Antennae revealed on Squadcast

[passinglurker]

I think it would look fine if they just made it white instead of dark gray.

You do realize the libraries worth of joke books you are opening yourself up to with this statement right? either way it's one thing to argue about balance, stats, ram efficiency, and overall art quality, but being picky about the color is simply asking too much if you don't like the look find and install a mod. AIES and Tantares have many stock alike antenna to choose from.

[Zucal]

You do realize the libraries worth of joke books you are opening yourself up to with this statement right? either way it's one thing to argue about balance, stats, ram efficiency, and overall art quality, but being picky about the color is simply asking too much if you don't like the look find and install a mod. AIES and Tantares have many stock alike antenna to choose from.

Disliking a crucial part of the new part is an entirely valid criticism. In addition, many people don't like to use mods, and essentially discouraging feedback about the design in favor of using a third-party ramshackle solution isn't a great idea.

[cantab]

Yeah, I'm in the ugly camp. It's not been modelled or textured badly, I just don't like how it looks. I know spacecraft are under no obligation to look good, but still, I can see myself wanting to avoid that antenna as it is. Like Layered said, a lighter colour scheme on the texture would probably help a lot, and bring it more in line with most of the other antennas.

[passinglurker]

Disliking a crucial part of the new part is an entirely valid criticism. In addition, many people don't like to use mods, and essentially discouraging feedback about the design in favor of using a third-party ramshackle solution isn't a great idea.

Even critics are not beyond criticism mind you.

I'm not opposed to feedback when it matters (again balance, stats, ram efficiency, and overall art quality) but something as non-crucial as color is simply to petty to make the artists go back and change something when he could be doing other work on 1.1. the line where one's criticism of stock is valid or where they should be told to just use a mod is not black and white and well defined. So I can accept and support his criticism if he thinks its over or underpowered, takes too much ram for what it does, or looks generally low quality, but when his problems are so small that he says "its fine except for this one thing" we pass a point of diminishing returns.

Everyone will have one thing wrong with it and changing that one thing to make it right for some will make it wrong for others so at this point my response is "Deal with it or use a mod"

Also AIES and Tantares are hardly ramshakle, and need I remind you roverdude is also essentially one of these 3rd party sources the only difference is that he has a contract (and he doesn't sleep...)

[J.Random]

Very constructive criticism...

Here's constructive criticism: when I look at this antenna, I imagine imperial TIE fighter instead of any KSP craft I've made _ever_. It would probably look better if dish was a wireframe, but AIES variant still has better animation with its double 90+180 degrees hinges. The "broomstick handle" comparison, I guess, comes from the lack of detail in the area where support beam connects to the dish. Other dishes have either thick transceiver supports (in one case they're doubled which looks incredibly ugly) or, say, a commutotron-thingie sticking outwards of the focal point, looking useless.

On the code side, I expect that the bug with antennas folding themselves and locking in the folded state after science transmission will never be fixed.

Edited September 12, 2015 by J.Random

[passinglurker]

Here's constructive criticism: when I look at this antenna, I imagine imperial TIE fighter instead of any KSP craft I've made _ever_. It would probably look better if dish was a wireframe, but AIES variant still has better animation with its double 90+180 degrees hinges. The "broomstick handle" comparison, I guess, comes from the lack of detail in the area where support beam connects to the dish. Other dishes have either thick transceiver supports (in one case they're doubled which looks incredibly ugly) or, say, a commutotron-thingie sticking outwards of the focal point, looking useless.

On the code side, I expect that the bug with antennas locking in the unfolded state after science transmission will never be fixed.

Obligatory

Roverdude is no dummy the man does his research

[The_Rocketeer]

I'm excited to see new stock parts and chuffed to bits that KSP is still getting plenty of attention from the devs post release. If you don't like how they look, don't use 'em!

[J.Random]

Obligatory

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/32/Hubble_01.jpg

Roverdude is no dummy the man does his research

AIES author does it better:

[Zucal]

Even critics are not beyond criticism mind you.

Goes for you too

How is the color scheme not part of the overall art quality? I and several others think it looks kinda hideous as is, and are offering criticism about it. Changing the colors shouldn't be awfully time-intensive, considering 1.1 is entering QA soon and the majority of RoverDude's work on the new comm/antenna system is probably done.

And regardless, the solution to problems with the stock game shouldn't have to be "Use a mod."

[Red Iron Crown]

I'd appreciate it if we could dial back the discussion of each other in this thread. By all means share your thoughts on the new part (whether positive or negative), but please keep it constructive and respect the opinions of others.

[Bloody_looser]

AIES author does it better

AIES antennae look like plastic bowls.

[passinglurker]

AIES author does it better:

http://41.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lqebpmmz1h1qzvby8o2_1280.jpg

tsk there is just no pleasing you. Do you honestly expect them to cherry pick from every mod? Do you realize the sort of controversies that could result from that? The amount of time the core dev team would have to spend simply negotiating and checking everyone's work? If you feel they do it better then you can just install the mod yourself all that matters for stock is that the part is functional, efficient, ( and doesn't look like it's made out of cheap plastic seriously what is up with these AIES parts they are all way to shiny did one of the kerbals have an accident with the polishing wax? )

EDIT: err... scratch all that I got ninja'd by red crown

@Zucal: real quick I agree "use a mod" is no proper answer when the issue is a matter of game play, but color is a matter of tastes and is much more subjective. I think the part gets the job done well enough that stragglers would be better served by the modding community at least until we see a release anyway

Edited September 12, 2015 by passinglurker

[RoverDude]

On a side note, I do read these threads to observe feedback. And a small pro-tip, things presented in a constructive way (i.e. 'the shade of grey appears a bit darker than stock') will receive considerably more attention, whereas posts who's sole contribution to our shared conversation is 'Hideous' or 'SuPaK4rB4lZ mod did it better!' will pretty much be disregarded.

So while it may make you feel good about yourself to vent in a non-constructive way, it will promptly remove you from the dialogue and feedback loop.

[Hotaru]

Me, I like the model just fine but I have to agree with others about the color. I don't dislike it (actually I think it looks kind of cool) but it doesn't fit well with other stock parts, including the other new antennas. It's actually not the dark gray that bothers me so much as the red trim, there aren't any other stock parts that look like that. I'd say black or white trim would make it fit a bit better, or just make the whole thing white/light gray like the others.

A little off-topic, but one thing I'd really love to see, honestly, is a rework of the Communotron 88-88 (the big folding one), I've never liked the look of that one. I'd love to see a more realistic depiction of a TDRS or Galileo type folding dish, folding into a tube about the same length as the dish's radius rather than semi-magically contracting into a tiny little box. (That might actually be a good mod project to have a try at making myself, come to think of it. Wouldn't take too long.)

[Randazzo]

Considering how ludicrous the vast majority of KSP vessel designs are, I feel secure in saying that this antenna is not going to be the thing that ruins a design aesthetic. It's no more or less ugly than any of the other antennas we have.

[regex]

Not gonna lie, that looks bloody ugly

Agreed. AIES has a similar one that looks so much better. I really wish these new parts followed a more clean aesthetic.

[StarStreak2109]

On a side note, I do read these threads to observe feedback. And a small pro-tip, things presented in a constructive way (i.e. 'the shade of grey appears a bit darker than stock') will receive considerably more attention, whereas posts who's sole contribution to our shared conversation is 'Hideous' or 'SuPaK4rB4lZ mod did it better!' will pretty much be disregarded.

So while it may make you feel good about yourself to vent in a non-constructive way, it will promptly remove you from the dialogue and feedback loop.

My feelings exactly! If it is not too late to put things on the wish list, would it be possible to make a "modern" style antenna as well for Orion-styled craft?

[razark]

If broomsticks can be used as fake tail-guns in WWII war planes, then broomsticks can be used in antennas as well.

Broomsticks are approved for rocket plane usage by Yeager Himself.

[davidy12]

The three you saw before (and reposted above) are your relay antennas. The new antenna is very small (0.5m diameter dish) and as many folks have noted, a kerbalized version of real antenna with features/homage to the hubble, apollo, and soyuz.

(edit)

So without going into too much detail (NDAs and such), the little foldable one you see in this post is meant to complement the other deployable antennas (i.e. the three existing ones you have in game now, only two of which actually have dishes).

(double edit)

And all of this is because once the antenna diversity feature is in, just plunking a whip antenna on your ship and calling it a day will no longer cut it So I need to make sure we have an appropriate stable of antennas available in stock to support the feature and it's mechanics.

Roverdude, just curious, do you have 1.1 (beta, alpha whatever) on your computer? And what will the antenna be like? Like remote tech or something?

[OddFunction]

I love how the Squadcast transcription has 3 pages of comments but a discussion on the aesthetics on a single antenna reaches five pages LOL

Personally I think the thing looks fine. Even if it is ugly, we have like 10 other antennas to choose from. No biggie.

Edit:

Roverdude, just curious, do you have 1.1 (beta, alpha whatever) on your computer? And what will the antenna be like? Like remote tech or something?

I'm not roverdude but yes they have the latest version on their computers.

[ThatGuyWithALongUsername]

I... I don't know. The colors seem to be just a little bit off for stock, but I can't really tell how it will look with the stock parts...

[Xeldrak]

Ah, sure - they release something like this once I'm allmost through my apollo-program remake. Would have been a good CSM antenna.

[ThatGuyWithALongUsername]

On a side note, I do read these threads to observe feedback. And a small pro-tip, things presented in a constructive way (i.e. 'the shade of grey appears a bit darker than stock') will receive considerably more attention, whereas posts who's sole contribution to our shared conversation is 'Hideous' or 'SuPaK4rB4lZ mod did it better!' will pretty much be disregarded.

So while it may make you feel good about yourself to vent in a non-constructive way, it will promptly remove you from the dialogue and feedback loop.

Hmm, okay, well, for starters, the gray is fine IMO. But the red feels wrong somehow. I thinks its the big red ball on the end.

'SuPaK4rB4lZ?'

[worir4]

I like it! I think it will work well as an early on antenna in the tech tree. Maybe it will drain a load of power but has a large range.

[regex]

'SuPaK4rB4lZ?'

It did it better.

Fundamentally I think the criticism comes down to the "soul" of KSP. Is it a semi-serious, light-hearted spaceflight simulator or is a cartooney disaster simulation where the protagonists build spaceships out of junk? I feel like Porkjet's parts, and a lot of the earlier parts (55-gallon drums notwithstanding), follow the former aesthetic while Roverdude's follow the later. Maybe that's just my interpretation. I prefer the clean lines and elegant feeling of the early antennas while the new ones feel and look really clunky, like they're just way too heavy to even attach to my roof for satellite TV. vOv I like the AIES interpretation of that particular antenna. Can't put my finger on it but it doesn't look like it's half-rusty. Spaceship parts are built in a cleanroom.

And because that's a personal preference thing and because everyone is going to have a strong opinion one way or the other, I feel like any criticism of that sort will be ignored. The part is already made, the aesthetic cast, anything else will just be adjustment.