Which atmopshere do you prefer?

[RocketPilot573]

There seems to be differing opinions on the atmosphere changes lately, so which update with different atmospheres do you think is the best for the game? Consider both realism and fun please.

[SelectHalfling0]

Make this a poll!

On topic: 1.0's: It was mostly realistic and allowed for mostly actual rocket flight, and planes were better for surveillance contracts because they were faster. The new one means that all old designs (.90) kinda-work again but now planes need a ridiculous amount of wings to generate enough lift.

[TeddyDD]

realism = fun so FAR atmosphere

[luizopiloto]

the problem isn't the atmosphere... the problem is how some of the parts perform now... some have too much drag... and jet engines drains a lot more fuel... and RAPIERS are too weak...

the actual atmospheric performs a bit more realistic, but the jet engines drains fuel like rocket engines... So spaceplanes isn't the best option anymore...

Edited May 2, 2015 by luizopiloto

[Stratoroc]

FAR-sphere

[georgTF]

I don't think the poll is entirely fair. There are issues with 1.0 and 1.0.2 and the aero model has to work accurately for all planets which makes tweaking it a problem. For me, 1.0 was by far the most enjoyable but parachutes and shields were badly broken so how can i endorse it? It had no soup so it gets the vote i guess, but it's not perfect.

[RocketPilot573]

I don't think the poll is entirely fair. There are issues with 1.0 and 1.0.2 and the aero model has to work accurately for all planets which makes tweaking it a problem. For me, 1.0 was by far the most enjoyable but parachutes and shields were badly broken so how can i endorse it? It had no soup so it gets the vote i guess, but it's not perfect.

Issues with parachutes and heatshields don't mater much here, the topic of the poll is meant to be about the atmosphere itself. At least that's the intention.

[Temeter]

1.0 was fun, but it hampered plane construction. There wasn't much difference between a good and a bad plane, even at multiple mach speed at ground level. So 1.0.1 for me, even though i'm not a fan of how the planes feel a slight bit more sluggish than before (that's including not-terrible-planes).

As I wrote in another thread, to me the one huge advantage of 1.0 was the SAS/timewarp-stability of planes.

Edited May 2, 2015 by Temeter

[Pax Kerbana]

It's not about which one is preferred, just want it to be realistic as possible. I think 1.0 felt close and I was really happy with it in general.

I have no idea how they go about determining drag values but the process should be more than just changing numbers and seeing how it works. Hopefully they actually model it and use those results to get the part data. But I strongly suspect they do not.

[Red Iron Crown]

I like the 1.0.2 revision. Getting to orbit was just too easy in 1.0 IMO, and from a realism perspective the atmospheric density was only about 80% of Earth's. For me, 1.0.2 gives a better balance and challenge.

[panzer1b]

the problem isn't the atmosphere... the problem is how some of the parts perform now... some have too much drag... and jet engines drains a lot more fuel... and RAPIERS are too weak...

the actual atmospheric performs a bit more realistic, but the jet engines drains fuel like rocket engines... So spaceplanes isn't the best option anymore...

SSTOs lost much of a reason to exist after 1.0.1 anyways, given that they were already borderline pointless when it comes down to payload fraction, and they were borderline impossible to make super lightweight as well (my sci-fy styles carrier fighters still work, but i used to be able to do a laythe roundtrip in 1.0, now i need to dump the entire ion gear just to get into orbit, and whats the point when you need to refuel 24/7). I usually liked to create SSTOs that were below 20t, with 1.0 it was feaseable, you could even bring a few weapons too and not have that bad a drag penalty, now its pretty much impossible to get anything fun to SSTO.

TLDR: 1.0 was in my opinion the most fun and enjoyeable of all atmospheres. Im not necessarily saying it was the most realistic atmo, but it sure was alot of fun to fly in it (and SSTOs were tough to make, but could actually get into orbit and even farther out if needed). While i cant say what is more realistic (ive played some flight sims but no replica like craft actually behave like the ones from flight sims anyways regardless of game version), i can say 1.0 was the best from a fun and feel perspective (+ fw190 replica with a rapier in teh back going mach 4 at sea level was fun!).

[Wallygator]

I agree with red iron crown... 1.0.2 seems more gentle and forgiving with delicate maneuver yielding like for like payoffs in dV savings. It no longer has a digital feel - more analogue in my opinion. I like it. Feels organic.

[SelectHalfling0]

I agree with red iron crown... 1.0.2 seems more gentle and forgiving with delicate maneuver yielding like for like payoffs in dV savings. It no longer has a digital feel - more analogue in my opinion. I like it. Feels organic.

I'm not getting any dV savings. My orbiter that could rendevousz can barely make orbit now with 2 units of fuel left.

[Bobnova]

FAR, by far.

Given my choice in the matter Squad would buy FAR, buy Deadly Reentry, and buy Realchute.

[Whirligig Girl]

Where's the third option for 0.10, when the atmosphere still stopped flat at 34 kilometers?

[panzer1b]

I'm not getting any dV savings. My orbiter that could rendevousz can barely make orbit now with 2 units of fuel left.

1.0 made massive dV savings for classical rockets. You could get into orbit with a minor fraction of what you needed in 0.90. Then 1.0.1 came alone, and while its still nowhere near as bad as 0.90, its not like its a step forwards either.

My opinion is that they should slowly start reverting the all across the board ISP nerfs for rocket engines, the isp nerfs were balanced for 1.0's atmo, but now that drag is back up, i think a 20% or so ISP buff across the board to LFO engines and perhaps jets/rapiers would be nice.

[Frozen_Heart]

My opinion is that they should slowly start reverting the all across the board ISP nerfs for rocket engines, the isp nerfs were balanced for 1.0's atmo, but now that drag is back up, i think a 20% or so ISP buff across the board to LFO engines and perhaps jets/rapiers would be nice.

This. The engines were nicely balanced for 1.0. Now drag is back up they are underpowered.

I'm having to stick asparagus or boosters all over mine to get performance. Realistic and linear rockets don't work very well currently.

[LostOblivion]

Granted, I haven't played much 1.0/1.0.1/1.0.2 yet, but I could't see much difference. From a realism point of view, the SSTO argument is silly, as SSTO's on IRL is HARD. However, it is a game, so I can understand people reacting to it.

Anyway, I think the aero in 1.0.2 still feels right as I can still make proper gravity turns, etc. I don't know the difference from 1.0, but I don't mind it being a little denser than Earth's atmo because I think the thinness experienced in FAR is way too easy.

Combined with the fixed parachute and heat shield fixes, it's a definitive 1.0.2 for me. :-)

Edited May 2, 2015 by LostOblivion

[Superfluous J]

I've not had enough time to decide. .90 is by far the bottom of my list. 1.0 seemed too drag-free but 1.0.2 seems like maybe it has too much drag. I have no idea which is more realistic. Both are "realistic enough" that it comes down to opinion.

[Bobnova]

Granted, I haven't played much 1.0/1.0.1/1.0.2 yet, but I could't see much difference. From a realism point of view, the SSTO argument is silly, as SSTO's on IRL is HARD. However, it is a game, so I can understand people reacting to it.

Anyway, I think the aero in 1.0.2 still feels right as I can still make proper gravity turns, etc. I don't know the difference from 1.0, but I don't mind it being a little denser than Earth's atmo because I think the thinness experienced in FAR is way too easy.

Combined with the fixed parachute and heat shield fixes, it's a definitive 1.0.2 for me. :-)

This.

Has a real world SSTO even been managed yet?

Where FAR is hard is getting big payloads up there. Small stuff that you can make look like a rocket isn't bad.

Single launch Mun bases? Hard.

[Red Iron Crown]

This.

Has a real world SSTO even been managed yet?

Where FAR is hard is getting big payloads up there. Small stuff that you can make look like a rocket isn't bad.

Single launch Mun bases? Hard.

The Apollo Lunar Ascent Stage was an SSTO. /pedantic

More seriously, some real life launchers could SSTO if they had no payload, which is the real problem with chemically-powered SSTOs IRL. At best you'll get 1-2% of the rocket mass as payload.

[Temeter]

This. The engines were nicely balanced for 1.0. Now drag is back up they are underpowered.

I'm having to stick asparagus or boosters all over mine to get performance. Realistic and linear rockets don't work very well currently.

Increase of D/V to 1.0 is around 100 delta-v, which results around ~3400dv to orbit. Old stock was 4500dv, and the engine nerfs compensate that change in no way. Still easier than ever before to get to orbit. You did get to space earliers, so why is this suddenly a problem? Just because it was a tiny bit easier at one point?

Edited May 2, 2015 by Temeter

[Stormweaver]

1.0+ is by and far better than anything 0.9 or beforehand, but I didn't really get enough time with the different version to tell the difference tbh. 1.02 feels nice I guess.

That isn't to say there isn't some funky things going on with it.

I don't think they thought through the newer inline air intakes very well - sure, stick one in a cargo bay and it won't work. Stick a solid object on the giant fan on the front? A-Ok! Planes do fly like a dream though.

[foxkill2342]

Does anyone use planes in career anymore? I was a big fan of planes, but 1.0 made them a lot less useful, 1.02 basically gave me no reason to ever upgrade my space plane hangar. I'm going to give Duna a try with a plane, but I have to put it in orbit with rockets. I really don't like the huge drag increase below 10K...

[Whirligig Girl]

Where's the third option for 0.10, when the atmosphere still stopped flat at 34 kilometers?