-406A.

Simple, Go into the persistant save file, set respawn to FALSE, and they will stay dead.

Wow, you really know how to debate something don't you? Chris just brought a counter point to your figures and you answer with that?!?! What are you 6? "I dont like you don't agree with me so I am not talking to you." On topic, I still haven't bothered to use those engines, they don't seem all that bad. People cried about the RAPIER, the SABRE, the nukes, and everything else. The only thing I think people should complain about is, why aren't there more people playing this! Let us remember it is ONLY .235 not 1.235 not 23.5, it is VERSION 0.23.5, which means it is still .765 versions away from being a live complete version.

I am simply amazed by the amount of crying over the new engines. I have yet to use the new engines or really any of the new parts because they aren't that great when mated with the Realism Overhaul running real Earth solar system. It doesn't matter if I am launching a satellite into orbit from Kennedy Space Center in Florida or launching from the Russian Space Center in southern Russia. Getting a rocket into orbit around Earth at a LEO, still takes over 9400m/s d/V, it still takes a fine balance of TWR to make sure you dont over accelerate and destroy the probe or kill the crew during the launch. Sure the new engine seems powerful but when you have the option of a 10000kn thrust engine that can inhale more fuel than you can dream of in a launch, and find out that it was ACTUALLY MADE, you find that your perspective changes a bit on balance. So TL;DR Stop crying about balance, it is only BETA .235!!!!!!!!!!

I can't play stock anymore, much like the OP said. The stock aerodynamic model is, to be polite, laughable. Anyone who thinks they have built a rocket that would work anywhere but in the stock KSP is fooling themselves. After a day with the game I downloaded FAR and DRE, so I could have a game that responded the way I expected real life aircraft to respond. With that said do I think that KSP needs to have FAR and DRE, no, but I do think it needs to be an option in the settings. Some players want to play LEGO rockets and just launch things that make no logical sense into space and that is fine.

Wrong forum.

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