[1.2 - 1.4] Real Scale Boosters, 0.16 (2018-03-12)

[Ninadragonborn]

Just now, Theysen said:

How many times do we need to say this? The engines of THIS particular pack are NOT MEANT TO BE USED with the common decouplers from the stock game. They are specifically made for the rocket they are representing so you need the parts of this rocket to build the replica. 

ok so your rocket have decoupler in the tech tree inside the game i mean do this mod add its own decoupler or i need another mod for this

if not at least tell me how to modify your engine part to use common decoupler 

i am new to adding mod with engine and parts so sorry if i am not expert 

[Norcalplanner]

23 minutes ago, Ninadragonborn said:

ok so your rocket have decoupler in the tech tree inside the game i mean do this mod add its own decoupler or i need another mod for this

if not at least tell me how to modify your engine part to use common decoupler 

i am new to adding mod with engine and parts so sorry if i am not expert 

Please open up the game in sandbox mode and load one of the included pre-made rockets to see how the included decouplers and interstages work with this mod. They attach to hidden nodes inside the appropriate tanks for each rocket.

[Ninadragonborn]

1 hour ago, Norcalplanner said:

Please open up the game in sandbox mode and load one of the included pre-made rockets to see how the included decouplers and interstages work with this mod. They attach to hidden nodes inside the appropriate tanks for each rocket.

thanks i think i see how it works but it make it very hard because some of the parts are later in the tech tree will some engine are earlier available

so i can't  use some engine in upper stage until i get the needed part 

is there no way to make engines to work with normal decoupler like many other mod so it become easier in earlier game 

 instead of waiting for the needed part for that engine 

Edited December 4, 2016 by Ninadragonborn

[NecroBones]

 

Sorry for coming in late on the discussion, as I'm not usually online much over the weekend. Thanks everyone for trying to help.

 

But yes, as everyone's been pointing out, the engines in this pack are designed to work with this pack's interstages and tanks. They don't attach inline like the stock tanks. This is by design, as it's more realistic to how the actual rockets work in the real world. I had to make a design choice early on, and favored historically-correct assembly for these rockets.

 

[Ninadragonborn]

On 12/6/2016 at 10:11 PM, NecroBones said:

 

Sorry for coming in late on the discussion, as I'm not usually online much over the weekend. Thanks everyone for trying to help.

 

But yes, as everyone's been pointing out, the engines in this pack are designed to work with this pack's interstages and tanks. They don't attach inline like the stock tanks. This is by design, as it's more realistic to how the actual rockets work in the real world. I had to make a design choice early on, and favored historically-correct assembly for these rockets.

 

i had done something i modified all engine to be able to use the normal decoupler and not just your mod but also soviet rocket spacex rocket mod and its amazing i launch rocket using a combination of soviet Soyuz capsule  and spacex engine and this mod engine you can not imagine it's amazing to see them work with each other sorry if i had to modify your mod and 2 other mod but i just use them for my self not no create a new mod 

i wish you best of luck and hope for future upgrade on mod as new game version come out 

[gonzo98x]

May I request a rocket?

The rocket in question and its stages is the Juno I

FASA had it. Also, most accurate.

RN Rockets has the Juno II but has the Baby Sergeants upper stages though they are the wrong size and dimensions. Each motor should be 43.5 inches tall (1.1049 meters) and 6 inches (.1524 meters) in diameter. The single and 3x group should provide 1800 lbs for each motor. The 11x should provide 1500 each or 16,500 total for the stage. No data for weight could be found.

Bluedog Design Bureau has the upper stage as well but their Baby Sergeants are wayy off and are more of a spiritual recreation for stock.

 

It would be nice to be able to use one pack for all the rockets in the US launch history but I understand there's a lot of work involved.

[captinjoehenry]

Can we please have the full scale Nexus?  That giant post Saturn rocket that can launch 1,000 - 2,000 tons and weighs in at either 12,000 or 24,000 tons.

[SciMan]

I just remembered that there was another mod that added the Convair Nexus, so I looked it up. It's thread on the KSP forums can be found here.

Unfortunately it hasn't been updated in quite a while, but AFAIK it was a "parts only" mod. At most, it might need some MM patches to bring it up to current KSP standards.

[captinjoehenry]

4 hours ago, SciMan said:

I just remembered that there was another mod that added the Convair Nexus, so I looked it up. It's thread on the KSP forums can be found here.

Unfortunately it hasn't been updated in quite a while, but AFAIK it was a "parts only" mod. At most, it might need some MM patches to bring it up to current KSP standards.

Yeah I have that mod and it is really sweet.  I just want a full sized Nexus not a scaled down one  

 

[NecroBones]

 

Wow yeah, the Nexus is pretty nuts. A diameter of 61m (for the larger one) would certainly be huge. Juno would be cool too. That one would fill a nice historical niche in a (relatively) small size. I'll add these to the wish-list.

 

[captinjoehenry]

On 12/13/2016 at 9:16 AM, NecroBones said:

 

Wow yeah, the Nexus is pretty nuts. A diameter of 61m (for the larger one) would certainly be huge. Juno would be cool too. That one would fill a nice historical niche in a (relatively) small size. I'll add these to the wish-list.

 

For a load of details about the NEXUS check out Aerospace Project Review v3n1 : http://www.up-ship.com/eAPR/ev3n1.htm

[delta wee]

I'm using KSP 1.2 with Real Solar System and Real Fuels, and all the engines in RSB are saying that they need liquid oxygen and kerosene as propellants, even the engines that are supposed to use liquid hydrogen such as the J2.

[NecroBones]

On 1/9/2017 at 8:16 AM, delta wee said:

I'm using KSP 1.2 with Real Solar System and Real Fuels, and all the engines in RSB are saying that they need liquid oxygen and kerosene as propellants, even the engines that are supposed to use liquid hydrogen such as the J2.

 

That's all controlled on the RF/RO side of things, rather than on my side. I'd point it out to them.

[Phineas Freak]

On 1/9/2017 at 3:16 PM, delta wee said:

I'm using KSP 1.2 with Real Solar System and Real Fuels, and all the engines in RSB are saying that they need liquid oxygen and kerosene as propellants, even the engines that are supposed to use liquid hydrogen such as the J2.

That one is really weird because:

• RSS does not mess with the parts.
• RF does not include any patches for RSB.
• RSB does not have RF patches.
• RO is not installed (you would see a ton of changes to that engine)

Did you install any packs like RFStockalike? Can we see your mod list?

[delta wee]

14 hours ago, Phineas Freak said:

That one is really weird because:

• RSS does not mess with the parts.
• RF does not include any patches for RSB.
• RSB does not have RF patches.
• RO is not installed (you would see a ton of changes to that engine)

Did you install any packs like RFStockalike? Can we see your mod list?

I do have RFStockalike installed. Here is my mod list:

[Phineas Freak]

@delta wee OK, so it seems like that RFStockalike does not have configs for RSB (as indicated by the GitHub repository).

Can you also post a log file so to see how and when the RSB parts are patched? A wild bet would be that a generic patch is modifying some things when it should not.

Edited January 12, 2017 by Phineas Freak

[delta wee]

On 1/12/2017 at 3:51 AM, Phineas Freak said:

@delta wee OK, so it seems like that RFStockalike does not have configs for RSB (as indicated by the GitHub repository).

Can you also post a log file so to see how and when the RSB parts are patched? A wild bet would be that a generic patch is modifying some things when it should not.

I've attached a link to the KSP.log file I get after I launch KSP and it fully loads.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hqxalw10x0ht29j/KSP log RSB bug.log?dl=0

[Phineas Freak]

@delta wee finally traced it: seems like that RFStockalike has a "Jet_modularEngines.cfg" file and for some reason this config patches every single engine module that uses "LiquidFuel" and "Oxidizer" to use "Kerosene" and "LqdOxygen" instead.

Offending patch link

If you remove these two patches then eveything should be good.

[delta wee]

1 hour ago, Phineas Freak said:

@delta wee finally traced it: seems like that RFStockalike has a "Jet_modularEngines.cfg" file and for some reason this config patches every single engine module that uses "LiquidFuel" and "Oxidizer" to use "Kerosene" and "LqdOxygen" instead.

Offending patch link

If you remove these two patches then eveything should be good.

I removed lines 1-23 from my "Jet_modularEngines.cfg" file and now all the RSB engines say they need "liquid fuel" and "oxidizer" as propellants. Is that expected since the Realism Overhaul configs for Real Fuels hasn't been released yet for KSP 1.2?

[Phineas Freak]

Thought that your problem was the wrong propellants but as i see now i was wrong...

11 minutes ago, delta wee said:

Is that expected since the Realism Overhaul configs for Real Fuels hasn't been released yet for KSP 1.2?

The RO configs have nothing to do with RF or RFS. Well, to make it more specific: the RO engine configs are exclusive for RO. If you select to play without RO then you need a pack (like RFS) to make them compatible with RF. The problem here is that nobody has ever made engine configs for RSB to be included either with RF or the RFS compilation.

TL;DR RSB is not directly compatible with RF and somebody has to write configs for it to be so. In the bright side, RSB is 100% accurate with real hardware, meaning that LF+OX will have the same results as LH2+LOX (but without boil-off).

[delta wee]

11 hours ago, Phineas Freak said:

Thought that your problem was the wrong propellants but as i see now i was wrong...

The RO configs have nothing to do with RF or RFS. Well, to make it more specific: the RO engine configs are exclusive for RO. If you select to play without RO then you need a pack (like RFS) to make them compatible with RF. The problem here is that nobody has ever made engine configs for RSB to be included either with RF or the RFS compilation.

TL;DR RSB is not directly compatible with RF and somebody has to write configs for it to be so. In the bright side, RSB is 100% accurate with real hardware, meaning that LF+OX will have the same results as LH2+LOX (but without boil-off).

Would LF+OX have the same low density of LH2+LOX, resulting in larger tanks being required for the same delta-v compared to denser propellants such as kerosene+LOX?

[Phineas Freak]

15 minutes ago, delta wee said:

Would LF+OX have the same low density of LH2+LOX, resulting in larger tanks being required for the same delta-v compared to denser propellants such as kerosene+LOX?

Mathematically no, the stock KSP densities are too high compared to real propellants. The end result (payload to orbit) is comparable to real (and not 100% as i wrote, mea culpa). Stage fractions will not be the same of course, as the densities differ.

Edit: the best thing would be to open a request to the RFStockalike thread (or GitHub and) request to add support for RSB. Or manually strip the RO engine configs out of RO and add them to as MM patches to RFS.

Edited January 14, 2017 by Phineas Freak

[delta wee]

19 hours ago, Phineas Freak said:

Mathematically no, the stock KSP densities are too high compared to real propellants. The end result (payload to orbit) is comparable to real (and not 100% as i wrote, mea culpa). Stage fractions will not be the same of course, as the densities differ.

Edit: the best thing would be to open a request to the RFStockalike thread (or GitHub and) request to add support for RSB. Or manually strip the RO engine configs out of RO and add them to as MM patches to RFS.

I was able to manually add some configs for the engines I was interested in, namely the SSME, the J2, and the RL10-B2. Those seemed to work, but I still need to figure out how to get the Isp values right.

On another note, is there a way to snap an RSB engine into the middle of the bottom of a tank when putting it into an RSB decoupler? Whenever I try to attach one I always get it slightly off center.

Edited January 15, 2017 by delta wee

[Phineas Freak]

3 hours ago, delta wee said:

On another note, is there a way to snap an RSB engine into the middle of the bottom of a tank when putting it into an RSB decoupler? Whenever I try to attach one I always get it slightly off center.

I believe that if you hold the engine before attaching it and press the Mod key (Alt for Windows) it will only attach on normal nodes (and ignore any kind of surface attachment).

[delta wee]

14 hours ago, Phineas Freak said:

I believe that if you hold the engine before attaching it and press the Mod key (Alt for Windows) it will only attach on normal nodes (and ignore any kind of surface attachment).

Using the Alt key doesn't seem to work. It makes the engine attach to the top of the tank above it, inside the tank.