Braking causing acceleration?

[Hyomoto]

I'm trying to pin down a 'phantom' force in the game, but since I haven't isolated what it is yet it seems pointless to put in a bug report. I'm hoping some of you are familiar with this bug and can either point me to a support thread, or perhaps we can gather up the information needed to find out what is happening. The situation is like this; I fly a lot of planes. Recently it seems like that's what I spend most of my time doing. This means that I also tend to land my planes on some pretty unforgiving terrain, and since at least 1.0.2 I've discovered some sort of 'phantom acceleration' that causes me to go from slowing down, or a near stop, to suddenly having about 32m/s of speed and violently pitching upwards.

I have a few theories but I noticed something on my most recent landing, pressing B actually caused me to speed up. So I quickly released it and pressed it again, and I resumed slowing down. I think I've pretty much narrowed it down to, if not the brakes, perhaps it is the Fixed Landing Gear. I thought at first maybe it's causing some sort of 'spring' force that propels me upwards, but it may only be happening while the brakes are applied. Has anyone else experienced this type of behavior? It isn't all that rare for me, it happens on pretty much any landing.

[Motokid600]

Yes. Happened to me a few weeks back. All stock at the time. Using those fixed landing gear. When trying to land on rough terrain upon hitting the brakes my craft accelerated significantly. I noticed it only happened on the edge of a hill. If I waited and rolled over the hill the brakes then worked. But if I hit the brakes as I crested the hill it was like a catapult.

[Hyomoto]

I thought it might be a slope issue, but it seems to happen going both up and downwards. Going down the issue seems slightly complicated by your brakes no working and KSP's lack of friction causing you to accelerate wildly out of control. Of course, trying to land on a downhill slope is somewhat of a misnomer anyways.

So let me ask this, have you had this happen with any of the other landing gears?

[Motokid600]

Can't say. I'd have to test it out. Maybe get some reproducible procedures and try them again with the other, retractable legs. I wonder if the steerable leg is a culprit too.

[sal_vager]

You might want to try Claws fix here.

[Motokid600]

Ah, well there ya go. Thanks Sal.

[Hyomoto]

I'm already using his fixes; can you point out the specific one you are talking about, Sal? This isn't an issue with the brakes being useless, it's that they are causing phantom accelerations, or at least that seems to be what is happening.

[xtoro]

I've had similar happen to me in the air with landing gear retracted, just using airbrakes. One of my planes gets pulled upwards, another always gets pulled to the right, every time to the right, even though it's perfectly symmetrical... I have a feeling it's not only a landing gear braking problem, but braking in general.

[Hyomoto]

As far as that goes, there are long standing bugs in landing gear where compression causes them to bend or tweak just enough to cause you to roll out on the runway. It's extremely frustrating though it seems to be somewhat better now. I can say from experience it still exists though. There are other things that could be at play there as well, having your engine above your CoM will cause it to pitch forwards, which can cause undesirable effects during braking.

I've been trying out some other landing gear and they seem to work just nicely, I'll have to do more tests to be sure but it does seem to only be the Fixed landing gear, at least as far as causing this particular issue.

[Vanamonde]

I haven't noticed an acceleration, but I have noticed brakes taking a bizarrely long time to slow some of my planes. But not all of them, and it doesn't seem to be related to the mass of the craft.

[luizopiloto]

you have to set the break torque...

[Temeter]

Brakes work well for me (better than pre1.0), as long as I increase the break torque. Otherwise they are far to weak.

[LittleBlueGaming]

Yeah, I had that problem when I was trying to investigate the anomaly right by KSC. I was rolling over to it about 15m/s, turned on the brakes and quickly accelerated, and quickly met the ocean.

Only noticed it with the medium landing gear.