WW2 BAD-T 2 - BDA AI Dogfight Tournament [SEMIFINALS]

[Brice04]

Just sent my submission !

 

A Heinkel He 112 B-0 Replica :

 

Part count : 32

Mass : 8.5t (full tank)

Armament : 2x 7.62mm MG

                      2x 20mm cannon

Edited February 29, 2016 by Brice04
Update

[TangerineSedge]

Considering this is the Arcadia Mk 3, and my current submission is the Mk XVII, I think I may as well show you the first functioning version of my aircraft, and when I say functioning, I mean the first to be able to fly without crashing, which is useful. I might end up returning to the Mk 3 if I can't tweak the Mk XVII (Would then be XVIII or XIX) to become more manoeuvrable. Oh, and did I mention that since the Mk XIII, the Arcadia series of fighters has been a heavy fighter, just barely able to enter legally

You can probably imagine the design of the Mk XVII now, and you are probably wrong . One thing I will say is, the only identical parts are the wings and cockpit. Even the booms have undergone changes.

Edited February 28, 2016 by TangerineSedge

[Pds314]

Ugh. So many technical issues with recording. It's like, "Oh, I'll just use shadowplay!" wait, Nvidia can't make that record whatever is on the screen and it doesn't recognize actual patched fullscreen as a real fullscreen app?

"Howabout bandica- Wait that's a 10 min limit."

"Windows has built-in recording software, I'll use that!"

(15 minutes later)

"Yes! Beat the dummy 1v3, 3 kills in 3 minutes!"

[Windows is not responding, would you like to shut it do-]

Edited February 28, 2016 by Pds314

[Pds314]

Incidentally, Wizard 35kN+5*13mm machinegun = 100 pts. If it manages a good lock-in, it can shred the dummies pretty easily. More often, it'll get long range scratch damage on the wings and tail that ends up making enemies get stuck circling at low altitude.

And if course the Wizard weighs only 1 tonne, and the 13mm weighs only 16.6 kg, so you need at least 1.45 tonnes more to meet weight requirements, giving you plenty of room to design reasonably heavy airframes or large wings.

Edited February 28, 2016 by Pds314

[DoctorDavinci]

18 minutes ago, Pds314 said:

Ugh. So many technical issues with recording. It's like, "Oh, I'll just use shadowplay!" wait, Nvidia can't make that record whatever is on the screen and it doesn't recognize actual patched fullscreen as a real fullscreen app?

"Howabout bandica- Wait that's a 10 min limit."

"Windows has built-in recording software, I'll use that!"

(15 minutes later)

"Yes! Beat the dummy 1v3, 3 kills in 3 minutes!"

[Windows is not responding, would you like to shut it do-]

Get yourself a copy of OBS (Open Broadcast Software) ... the built in windows recorder has bad resolution even on high quality settings and ends up looking horrible as it 'artifacts' all over the place

[Pds314]

 

2 minutes ago, DoctorDavinci said:

Get yourself a copy of OBS (Open Broadcast Software) ... the built in windows recorder has bad resolution even on high quality settings and ends up looking horrible as it 'artifacts' all over the place

I've been messing with OBS. It seems to not properly record the fullscreen window.

Edited February 28, 2016 by Pds314

[DoctorDavinci]

16 minutes ago, Pds314 said:

I've been messing with OBS. It seems to not properly record the fullscreen window.

Right click in the sources window of OBS then add a new game capture and name it what you want

Right click on the new game capture in the sources window and click properties and then check the first box (Stretch image to screen)

Edited February 28, 2016 by DoctorDavinci

[Pds314]

23 minutes ago, DoctorDavinci said:

Right click in the sources window of OBS then add a new game capture and name it what you want

Right click on the new game capture in the sources window and click properties and then check the first box (Stretch image to screen)

That may help.

On the subject of the challenge, how well does the Bad Company maintain energy? It seems like most of my designs can CHOOSE between good L/D (12+) and good lift (8+ Gee). This ends up requiring that I put fairly big engines on my craft, which ends up meaning I balance them with heavy tails, which ends up meaning they have a dumbell-like mass distribution.

 

I mean, sure, the 2*Vickers Widshed Sailplane of doom has those characteristics at once, but it has poor acceleration and a turning circle of like 800 meters.

Edited February 28, 2016 by Pds314

[DoctorDavinci]

23 minutes ago, Pds314 said:

On the subject of the challenge, how well does the Bad Company maintain energy? It seems like most of my designs can CHOOSE between good L/D (12+) and good lift (8+ Gee). This ends up requiring that I put fairly big engines on my craft, which ends up meaning I balance them with heavy tails, which ends up meaning they have a dumbell-like mass distribution.

 

I mean, sure, the 2*Vickers Widshed Sailplane of doom has those characteristics at once, but it has poor acceleration and a turning circle of like 800 meters.

The Bad Company gains velocity quick and holds it's speed well. I have some spoilers on her which enables her to slow down fairly well too

Give you a tip .... you want the CoM of your main wing to be somewhere in the vicinity of the CoM of the craft (in the yellow sphere). This will aid you tremendously in setting up your weight distribution and how it relates to handling. You can end up being able to shave a couple degrees off of your control surfaces which will increase your overall velocity vector

[tetryds]

@Pds314 

Enjoy being able to use shadowplay however you wish with your extra 10 frames per second or more.

The difference in framerate is insane, and KSP freezes when on the background so it doesn't use any resource.

Shadowplay not being able to record Unity games is an Unity's fault, not shadowplay's. It was caused by their lazyfix of the issue where games freeze when alt tabbed from, which caused problems on multiplayer games.

Yes, their fix was simply block anything from ever being reproduced at a true fullscreen mode, does not matter what you do, unless you use this fix you will be playing on windowed mode.

Pros:

- Free fps boost (want proof? Watch BAD-T 1 battles recorded on my laptop).

- Being able to use Shadowplay/ Share.

- KSP freezes when on the background, using virtually no resource other than RAM.

- Less tearing/stutter (may fix stutter some people experience with high specs pcs)

Cons:

- Game does not run on the background

- Cannot alt+tab during loading as it breaks loading.

- Screen flickers when alt tabbing like on any true fullscreen program.

Shadowplay is by far the best recording software I have ever used, the filesize is punny even on lossless 1080p 60fps recording, the quality is absurd and I have never noticed any performance impact, ever. So unless you are using multiple monitors or doing so much stuff that you rather have a poorer performance than wait a second of flicker during alt tabs, I see absolutely no reason to not use the fix.

Ps: this is how I record BAD-T on my laptop with 25+ fps flying 4 crafts at the same time and lots of visual effect mods.

[Pds314]

@Pds314 

Enjoy being able to use shadowplay however you wish with your extra 10 frames per second or more.

The difference in framerate is insane, and KSP freezes when on the background so it doesn't use any resource.

Shadowplay not being able to record Unity games is an Unity's fault, not shadowplay's. It was caused by their lazyfix of the issue where games freeze when alt tabbed from, which caused problems on multiplayer games.

Yes, their fix was simply block anything from ever being reproduced at a true fullscreen mode, does not matter what you do, unless you use this fix you will be playing on windowed mode.

Pros:

- Free fps boost (want proof? Watch BAD-T 1 battles recorded on my laptop).

- Being able to use Shadowplay/ Share.

- KSP freezes when on the background, using virtually no resource other than RAM.

- Less tearing/stutter (may fix stutter some people experience with high specs pcs)

Cons:

- Game does not run on the background

- Cannot alt+tab during loading as it breaks loading.

- Screen flickers when alt tabbing like on any true fullscreen program.

Shadowplay is by far the best recording software I have ever used, the filesize is punny even on lossless 1080p 60fps recording, the quality is absurd and I have never noticed any performance impact, ever. So unless you are using multiple monitors or doing so much stuff that you rather have a poorer performance than wait a second of flicker during alt tabs, I see absolutely no reason to not use the fix.

Ps: this is how I record BAD-T on my laptop with 25+ fps flying 4 crafts at the same time and lots of visual effect mods.

I tried for probably 4-5 hours. I get an fps counter but it doesn't record. I know shadowplay is THEE standard for low file size and near-negligible performance loss, whereas I've been having to record at quarterspeed via cheat engine to get Win10 recording to reach 60 fps. Four craft alone has been getting ~20, but windows brings it down to high single digits and bandicam to low teens.

 

I tried using shadowplay on other games and that worked. I think I might have botched the patching.

[Dwerto]

I just record with shadowplay in desktop mode without any sort of fix or patch. Just go into the shadowplay settings and check the box that says allow desktop capture. (I have full screen enabled for KSP)

[gridghost]

1 hour ago, Dwerto said:

I just record with shadowplay in desktop mode without any sort of fix or patch. Just go into the shadowplay settings and check the box that says allow desktop capture. (I have full screen enabled for KSP)

I do the same, and If you choose to record with micorphone and choose to have it always on, you get pretty good sound too.

Spoiler

 

 

[Pds314]

9 hours ago, Dwerto said:

I just record with shadowplay in desktop mode without any sort of fix or patch. Just go into the shadowplay settings and check the box that says allow desktop capture. (I have full screen enabled for KSP)

Laptop. Desktop mode doesn't exist.

[Pds314]

7 hours ago, gridghost said:

 

  Hide contents

 

 

That is a very interesting fight. The planes seem quite floaty. Reminds me of old aero.

Edited February 29, 2016 by Pds314

[ferram4]

They are heavily reliant on leading edge flaps that are probably deflecting quite a bit to keep the wing from stalling and the excessive amounts of power these engines have to keep things going.  Also, that plane is basically nothing but wing.

And heads up to anyone who's interested in the dev AI, you really, really want to grab the newly updated version from the link earlier in the thread; I managed to get some simple boom-and-extend working, along with slightly more opportunistic target selection so it will heavily influence battles how the AI fights now.  Also, it cares about friendly fire.  Really.  No more of it killing your teammates because they gently floated in front of the guns.  Now, if they rush-jump in front of them they'll still get killed, but at that point, they deserve it.

[Wolf123]

27 minutes ago, ferram4 said:

They are heavily reliant on leading edge flaps that are probably deflecting quite a bit to keep the wing from stalling and the excessive amounts of power these engines have to keep things going.  Also, that plane is basically nothing but wing.

And heads up to anyone who's interested in the dev AI, you really, really want to grab the newly updated version from the link earlier in the thread; I managed to get some simple boom-and-extend working, along with slightly more opportunistic target selection so it will heavily influence battles how the AI fights now.  Also, it cares about friendly fire.  Really.  No more of it killing your teammates because they gently floated in front of the guns.  Now, if they rush-jump in front of them they'll still get killed, but at that point, they deserve it.

Will slow, but more maneuverable fighters, try to boom-and-extend or will only fast fighters try and do this?

[ferram4]

They don't care whether they're more maneuverable or not; if they've got a speed advantage they'll try to boom-and-extend.  Turnfighting is something that only planes at a speed disadvantage in an engagement will try to do, although if an ally ends up in trouble his teammates should stop boom-and-extending and immediately turn in to try and help.

[gridghost]

I have to test the new AI, then  Both for this and other designs. I've been stuck at trying to make turn-fighters with ability to B&Z, but all they do is getting into tighter and tighter circles... and boom. 

[TangerineSedge]

I'm currently up at the Mk XXV...and I thought I was joking when I said this could reach version L (25 and 50 for anyone who doesn't know Roman Numerals because they aren't as sad as me )

[The Optimist]

The propellers have really bad torque ._.

 

EDIT: it just seems to be one of them.

Edited February 29, 2016 by The Optimist

[tetryds]

@The Optimist You mean thrust?
No, not really, they have very high thrust for their mass and size.
You may be used to KAX engines, or jet engines, real propellers are nowhere near that poweful, you should try KAX with AJE.
Overpowered propellers would defeat the purpose of this tournament, it would be all about whoever is lighter and can turn more without caring about energy at all.

[The Optimist]

8 minutes ago, tetryds said:

@The Optimist You mean thrust?
No, not really, they have very high thrust for their mass and size.
You may be used to KAX engines, or jet engines, real propellers are nowhere near that poweful, you should try KAX with AJE.
Overpowered propellers would defeat the purpose of this tournament, it would be all about whoever is lighter and can turn more without caring about energy at all.

Torque. As in rotational movement. It seems that the B40 Falcon engine has a tendency to make my planes do rolls. While they're on the ground.

[tetryds]

@The Optimist Are you sure? On my testings there were no such a thing as induced torque.
Did you manually update the Firespitter plugin? You should use the one that comes with the pack.
Can you send a screenshot of what is happening? Does it happen with other engines?
This is very intriguing.

[The Optimist]

1 minute ago, tetryds said:

@The Optimist Are you sure? On my testings there were no such a thing as induced torque.
Did you manually update the Firespitter plugin? You should use the one that comes with the pack.
Can you send a screenshot of what is happening? Does it happen with other engines?
This is very intriguing.

I'll see if it happens this time.