The Apollo Applications Program: 1.0 Edition

[loch.ness]

Mayday.

1.0.3 caused all my crafts to freeze and then in 1.0.4 there was a weird heating issue at Skylab/Harbor station during a new STS test. The Apollo CSM docking and recovery module exploded from over heating).

(On the nose of my Mk1-2 pods there has been a Cubic-Octogon structural piece with the drogue and normal parachutes attached and 3 Antenna which when extended formed the Apollo CSM docking port. This structural part somehow overheated and exploded on both docked CSMs while my shuttle was approaching Harbor Station. Luckily I can get the crews aboard the station through EVA and then send up new missions to recover them - I'm worried about the 3 CSMs I have out at Mun yet.

[Rhomphaia]

Mayday.

1.0.3 caused all my crafts to freeze and then in 1.0.4 there was a weird heating issue at Skylab/Harbor station during a new STS test. The Apollo CSM docking and recovery module exploded from over heating).

(On the nose of my Mk1-2 pods there has been a Cubic-Octogon structural piece with the drogue and normal parachutes attached and 3 Antenna which when extended formed the Apollo CSM docking port. This structural part somehow overheated and exploded on both docked CSMs while my shuttle was approaching Harbor Station. Luckily I can get the crews aboard the station through EVA and then send up new missions to recover them - I'm worried about the 3 CSMs I have out at Mun yet.

I have heard of a bug where very low mass parts can undergo runaway heating, but the stock Cubic Octagonal Strut should be above this threshold.

If you use a modded part, you will probably have to search through the persistence.sfs for the part in question and increase its mass to 0.0001

[Death Engineering]

Mayday.

Perhaps also related to http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/126574-1-0-4-Large-SAS-Units-Exploding-Due-to-Overheating-While-Just-Sitting-on-the-Launch-Pad

[Rhomphaia]

You can scratch my original suggestion.

Tried to re-create your docking port arrangement, a cubic octagonal strut between the pod and docking port, three antennae, three radial chutes and a radial drogue attached to the strut piece.

Worked fine until i tried under physics warp, then the cubic octagonal strut consistently exploded due to overheating.

I only tried this on an isolated ship, but I suspect that as you approach your station, the increased physics load is causing the game to take the same kinds of shortcuts it does in physics warp, and heat transfer between these small pieces is going berserk.

Edit: the MK2-R Radial mount parachutes seem to be the issue here. Attaching them to the top of the pod rather than to the cubic octagonal strut seems to prevent the issue without compromising the look of the ship. Not much help for current flights but should help in the future.

Edited June 25, 2015 by Rhomphaia

[loch.ness]

Thanks! I didn't get the same effect on Apollo XV when I loaded it earlier - so hopefully my Lunar missions will be safe. I can't rep back yet.

I managed to get my crews aboard the station, I'll have to send up new ships to bring them back once I fix things. My Saturn Shuttle had a hard time staying nose first during re-entry this time, but it still had fuel in the back instead of coming down nearly empty. It was very stable in the upper atmosphere during re-entry(50km - 20km). It fought me tooth and nail from 20km down to 6 km (or until it got down to reasonable speeds). Still a bit drag heavy on landings but much better than in 1.0.2 Managed an emergency water landing at ~ 29 m/s. It didn't stay intact but nobody died. Going to need to adjust the wing placement again.

I'll move the chutes on future pods as you suggested and come back to Rep again once I can.

[Rhomphaia]

Thanks! I didn't get the same effect on Apollo XV when I loaded it earlier - so hopefully my Lunar missions will be safe. I can't rep back yet.

I managed to get my crews aboard the station, I'll have to send up new ships to bring them back once I fix things. My Saturn Shuttle had a hard time staying nose first during re-entry this time, but it still had fuel in the back instead of coming down nearly empty. It was very stable in the upper atmosphere during re-entry(50km - 20km). It fought me tooth and nail from 20km down to 6 km (or until it got down to reasonable speeds). Still a bit drag heavy on landings but much better than in 1.0.2 Managed an emergency water landing at ~ 29 m/s. It didn't stay intact but nobody died. Going to need to adjust the wing placement again.

I'll move the chutes on future pods as you suggested and come back to Rep again once I can.

Glad to hear things are OK with your program, unfortunately a similar but unrelated Fire-Breathing Kraken has infested my Skylab (think this is the one I've got)

I know skylab had overheating problems and the first manned missions had to perform emergency repairs. But mine is hitting 20billion Kelvin in the time it takes me to right click a part the instant I see the first overheat bar (sorry underestimated by several order of magnitude, screenshot shows temp approaching at least a yottaKelvin, extends past the borders of the dialog box so can't be sure, tested with ignore max temperature enabled, will explode before any overheat bar appears without it)

Edited June 26, 2015 by Rhomphaia

[Guest]

Can someone clarify for me, are these new radiators to be considered required equipment?

I don't want to try a Mun shot if my CSM and MLM are simply going to overheat and explode.

Should I modify the design to add radiators?

[B-STRK]

Can someone clarify for me, are these new radiators to be considered required equipment?

I don't want to try a Mun shot if my CSM and MLM are simply going to overheat and explode.

Should I modify the design to add radiators?

Haven't made the jump to 1.0.4 because I was worried about that. But I think it depends on whether the existing vessel design can take the new heat, and how much heat it generates/collects in the first place. Testing probably is the only way to be sure.

I don't think they'd be "required", if your spacecraft can get away with it, or the design can dissipate the heat it generates quickly without need of radiators.

[Guest]

Jebke Kerman, the conquering hero of outer space, has just returned from the PM-3 Mission.

PM-3 finally fulfilled the goal that was met with Apollo 7, test fly the CSM for a minimum of 3 days.

This means, I can finally post a score that means something.

Current Score = 35

- Stock. +20 (Use only stock parts)

- Launch Escape System. +5

- Use fuel cells for power generation only +10

You can read all about it on my mission report thread (Including a tribute to my retired Saturn 1b Rocket):

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/123221-Challenge-My-attempt-at-The-Apollo-Applications-Program-1-0-Edition?p=2051414&viewfull=1#post2051414

But if you don't have the time or patience for that, here is a very special video I made for anyone reading this thread.

It shows the highlights of the PM-2/3 Mission cut to the 'When We Left Earth' Music. I hope you like it.

[B-STRK]

Greg, do you mind if I ask for a judgment call? I decided to go the Nova (post-Apollo launcher proposals) route, drew up a launcher and used it in mission. I went with your cue about that design using 4 stretch S-IC boosters--and found an old design in pre-1.0 that used six S-1C boosters as additional inspo. The inspiration is based on a number of the Martin Marietta 2-stage Nova proposals, although the second stage design doesn't match up, I think. A comparative blueprint of the launchers in my challenge playthrough is provided below, I just need to ask is if it passes muster for your "reuse Apollo hardware" requirement??

It's not a scoring launch yet--and as for future munbase scoring, that will be scored with Saturn V class launchers. But the refinery scoring will most likely be launched with this vehicle above. Would it be enough for a Nova under your challenge restrictions?

#pleaseandthankyou!

For those interested in the mission post, it's here. Blatant use of Ramin Djawadi soundtracks and all.

[Bev7787]

Sneak peek of my Saturn IB

[Xeldrak]

I have to say it's quite impressive, what some of you guys have done. Halsfury's Saturn V build is really impressive!

Was thinking to join this challenge aswell, but right now I'm somewhat intimidated

Since I'm playing around with my Saturn IB build - what did you guys use as Rocketdyne H-1 replacement? I've been using a mix of LV-T30s and LV-T45s, but only eight (to stay true to the original engine assembly) of them give a lackluster amount thrust.

Edited July 18, 2015 by Xeldrak

[HoloYolo]

I have to say it's quite impressive, what some of you guys have done. Halsfury's Saturn V build is really impressive!

Was thinking to join this challenge aswell, but right now I'm somewhat intimidated

Since I'm playing around with my Saturn IB build - what did you guys use as Rocketdyne H-1 replacement? I've been using a mix of LV-T30s and LV-T45s, but only eight (to stay true to the original engine assembly) of them give a lackluster amount thrust.

Skippers are good. I use them a lot for Saturn IBs

[Rhomphaia]

I have to say it's quite impressive, what some of you guys have done. Halsfury's Saturn V build is really impressive!

Was thinking to join this challenge aswell, but right now I'm somewhat intimidated

Since I'm playing around with my Saturn IB build - what did you guys use as Rocketdyne H-1 replacement? I've been using a mix of LV-T30s and LV-T45s, but only eight (to stay true to the original engine assembly) of them give a lackluster amount thrust.

I found LV-T30s to work fairly realistically, just enough of a boost to allow the S-IVB to lift the CSM to orbit.

I went for ease of operation rather than realism though, and went for four twin-boars giving the 8 nozzles I needed. Very overpowered, so I limited the thrust, and added a lot of dead weight decorative tanks.

Also since I plan to continue my program, a question for GregroxMun.

Is using parts from the official Asteroid Day mod on my Skylab going to cost me my stock bonus? I would like the Apollo Telescope Mount to actually have a telescope, and the antenna is cool,

[Mad Rocket Scientist]

[...]

Since I'm playing around with my Saturn IB build - what did you guys use as Rocketdyne H-1 replacement? I've been using a mix of LV-T30s and LV-T45s, but only eight (to stay true to the original engine assembly) of them give a lackluster amount thrust.

I've kind of given up, but clipping a LV-T45 into a LV-T30, for every H-1, worked for me.

[Death Engineering]

Inside my Saturn 1B was a subframe of 200 I-Beams with 8 radially attached fuel tanks. Each tank had a LV-T45 under it but there was a ninth engine (LV-T30) under the I-Beams...! haxors

[Norcalplanner]

Since I'm playing around with my Saturn IB build - what did you guys use as Rocketdyne H-1 replacement? I've been using a mix of LV-T30s and LV-T45s, but only eight (to stay true to the original engine assembly) of them give a lackluster amount thrust.

I used the K1 Kiwi from SpaceY. It's a 1.25m engine that has 425 kN thrust. I also only used 7 of them, because my stack was 3.75m in diameter; I'm not a big fan of part clipping, especially where engines are involved.

[Coga19000]

I've currently been unable to work on the Program, but as far as I had reached, eight LV-T30s were capable of barely getting the CSM to orbit in 1.0. However, it would require a sizable S-IVB stage (way to much fuel left when on my Saturn V,but it might depend on design), and it will have to fire twice at all launches except for when it has no payload.

[Xeldrak]

Well, I have started my own munar programm

The boosters are basically done, now I only have to build the remaining hardware.

---

[Whirligig Girl]

Good to see this challenge is still alive despite my apparent absence in this thread. To be honest I forgot about it.

The Asteroid Day Mod is stock as far as the challenge rules are concerned. And the bouncy-balls mod from last year too, why not?

From now on I ask that if you would like to be put on the leaderboard, you must PM me. Otherwise I have to go through the thread and I might miss something or mix something up.

[Coga19000]

Well, I have started my own munar programm

The boosters are basically done, now I only have to build the remaining hardware.

---

http://i.imgur.com/ASxEzWD.png

http://i.imgur.com/D64AobK.pnghttp://i.imgur.com/w0uJIGJ.pnghttp://i.imgur.com/kdZY6Ud.png

Don't get me wrong, I always love all your designs, these included, but your Saturn's seen to minimalistic for a proper Apollo Mission. It's a fresh and innovative approach, that's for sure -but how are you going to make the CSM and LEM? Are 1.25 meters even enough?

[Bioman222]

The dawn of the Daphne program:

Javascript is disabled. View full album

[Bioman222]

And Daphne 4 and 5 have been launched.

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Javascript is disabled. View full album

[Xeldrak]

Don't get me wrong, I always love all your designs, these included, but your Saturn's seen to minimalistic for a proper Apollo Mission. It's a fresh and innovative approach, that's for sure -but how are you going to make the CSM and LEM? Are 1.25 meters even enough?

???

Underpowered?

The Sleipnir V's first stage has 5 Mainsail engines, the second stage has 5 Skipper engines and the third stage is powered by a single skipper engine.

[Coga19000]

???

Underpowered?

The Sleipnir V's first stage has 5 Mainsail engines, the second stage has 5 Skipper engines and the third stage is powered by a single skipper engine.

No, no, underpowered is not what I meant. See, the Mk.1-2 capsule (the most Apollo-esque piece of equipment on stock KSP) has a diameter on 2.5 meters. Therefore, to keep the iconic Saturn V profile, most entries have a S-IV stage (the third stage) with a 3.75m fuel tank, and a S-II stage (the second stage) and S-ICstage (the first stage) with their best tries for a stock approach to a 5m rocket (or actual 5m tanks from mods such as KW Rocketry)

. In your case, the CSM will be the same size as your S-IV stage if not bigger, unless you opt out for the Mk.1 single Kerbal capsule. And your possible Skylab entry will be a bit... Tiny, that's all

Now, don't you think I'm trying to force you into a certain way of thinking. If you have found a solution to these problems already, or if you simply don't mind the difference, I will still be happy to see your rockets in action

Edited July 22, 2015 by Coga19000