The American Plan to Sieze Salyut 7

[Jonfliesgoats]

Here is an interesting read:

http://www.thespacereview.com/article/2554/1

[p1t1o]

[Jonfliesgoats]

Exactly like that!

[kerbiloid]

3 hours ago, p1t1o said:

A pretty catalog of true old-style space fiction movies with samples, thank you.

[magnemoe]

3 hours ago, p1t1o said:

Why did they not use their engines? just getting an nice tumble would make them impossible to catch. 
First getting away and then doing an deorbit burn would also work. 

[monophonic]

40 minutes ago, magnemoe said:

Why did they not use their engines? just getting an nice tumble would make them impossible to catch. 
First getting away and then doing an deorbit burn would also work. 

They had no idea what was happening before it had happened. Even in space situational awareness is everything.

[wumpus]

4 hours ago, magnemoe said:

Why did they not use their engines? just getting an nice tumble would make them impossible to catch. 
First getting away and then doing an deorbit burn would also work. 

From the information in the wiki (needed a boost from Kosmos 1686, uncontrolled reentry), it might not have had any.  I would assume that the moment the Shuttle left KSC, Soviet planners would know exactly where it was going and realized if it was heading to Salyut 7 (especially after Reagan tipped his hand by suggesting a joint effort there (which would certainly allow NASA to publicly work on all sorts of Salyut 7 plans)).

Unless they had real drawings (and backfitted to what was made: I've certainly seen too many cases where the engineering drawings aren't *exactly* what was shipped.  I wouldn't be surprised if USSR design involved "manufacturing fixes the bosses don't need to know about") and could build the appropriate harness, the end results would be "throw the thing in the back of the truck and drive home".  Good enough for many things, but probably not space stations.

And since by that point the cold war had involved into a complex dance of bird for tat, I can only imagine what the Soviet response would be.  Perhaps blowing up one or more satellites and creating a big old mess of space junk.

[Elthy]

Did you all read the second part of the article?

[magnemoe]

4 hours ago, monophonic said:

They had no idea what was happening before it had happened. Even in space situational awareness is everything.

Yes, however some of the other pods who was snatched was aware of it. ground did also follow it was part of the plot. 
No the plot was not realistic

As for stealing salyut 7, who had been impossible if under control for the same reason, however the shuttle would be an an far worse situation being more fragile and against an unmanned ship the other side will loose anyway. 
Diplomatically taking an out of control spacecraft could be seen as salvage, an operational one even if mothballed would be piracy. 

And yes it would be very hard to do even with the buran. 

[Jonfliesgoats]

Well, the Russians were able to dock with Salyut 7, so the maneuvering would not have been terribly difficult.  Things like stabilizing the cargo in the shuttle bay would have been significant challenges.  Some system must have been in the works to do this, and that would have equated some very fast last-minute engineering.

Somewhere there are some retirees with a story to tell.

[kerbiloid]

8 hours ago, wumpus said:

I can only imagine what the Soviet response would be.

Spoiler

Telescopic, to unfit the crago bay.

[NSEP]

This happending AFTER Soyuz-Apollo? Hell no!

[Green Baron]

17 hours ago, magnemoe said:

Why did they not use their engines? just getting an nice tumble would make them impossible to catch. 
First getting away and then doing an deorbit burn would also work. 

Na. The screenplay script stated: evil gangster catches poor Russian kosmonauts and we need a doublezero agent to save the world.

... if i recall the right movie :-)

 

 

Edited December 6, 2016 by Green Baron

[magnemoe]

59 minutes ago, Green Baron said:

Na. The screenplay script stated: evil gangster catches poor Russian kosmonauts and we need a doublezero agent to save the world.

... if i recall the right movie :-)

Yes, was an mix of Russian and american spaceships. Think Soviet  first then US, one while astronaut was on eva, not sure if it was an US or Soviet, last was Soviet and it was tracked while trying to capture. Did not think of it at that time but after playing KSP I see how easy it would be to evade. 

An fairing like on the capture ship would be very nice for rocket ssto/ reusable upper stages. 

Edited December 6, 2016 by magnemoe

[Jonfliesgoats]

On evasion:

Anything really high can maneuver relatively easily compared to an object down low.  Oberth means even a modest random maneuvering schedule would rapidly run a lower, intercepting vehicle out of delta v.  I gues this means any vessel intended to intercept another, controlled vessel in orbit needs to have gobs of excess delta v in order to be successful.

Then again, forcing a high object to maneuver means you knock it offline from whatever function it was performing.

 

[kerbiloid]

The first captured object would be the last one. Because all future sats would become orbital mines.

[Nibb31]

28 minutes ago, kerbiloid said:

The first captured object would be the last one. Because all future sats would become orbital mines.

You can be pretty sure that US and Soviet Union didn't wait for an actual capture event to start fitting anti-tampering devices on their military sats.

Edited December 6, 2016 by Nibb31