Why is this game still on the market place?

[Columbia]

11 hours ago, ChillingCammy said:

Corporate greed keeps this title in the market

Corporate greed? 

It's called being a business.

Also, Squad's working on it. Can you not wait a little bit? Or give them a chance to redeem their game's current reputation?

[PB666]

On August 18, 2016 at 2:33 PM, ChillingCammy said:

Seriously, why even sell the game on console at this point. Its not doing anyone any good.

 

Also, shutting down angry threads suggests you guys can't handle the heat. Let us be angry. I feel you guys should have been prepared for this as I am confident you knew full well it was unplayable. We have waited so long for this game on console, to wait another few months (which I am pretty confident it will take before the game is playable) for release would have been nothing. Instead a lot of people are unhappy with an unfinished product.

 

Just bad PR all around.

The alternative question is why are people still playing on consoles, most of the people i know know that have good PCs don't have stacks of consoles in thier closests. 

[magnemoe]

6 hours ago, severedsolo said:

In all fairness, the ability to load and save without corrupting data is the MINIMUM you should expect from a game. According to the internet, we've had this ability since 1987 on consoles (probably longer on PC, but this discussion is about consoles). 30 years later, I would kinda expect to have it fully worked out by now. Yes games have bugs, but this is a pretty serious one and by the sounds of it, literally makes the game unplayable.

I can't believe I'm saying this but I think the OP is totally within his rights to request a refund. However, at the same time, you have to understand that I'm sure Squad would, if it were within their power, but it's not, it's from whoever you bought the game from, (PSN, or whatever the Xbox equivalent is).

As Alshain said though, bear with them. Squad always come good in the end (but I understand this is your first experience, so you don't have the same faith we old PC hands do).

This, now an pretty standard way to avoid corruption is that the game saves persistent.sfs as persistent.sfs.tmp or something, then its saved it delete the old persistent.sfs or even better rename persistent.sfs into persistent_previous.sfs and overwrite the old previous version then it renames persistent.sfs.tmp to persistent.sfs, its just a few lines code 
Benefit is that if game crashes during saving you only loose progress back to last save, not the entire game, making an backup of previous autosave help with corrupted data and lock in situations. 
 

[MalfunctionM1Ke]

KSP is such a BAD game that I smashed the 3d-printed figurine that Squad sent me...
... by dropping it on the floor...
... on a field 250km away...
... with a helium filled balloon...
... from the stratosphere...
... that took me a year to build...
... and taught me alot...

Yeah, such a bad game *irony off*

[Columbia]

On 8/19/2016 at 3:33 AM, ChillingCammy said:

Also, shutting down angry threads suggests you guys can't handle the heat. Let us be angry. I feel you guys should have been prepared for this as I am confident you knew full well it was unplayable. We have waited so long for this game on console, to wait another few months (which I am pretty confident it will take before the game is playable) for release would have been nothing. Instead a lot of people are unhappy with an unfinished product.

The reason forum rules are here and why moderators lock threads and delete posts is to avoid any further flamewars or anything that might cause mass violation of forum rules. Which, in turn, are there to prevent users from attacking others and causing heat.

Also, I'll stress my point again for many others: You have a full right to be disappointed and request a refund, but take your pitchfork-tossing and rioting somewhere else.

 

Edited August 21, 2016 by Columbia

[ZooNamedGames]

36 minutes ago, Columbia said:

The reason forum rules are here and why moderators lock threads and delete posts is to avoid any further flamewars or anything that might cause mass violation of forum rules. Which, in turn, are there to prevent users from attacking others and causing heat.

Also, I'll stress my point again for many others: You have a full right to be disappointed and request a refund, but take your pitchfork-tossing and rioting somewhere else.

 

Columbia calm down. He's left the topic. So save your comments for a better thread. Your responding to something he said 3 days ago.

[Columbia]

46 minutes ago, ZooNamedGames said:

Columbia calm down. He's left the topic. So save your comments for a better thread. Your responding to something he said 3 days ago.

It's in the hope that some others who feel the same way as him read it. Hence, "for many others."

[nascarlaser1]

1 hour ago, Columbia said:

The reason forum rules are here and why moderators lock threads and delete posts is to avoid any further flamewars or anything that might cause mass violation of forum rules. Which, in turn, are there to prevent users from attacking others and causing heat.

Also, I'll stress my point again for many others: You have a full right to be disappointed and request a refund, but take your pitchfork-tossing and rioting somewhere else.

 

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Yes, I have rejoined this for day 2.

[Stargate525]

Am I the only one who finds it funny that this is happening AGAIN? This is at least the third time I've seen massive backlash from a stupid decision Squad has made. Same song, different verse, still no change as the dancemaster keeps pounding out the same rhythm.

[Alshain]

32 minutes ago, Columbia said:

It's in the hope that some others who feel the same way as him read it. Hence, "for many others."

But the end result will be to get people riled up again now that the thread has calmed down.

[nascarlaser1]

if everyone would just stop, wait and be patient, squad can and will get this fixed and done with.

[Tex_NL]

7 minutes ago, nascarlaser1 said:

if everyone would just stop, wait and be patient, squad can and will get this fixed and done with.

Apparently ignorance truly is bliss. You haven't been around long enough to know SQUAD does not actually have good record in that area.
I've been playing KSP since 0.18 (late 2012). There are bugs that STILL have not been fixed and items STILL designated as 'work in progress'. Things might get fixed, but don't be surprised it it takes a few years.

[nascarlaser1]

2 minutes ago, Tex_NL said:

Apparently ignorance truly is bliss. You haven't been around long enough to know SQUAD does not actually have good record in that area.
I've been playing KSP since 0.18 (late 2012). There are bugs that STILL have not been fixed and items STILL designated as 'work in progress'. Things might get fixed, but don't be surprised it it takes a few years.

They've fixed the wheel issue, also they are releasing bug updates for the consoles constantly. Let us not forget that this was JUST released. I agree fully with @Columbia

[m4v]

We all saw it during pre-release, gamebreaking bugs were reported but the update was released anyway, full of bugs. Bugs that the dev team is still fixing (or waiting to get fixed by Unity) today.

Squad problem isn't lack of QA, is a management that doesn't give a rat's ass about quality and forces impossible release dates to the developers.

 

13 minutes ago, nascarlaser1 said:

Let us not forget that this was JUST released.

so how long is acceptable to wait? My KSP install has been broken in Linux for like 4 months now.

[nascarlaser1]

3 minutes ago, m4v said:

We all saw it during pre-release, gamebreaking bugs were reported but the update was released anyway, full of bugs. Bugs that the dev team is still fixing (or waiting to get fixed by Unity) today.

Squad problem isn't lack of QA, is a management that doesn't give a rat's ass about quality and forces impossible release dates to the developers.

 

so how long is acceptable to wait? My KSP install has been broken in Linux for like 4 months now.

ummm.... no comment

 

[Tex_NL]

25 minutes ago, nascarlaser1 said:

They've fixed the wheel issue, also they are releasing bug updates for the consoles constantly. Let us not forget that this was JUST released. I agree fully with @Columbia

That's just it. They patch it, they add a bandaid to stop the bleeding but they do not fix the issue.

6 minutes ago, nascarlaser1 said:

ummm.... no comment

 

Come on, be a man. Answer his question. Or have you suddenly realized he is right?

[ChillingCammy]

I lied! After reading some comments I have returned to full rage mode! ENGAGÉ PITCH FORKS

 

Just kidding.

 

I've read through and I thought I would re explain what happened, why I think squad let me down, how I understand the faith the PC players put into Squad but how new players shouldn't be feathered and tarred for being outraged that their game is unplayable. 

 

1. I feel let down  as I really loved this game, but all of that wind has been taken out of my sails as my 40+ hour career has been corrupted. I was diligently backing up my data to PSN hourly but when my back up was also corrupted, I was SOL

 

As I am a console player I cannot dig around in my systems memory to repair corrupt saves. 

Game saving is a cornerstone of ANY modern game. Playing a little Fallout last night I noticed lots of little bugs (damn radscorpions popping out of mid air, or gliding unmoving from afar) , but as I understand that games are hard to make I shrugged off these hickups and continued to enjoy myself. My 80+ hour Fallout save didn't get corrupted last night, guys!

 

2. KSP is simply brilliant.  It's a fantastic, super creative and original title (probably why I rushed to my corner store for a PSN card in the middle of the night to buy it!). If I were a PC gamer (I don't want to argue the merits of PC vs Console, my reality is PS4) who had been a part of this community for a while I would likely defend it. I would care about it. So I hear you guys being unhappy about my posts and I have already apologized and promised to take er down a notch.

 

3. Dispite the trust the old players have in squad please realise I didn't sign up for an early release or pre-order.  I thought I had bought a finished title. PLEASE recall my fallout example. I don't expect any game to be immaculate nor do i need gold lined airstrips or a night club under the VAB. I just wanted it to be enjoyable. 

 

 

 

The mods have warned me a couple of times for flying off the handle too, @Columbia. The have set a line the sand at name calling and personal attacks on users and Squad. They have not discouraged me from speaking my mind (throwing pitchforks). Ultimately if this questions discussion is unagreeable with any one maybe this thread aught to be avoided.

 

This is going to sound like I am kissing ass when I am honestly just impressed,  considering how hot headed I have been on the forums the mods have given me plenty of slack. Reflects well on the forum.

Edited August 21, 2016 by ChillingCammy

[nascarlaser1]

57 minutes ago, Tex_NL said:

Come on, be a man. Answer his question. Or have you suddenly realized he is right?

I am a man, but I did not even know there was a Linux version till he said that. so I have 0 answer to it. I am not saying he is right, nor am I saying he is wrong, since I never knew about Linux having a version.

[Alshain]

20 minutes ago, nascarlaser1 said:

I am a man, but I did not even know there was a Linux version till he said that. so I have 0 answer to it. I am not saying he is right, nor am I saying he is wrong, since I never knew about Linux having a version.

What about the Windows version?  Did you know that existed because I haven't been able to play it since 1.1 came out.

What I'm trying to say is we are all frustrated, but I still feel Squad will eventually fix it.  I certainly would have liked it to be a lot sooner, but they had to waste time releasing 1.1.3 so we could have another broken version.  In the end we just have to be patient because there is nothing else we can do about it.

Edited August 21, 2016 by Alshain

[ChillingCammy]

Maybe I was mistaken, some PC players do seem sick of the spin cycle.  Here's hoping new hires and entry to console marks a new chapter and a new attitude with their higher management 

[nascarlaser1]

13 minutes ago, Alshain said:

What about the Windows version?  Did you know that existed because I haven't been able to play it since 1.1 came out.

What I'm trying to say is we are all frustrated, but I still feel Squad will eventually fix it.  I certainly would have liked it to be a lot sooner, but they had to waste time releasing 1.1.3 so we could have another broken version.  In the end we just have to be patient because there is nothing else we can do about it.

what's wrong with 1.1? I use it and it is perfect for me. I didn't even bother updating to 1.1.2 or higher. I'm pretty sure I don't even have 1.1.1, though I did get the game around the time it was released so I may have that by default.

[Alshain]

3 minutes ago, nascarlaser1 said:

what's wrong with 1.1? I use it and it is perfect for me. I didn't even bother updating to 1.1.2 or higher. I'm pretty sure I don't even have 1.1.1, though I did get the game around the time it was released so I may have that by default.

1.1 was a crash fest.  1.1.1 was a crash fest 1.1.2 fixed most the crashed, but without wheels, legs, and landing gear your activities are so severely limited there's little point in playing.  You can build a space station, but that gets old fast.  So really, I can't play.  Legs, Gear, and Wheels are just too big a component to go without.  1.1.3 didn't fix anything.

Edited August 21, 2016 by Alshain

[RocketSquid]

While I agree that the console bug would be devastating, taking the game off of the market, even temporarily until fixed, would solve little.

SQUAD is doing the best they can, but at this point they seem almost understaffed and are trying to simultaneously fix the console bugs and update PC edition to fix bugs there. I have had the fortune of a nearly bugless existence as far as the stock game goes, but I can understand what it feels like to lose everything (I'm on my third computer since getting KSP, and had at least one game broken by an update).

While the QA team catches a lot of bugs, they do miss some, either due to lack of time for testing, differences in play style and/or specs, or a simple matter of fixing one bug creating another (PC has loads of that).

If you don't want to wait, I recommend playing around in sandbox and either becoming highly familiar with the game or doing crazy stuff for fun.

[Jovus]

1 hour ago, ChillingCammy said:

I've read through and I thought I would re explain what happened, why I think squad let me down, how I understand the faith the PC players put into Squad but how new players shouldn't be feathered and tarred for being outraged that their game is unplayable. 

...

Game saving is a cornerstone of ANY modern game. Playing a little Fallout last night I noticed lots of little bugs (damn radscorpions popping out of mid air, or gliding unmoving from afar) , but as I understand that games are hard to make I shrugged off these hickups and continued to enjoy myself. My 80+ hour Fallout save didn't get corrupted last night, guys!

Frankly, this is a good point. If I had, for example, gone and bought No Man's Sky, messed around on it for a week, and then tried it again only to find out that there was such a large gamebreaking bug that all my progress was erased and I had to start all over again, I'd be pretty cheesed. I'd feel like I got gypped. (Apologies to any Romani in the audience.) In fact, I wouldn't go through the trouble of making a forum account on that game's forum and sending in bug reports, etc. I'd just tell all my friends that it was a bad game from a bad studio and they shouldn't waste money on it. Especially not $50 (or whatever the price of KSP is on PS4).

1 hour ago, ChillingCammy said:

2. KSP is simply brilliant.  It's a fantastic, super creative and original title (probably why I rushed to my corner store for a PSN card in the middle of the night to buy it!). If I were a PC gamer (I don't want to argue the merits of PC vs Console, my reality is PS4) who had been a part of this community for a while I would likely defend it. I would care about it. So I hear you guys being unhappy about my posts and I have already apologized and promised to take er down a notch.

Hey, thanks for that. It hurts when someone comes along and says, "Hey, this thing you love! It's a piece of crap!" So this bit is important for me. You're not saying KSP is terrible; you're saying it's terrible you can't play KSP because someone screwed up somewhere. You'd happily play KSP, but you can't. You're like us, only you're upset because you've been denied your chance. (Sorry for putting words in your mouth. If that's wrong, call me out on it.)

1 hour ago, ChillingCammy said:

3. Dispite the trust the old players have in squad please realise I didn't sign up for an early release or pre-order.  I thought I had bought a finished title. PLEASE recall my fallout example. I don't expect any game to be immaculate nor do i need gold lined airstrips or a night club under the VAB. I just wanted it to be enjoyable.

This is an important part too. Those of us who've been around for a while - since, say, at least 0.25 - are kind of still in the alpha expectations stage. We've grown used to the way Squad handles its development cycles. We don't exactly like that Squad releases seriously buggy software - see comments above - but we're used to it. Somewhat.

Compare: if a new expansion to WoW comes out and it makes the game unplayable to even 1% of their playerbase, that's an all-hands-on-deck nobody-goes-home-until-this-gets-fixed emergency. In this way, Squad appears still to be behaving like a indie game studio with a playable alpha. Which is a thing they aren't, anymore.

Further, understand that, because of Squad's 'unique' approach to development, these forums have seen a lot of heat and light over their existence. So people around here who are old hands generally fall into two camps: the 'I told you so,' camp, (of which I'm often one), and the, 'Stop ragging on Squad all the time,' camp. It's almost an automatic reaction at this point. It's no even that the first crowd thinks Squad can't do things right or the second thinks they can't do things wrong. It's just almost habitual at this point. (And for reasons. I'm not calling anyone irrational here.)

I'll say a couple things in Squad's defense. First, a large part of the botch is Flying Tiger's fault, not (directly) Squad's. Now, I don't know how legally or otherwise this works out. Maybe in order to get KSP onto consoles, they had to give Flying Tiger a lot more legal responsibility than they want to let on. Maybe not; maybe Flying Tiger is effectively just a sweatshop subcontractor. I don't know. What I do know is that this does partially absolve them, but there's the quite reasonable objection that, hey, maybe they should have gone with someone more reputable than a group of guys whose product line looks like this.

Secondly, to my understanding, a large part of the problem with pushing fixes out in a timely manner (and indeed, with release in the first place) has to do with the way the consoles regulate their available content. The whole console release in Europe thing is mind-boggling to me; maybe there's a similar, smaller problem going on here. If Squad were Ubisoft, I'd think they should have this ironed out and know the process, but when it's the first time you've done something, sometimes it's hard to know what you don't know until you trip over it.

Finally, for all we know maybe Squad is as frustrated about this as you are. They're obviously trying to help. They're just as obviously not getting it resolved in the seriously drop-everything-and-stay-awake manner this might call for. That might not be their fault, in the moment. A little patience might go a long way. Hopefully.

Still, again, I think you're ultimately right here. You shouldn't have to have a little patience when you pay $50 to play a game.

[nascarlaser1]

1 hour ago, ChillingCammy said:

2. KSP is simply brilliant.  It's a fantastic, super creative and original title (probably why I rushed to my corner store for a PSN card in the middle of the night to buy it!). If I were a PC gamer (I don't want to argue the merits of PC vs Console, my reality is PS4) who had been a part of this community for a while I would likely defend it. I would care about it. So I hear you guys being unhappy about my posts and I have already apologized and promised to take er down a notch.

Thank you for saying that. I shall stop adding my two cents now (so long as no one else says something I disagree with, in which case I will continue saying my opinion ). I originally hopped on this bandwagon yesterday because you were being mean to kerbal space program. Thank you for apologizing and explaining what you meant.