Subject Change: Docking Port Magnetic Kraken Drive

[selfish_meme]

So I was building some hinges and trying different variations to get the effect I wanted, I just want the parts to separate so I set the decoupler force to 0, by the way I have done this with a couple of decouplers and then tried adding the I beam for heft. 0 force is a lot more force than I want!

Edit: it's the Docking ports, not the decouplers. Has been tested to work with all ports. Craft file in thread, only works on ground so far, is a great rover engine, BlueCanary has made it throttleable.

Edited August 9, 2015 by selfish_meme

[Yukon0009]

Strange, the decouplers even at 100 percent force shouldn't do that.

[selfish_meme]

Strange, the decouplers even at 100 percent force shouldn't do that.

That's what I thought, I initially thought it was a problem with a type of decoupler so I changed them, which required a decent rework. It's fair to say the phantom force of small white radial decoupler continued after it left the launch pad and continued accelerating across the grass.

hmm, I'm trying to think how to use this?

[LethalShade]

You just discovered a new Kraken powered engine.

[selfish_meme]

You just discovered a new Kraken powered engine.

I'm wondering if it has to do with the docking ports, the first decoupler is supposed to allow it to turn, the second decoupler just has a cubic strut at the back that prevents the docking ports coming together till the turn is finished. It might be the magnetic force between the decouplers which means, yes I have discovered a new Kraken drive.

[RandomRyan]

2nd generation of The Phantom Warp Drive!

[Wjolcz]

Seems like some sort of phantom forces to me. Either that or docking port magnet-propelled contraption.

[Yukon0009]

Come to think of it, has anyone tested the classic K-Drive (landing legs) in 1.0.x?

[yorshee]

Because the decoupler isn't a part of the craft anymore, it's considered a separate object and thus the two things can actually collide with each other. I think what's happening is the decoupler is trying to separate from the rest of the craft because it's clipped in a little bit, but in the process it's dragging the rest of the thing along with it. Try offsetting the decoupler a fraction so it isn't clipping into anything.

[selfish_meme]

Stuck some wheels on it, confirmed it keeps accelerating, at least till it hits the water. I guess I cam going to have to upload the craft file for people to test.

[Majorjim!]

Stuck some wheels on it, confirmed it keeps accelerating, at least till it hits the water. I guess I cam going to have to upload the craft file for people to test.

So to be clear, what is happening here? You changed the decoupler force to 0 using tweakable everything mod?

EDIT:

Looking at the video it is the magnets in the docking ports causing it. Can you test to confirm that?

[Yukon0009]

Nope it's stock now. Been there since 1.0.

[Majorjim!]

Nope it's stock now. Been there since 1.0.

Decoupler force? LOL I never noticed. So it's the docking port magnets causing the force right.

[BlueCanary]

This is awesome. How much acceleration can you get? Enough to lift weight? A star wars type repulsorcraft that works like this would be the coolest thing ever.

[selfish_meme]

Seems to be, also seems to be limited to ground, got some airplane wheels and wings on it, launched it from the runway. Works as expected but the force does not seem to be evident once the wheels leave the ground, it is also affected by the torque input, i.e. slows down when you have a direction button pushed, I have two probes now, I will change root part and see if it remains.

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So far top speed has only been about 60m/s (water usually gets in the way)

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It might be possible to turn this into a Kraken drive, would be handy in space for a 0 fuel drive, but I don't think it's gonna be launching anything big. Little probes could use it though. I will upload a test craft for you all.

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Let's hope it's not something one of my mods or install has produced, if someone could confirm that would be great download

[BlueCanary]

Haven't tested it much but it looks like acceleration does stop in the air, hyperedited into orbit it is non functional. That might just be the lack of gravity though.

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Made my own version to prove it's the docking ports doing it, functions about the same as yours:

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So it looks like it doesn't work in the air, but doesn't care about gravity either - it functions just the same with hack gravity on, implying it's just ground contact not large acceleration from gravity it cares about. Next stop, why?

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Really don't understand this. In the air, nothing. Touch the ground, instant acceleration.

[selfish_meme]

Haven't tested it much but it looks like acceleration does stop in the air, hyperedited into orbit it is non functional. That might just be the lack of gravity though.

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Made my own version to prove it's the docking ports doing it, functions about the same as yours:

http://i.imgur.com/KORF7r0.jpg

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So it looks like it doesn't work in the air, but doesn't care about gravity either - it functions just the same with hack gravity on, implying it's just ground contact not large acceleration from gravity it cares about. Next stop, why?

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Really don't understand this. In the air, nothing. Touch the ground, instant acceleration.

Elcano challenge!

[BlueCanary]

Elcano challenge!

My thoughts exactly!

But now it looks like it doesn't work on water either. This whole thing just doesn't make any sense, especially since the docking port magnetism that powers it works in space too.

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It looks like power increases the closer the two docking ports are, if that helps anything. By using control surfaces to block the docking ports from touching instead of cubic octagonal struts I've been able to make a throttleable one, and by using landing legs one you can turn off, but not restart for some reason.

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And now by just shifting those control surfaces a little it seems the opposite is true. This is all so odd, anyone know how to tame the kraken?

Edited August 8, 2015 by BlueCanary

[Sharpy]

So far top speed has only been about 60m/s (water usually gets in the way)

Rotate 180 degrees in SPH.

[BudgetHedgehog]

Yeah, don't ever tweak the force to 0. Weirdness ensues. Go for the lowest you can without hitting 0, that'll get you the closest you can get.

[EladDv]

Still testing with 2.5 Sr. docking ports- i dont think it's magnetism

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or at least it's special for the Jr. ports

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nope i got the same effect with normal ports

[selfish_meme]

I wonder if this is the Kraken that strikes so many bases on Mun and Minmus?

[klesh]

Yeah, don't ever tweak the force to 0. Weirdness ensues. Go for the lowest you can without hitting 0, that'll get you the closest you can get.

I tweak almost all of my decouplers to zero, relying on lowered-thrust & fuel sepratrons to gently pull my stages away, ala Bob Fitch. Never really had an issue. What have you experienced?

[BlueCanary]

So I guess the next step is to make this more controllable - reliably throttleable, and a way to shut it down and restart for saving and loading. Using landing legs which can be retracted so the ports connect works, but no way to restart. Has anyone figured out why it only works on land yet?

[BlueCanary]

So I've been looking at the docking node module in monodevelop, and I've found a few things that may be of interest:

-Restarting drives could be very difficult. There's a variable called "minDistanceToReengage", set to 1f, which I think means that once the ports have docked they have to be moved 1 meter apart before magnetism applies again, so that you're ships don't redock themselves on undock. I'm currently working on another way to restart drives, so I'll see how that goes.

-The variable "acquireForce", which I assume determines the amount of magnetism, is set to 2f by default. I think this means all the docking ports have the same magnetism strength, so a Jr port based drive should be as powerful as a Sr based one. I am by no means sure about this though.

-The variable "acquireRange" is set to 0.5f by default, so half a metre should be the max distance between docking ports for the drive to work. I guess this could be used for a sort of clutch or neutral gear.

-There is also an "acquireTorque" variable, set to 2f, which I assume refers to the torque that lines up docking ports. I don't know what this could be used for, but I'm sure there's some way to exploit it.

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First ever warp drive equipped pickup truck: