Poll: Should KSP be rolled back to 1.0.5 until 1.1.x bugs are fixed?

[The_Rocketeer]

Self-explanatory question really. Personally, I'm curious to see how many in this community would want this.

Edit: FWIW, for those who haven't seen/read other recent posts of mine, this isn't something I personally desire (I voted option 4). I'm simply interested in what the community proportions for and against would be considering the furore of complaints in various threads.

***

TO EVERYBODY POSTING ON THIS THREAD

Please try to refrain from belittling one another and derailing the thread. This is a contentious issue and your views are your own, not everybody is going to agree with you. I don't think it serves any purpose to get the thread locked for being too inflamatory.

Please just vote and let the poll speak for itself.

Edited May 29, 2016 by The_Rocketeer

[Mastikator]

I was gonna vote the second option but I'll never turn down the opportunity to be a smarmy git

[The_Rocketeer]

Actually, I just realised this probably raises a pertinent question:

If you own KSP but didn't buy it on Steam, can you still activate it on Steam anyway and get the 'last stable release beta' that way? I recently found that many of my non-Steam games could be officially added to my Steam account... (and I don't mean just creating a shortcut on the games list). @SQUAD?

Edited May 28, 2016 by The_Rocketeer

[Frank_G]

1.0.5 was a pain on OSX... 1.1.2 is not. The update is awesome and the bugs will be fixed soon. I like 1.1.2. best

Edited May 29, 2016 by Frank_G
too many german words sneaked in ;)

[Red Iron Crown]

You can still download 1.0.5 from the KSP store, not sure why the poll is implying that only Steam users have access to it.

[The_Rocketeer]

5 minutes ago, Red Iron Crown said:

You can still download 1.0.5 from the KSP store, not sure why the poll is implying that only Steam users have access to it.

Is that so? My bad - as a Steam user I would not have known. Will adjust top post.

FWIW, I'm not sure this is widely understood - many complaints have I seen of people who have been 'forced to give up KSP by 1.1.x bugs'.

Edited May 28, 2016 by The_Rocketeer

[Waxing_Kibbous]

I'm probably an anomaly in that I upgraded my computer instead of my KSP so it's like an upgrade in that respect I play 1.05 yet occasionally still dabble in 1.1.2, but I think I'll put it back into the oven until it is done cookin'.

[samstarman5]

Feel free to go to an earlier version. No reason to ask the developers to go out of their way for you.

1.1.2 has its issues but they actually aren't terrible.  I actually expected something like this with such a big change going to 64 bit.

[m4v]

IMO what is done is done. However Squad should stop this obnoxious habit of releasing because of a marketing goal instead of a quality goal.

Edited May 29, 2016 by m4v

[Barefoot Friar]

I'm in 1.0.5 (and I get extra smarm, since I have versions stockpiled all the way back to 0.21) and I will not be using 1.1.x until it is fixed.  I may even wait until 1.2.  1.0.5 looks beautiful, runs great, and has yet to crash on me, even though I'm running nearly a dozen mods.  That said, if 1.1.2 works better for you, yay!  You do you.

[nosscire]

I can only speak for myself, but 1.1.2 appears to have less bugs then 1.0.5

1.1.0 should have been what was released on release day. It's a well polished product that works on modern computers. Sure, there are bugs, but as far as I have found, few game breaking ones, compared to 1.0.5 which simply could not be modded to a large extent, due to memory leaks.

Thus, I don't think that it should be rolled back. On the flip side I don't think it should have been released as a full release until 1.1

[steve_v]

1 hour ago, nosscire said:

Sure, there are bugs, but as far as I have found, few game breaking ones, compared to 1.0.5 which simply could not be modded to a large extent, due to memory leaks.

Unless you are running GNU/Linux x86_64, in which case we have gone from completely stable at 8+GB RAM usage / 100+ mods (I have never seen 1.0.5 crash) to crashfest / window geometry roulette / graphical glitches etc. etc. Performance improvement perhaps, but stability has gone down the toilet.
Nevertheless, no point in officially "rolling back" to 1.0.5 now... Though that's what I'll be playing until this mess is sorted out.

1 hour ago, nosscire said:

On the flip side I don't think it should have been released as a full release until 1.1

I don't think it should have been released until random crashing fixed. And it still hasn't been.

Edited May 29, 2016 by steve_v

[cantab]

Hell no. The improvements in KSP 1.1 are dramatic. Double the framerate on large ships is not something that should be rolled back.

That said, 1.0.5 should absolutely remain available because 1.1.x is so buggy, and in particular it will not even run on some (Linux) systems that ran 1.0.5 fine. Unless those issues are definitely fixed in a future 1.1.x revision, I'd say 1.0.5 should still be available as a previous version even after KSP 1.2 is release.

I feel confident in saying that it will be a long time before 1.1.x random crashes waste more of my life than 1.0.x godawful performance already has.

[SpaceplaneAddict]

Please try not to complain about it being released early, as some users were getting a bit "restless" as to not having the pre-reease, ya?

*Determination.

[steve_v]

Just now, SpaceplaneAddict said:

Please try not to complain about it being released early, as some users were getting a bit "restless" as to not having the pre-reease, ya?

Pre-release was for testing (supposedly), to find bugs (which it did), so they could be fixed (which they weren't).
I was keen to get the prerelease only for this purpose, as I expected bugs - particularly in the Linux build. IMO it should still be in pre-release and everyone, not just steam users, should still be testing it.

Release is for playing, which I won't be, due to bugs not fixed during pre-release.

[SpaceplaneAddict]

*shrug*

idk then

*Determination. . . 

[GDJ]

I can see the frustration about the game as it is, but isn't it a bit late for a rollback? The genie is out of the bottle. Lets stop whining and work together to fix it (that means more proper bug reports and less "WAA WAA WAA")

[Guest]

The only time a software rollback should ever be considered if it:

1. Has major security issues (does not apply to KSP)
2. Is so unstable that the majority of the user base cannot use it (1.1 is not at this level)
3. Is unlikely to be successfully fixed (1.1 bugs can be fixed, it's just going to take time
4. It can't be resolved with a simple bug fix

I really wish there was an "absolutely not" option on the poll.  If there was, that's what I would have chosen.

Now let's lower our pitchforks and get on with life.  Maybe instead of asking about rolling back to 1.0.5, we can spend the time trying to figure out how to replicate bugs?

Why are we even still talking about this?  I'd expect this a few weeks ago, but not anymore.  Software isn't easy.  Some of these bugs occur only on specific machines, and with specific mods, etc.  1.1 is released, and that's it.  End of story.  Just wait patiently like everyone else for 1.1.3.

[steve_v]

5 minutes ago, CliftonM said:

Now let's lower our pitchforks and get on with life.

I'm just keeping my pitchfork nice and sharp for when <consults crystal ball> 1.1.3 doesn't fix the (probably Unity related) crashing... I would love to be proven wrong about this, but I'm not optimistic.
Pretty sure game engine instability is going to fall into category 3 and/or 4...

5 minutes ago, CliftonM said:

Why are we even still talking about this?

Because it isn't fixed yet? Or perhaps because the hyped performance improvements are, as far as I am concerned, irrelevant in light of the instability? Seriously, the game won't even start on some AMD graphics hardware.

Edited May 29, 2016 by steve_v

[Andem]

I'm hearing a lot of people throwing around the word whining lot, and It's genuinely starting to liquid me off. It's really condescending, and even if that isn't your intention, could we please refrain from treating each other like toddlers? Thank you.

[razark]

19 minutes ago, CliftonM said:

Maybe... we can spend the time trying to figure out how to replicate bugs?

Sounds like a perfectly reasonable request.

 

For a game in beta.

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, steve_v said:

I'm just keeping my pitchfork nice and sharp for when <consults crystal ball> 1.1.3 doesn't fix the (probably Unity related) crashing... I would love to be proven wrong about this, but I'm not optimistic.
Pretty sure game engine instability is going to fall into category 3 and/or 4...

If it's instability with the engine, take it up with the Unity people.

18 minutes ago, steve_v said:

Because it isn't fixed yet? Or perhaps because the hyped performance improvements are, as far as I am concerned, irrelevant in light of the instability? Seriously, the game won't even start on some AMD graphics hardware.

See above.  This is also probably a Unity thing.  Unity 4 worked with some computers of which Unity 5 does not.

[Cunjo Carl]

   For me, a huge part of the charm of KSP is that it's still a living game, growing and changing all the time. That won't stop me from keeping backups or griping from new bugs, but I get the feeling that most people are willing to relearn their bug workarounds for the joy of new goodies. I do find it ironic that we're able to finally computationally handle large rockets in the same release as they made everything go floppy! I only switch back to 1.05 when I want to work on my big rockets :).
   Count me in for the smarmy git option, thanks!

[m4v]

52 minutes ago, CliftonM said:

If it's instability with the engine, take it up with the Unity people.

No. Take it to the guys that decided to release their game with a point version of a engine that was known to be unstable.

Edited May 29, 2016 by m4v

[Guest]

1 minute ago, m4v said:

No. Take it to the guys that decided to release their game with an engine version that was known to be unstable.

Ok.  If that's what you want. @HarvesteR.  Please explain to my friend here as to why Unity was decided as the best engine to run KSP with.