totm may 2024 [1.12.x] - Modular Kolonization System (MKS)

[JamesonKerbal]

To clarify for myself for future reference, when setting up a WOLF infrastructure:

• Each batch of equipment needs to be its own vessel with (at a minimum) the WOLF parts you want, and a probe core (you can't ship a bunch of parts, drop them on the surface, then interact with the parts)
• The Depot must be installed first, and it must be installed alone. No building a massive WOLF infrastructure shipment with a Depot, Thrimming it to Minmus as a giant SSTO, then installing the whole lot. No other WOLF parts can be attached to the Depot vessel, not even a surface scanner.
• All the parts attached to the Depot or the extra WOLF parts you are bringing will disappear together. There's no bones spat out by the WOLF.
• If you are just starting, look at the smaller harvesters first. They require no power, which means you don't need to set up the whole infrastructure of power, and maintenance, and kernels, and life support, and food production just to get hydrates out of Lesser Flats.
• To get started, you'll want a lander or rover that can move around the world that you're WOLF-ifying with at least the Surface Scanning Module and the WOLF Transport Computer (and perhaps some capacity for MaterialKits from parts that you disassemble as you go)

@RoverDude are you going to need/want help with documentation?

 

Edited December 22, 2020 by JamesonKerbal

[Wookie699]

19 hours ago, RoverDude said:

 

Which container specifically?

Kontainer (1.25)  configured for  rare minerals   part value comes to -293,357  then beside it comes to +- 293.357

 

https://ibb.co/WxBhR3s link to screen shot on the container when recovered full 

 

[Cruesoe]

Does anyone use MKS in JNSQ, does it scale to the bigger system, are the number of days from USI life support affected?

Really want to go try this MKS / WOLF business but would like to stick to the bigger system if I can.

[modus]

Congratulations on the new release!

Just read both Google docs, head hurts now. Fun times ahead!

[RoverDude]

7 hours ago, JamesonKerbal said:

To clarify for myself for future reference, when setting up a WOLF infrastructure:

• Each batch of equipment needs to be its own vessel with (at a minimum) the WOLF parts you want, and a probe core (you can't ship a bunch of parts, drop them on the surface, then interact with the parts)
• The Depot must be installed first, and it must be installed alone. No building a massive WOLF infrastructure shipment with a Depot, Thrimming it to Minmus as a giant SSTO, then installing the whole lot. No other WOLF parts can be attached to the Depot vessel, not even a surface scanner.
• All the parts attached to the Depot or the extra WOLF parts you are bringing will disappear together. There's no bones spat out by the WOLF.
• If you are just starting, look at the smaller harvesters first. They require no power, which means you don't need to set up the whole infrastructure of power, and maintenance, and kernels, and life support, and food production just to get hydrates out of Lesser Flats.
• To get started, you'll want a lander or rover that can move around the world that you're WOLF-ifying with at least the Surface Scanning Module and the WOLF Transport Computer (and perhaps some capacity for MaterialKits from parts that you disassemble as you go)

@RoverDude are you going to need/want help with documentation?

 

1.  Yes.

2.  Correct - Depot first.

3.  Yup - it gobbles up everything, Kerbals and all.  Use the planner

4.  The downside with the small harvesters is less efficiency, but they can be used to jumpstart the minimal set of resources you need for the rest of the chains.   One trick is to figure out the end game via the planner, then work backwards to determine the resources you need, and do a series of smaller launches.

5.  That's a solid option.  Another is to go down the mass-depot route with a depot lander and attached scanner behind a decoupler so you can scan, then decouple off the scanner and make the depot.  Rovers are super efficient for surface routes.  Looking at step 4 is you can figure out exactly how much bandwidth you need in your transport routes.

And dear god yes I would kill for anyone to help with documentation!  If you're game, feel free to take the google docs and use them as a starting point for the wiki - those were pretty coffee fueled post-release.

 

 

4 hours ago, Wookie699 said:

Kontainer (1.25)  configured for  rare minerals   part value comes to -293,357  then beside it comes to +- 293.357

 

https://ibb.co/WxBhR3s link to screen shot on the container when recovered full 

 

Will take a look

 

4 hours ago, Cruesoe said:

Does anyone use MKS in JNSQ, does it scale to the bigger system, are the number of days from USI life support affected?

Really want to go try this MKS / WOLF business but would like to stick to the bigger system if I can.

USI-LS will work with different clocks, alternatively all of the LS parameters are configurable in the space center scene.  I have definitely ran MKS/USI-LS on larger scale systems

[notthebobo]

Thanks, @RoverDude for the new drop. Do you see a new Constellation release coming anytime soon, or are individual downloads the best way to go?

[RoverDude]

1 minute ago, notthebobo said:

Thanks, @RoverDude for the new drop. Do you see a new Constellation release coming anytime soon, or are individual downloads the best way to go?

Ask and ye shall receive 

https://github.com/BobPalmer/USI_Constellation/releases/tag/2020.12.22.01

 

[mcortez]

I haven't tried to build anything using the new KSP features.  Is the PackRat all updated so that it can be built in-situ with the new stock Cargo and Assembly features, or is KIS/KAS still going to be needed at this point? 

Val & Bob cruising in style, doing the first loop of the KSC Science gathering. 

Spoiler

 

[goldenpsp]

21 minutes ago, mcortez said:

I haven't tried to build anything using the new KSP features.  Is the PackRat all updated so that it can be built in-situ with the new stock Cargo and Assembly features, or is KIS/KAS still going to be needed at this point? 

Val & Bob cruising in style, doing the first loop of the KSC Science gathering. 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Let us know

I'm not sure anyone has tried yet.

[mcortez]

45 minutes ago, goldenpsp said:

Let us know

I'm not sure anyone has tried yet.

Looks like we're going to need Cargo and Inventory definitions for all the parts.

Cargo Part modules presumably define the stacking and volume parameters, and Inventory modules define slots and volume limits.

I tried using the EVA Construction mode, and I couldn't seem to move any of the Packrat's  parts, or the Sounding Rocket science parts.  But I could move around the stock thermostat and pressure sensor, so there must be a module to flag which parts can be worked with in EVA Construction mode.  Perhaps the Cargo Part module?

 

Spoiler

 

Edited December 22, 2020 by mcortez

[goldenpsp]

3 minutes ago, mcortez said:

Looks like we're going to need Cargo and Inventory definitions for all the parts.

Cargo Part modules presumably define the stacking and volume parameters, and Inventory modules define slots and volume limits.

I tried using the EVA Construction mode, and I couldn't seem to move any of the Packrat's  parts, or the Sounding Rocket science parts.  But I could move around the stock thermistat and pressure sensor, so there most be a module to flag which parts can be worked with in EVA Construction mode.  Perhaps the Cargo Part module?

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

@RoverDude has already stated he is working on converting KIS items to stock (storage and I presume otherwise).

[Ksp Slingshooter]

I have installed the latest MKS and I don't see any WOLF parts nor any UI's. What am I doing wrong? I'm playing in 1.8.1

[Moon Goddess]

CKAN won't install it because it says dependencies are out of date, is that expected?

[goldenpsp]

1 minute ago, Ksp Slingshooter said:

 I'm playing in 1.8.1

Possibly that?

[Ksp Slingshooter]

1 minute ago, goldenpsp said:

Possibly that?

MKS says that it is compatible from 1.8.0 to later versions in CKAN 

[goldenpsp]

Just now, Ksp Slingshooter said:

MKS says that it is compatible from 1.8.0 to later versions in CKAN 

I trust CKAN "compatible versions"   as much as I trust, well things I don't trust very much.  I may have missed @RoverDude explicitly stating it is compatible back to 1.8, but historically mods aren't several versions backwards compatible.

[JamesonKerbal]

9 hours ago, RoverDude said:

4.  The downside with the small harvesters is less efficiency, but they can be used to jumpstart the minimal set of resources you need for the rest of the chains.   One trick is to figure out the end game via the planner, then work backwards to determine the resources you need, and do a series of smaller launches.

The explosion of infrastructure from 1 small harvester to 1 large harvester is quite the shock

 

[TheBackIsBAck]

1 hour ago, Moon Goddess said:

CKAN won't install it because it says dependencies are out of date, is that expected?

Yup, it's because Firespitter is listed as compatible for 1.8.9 or something? so you need to enable mods for down to 1.8 to install MKS... Everything should work, least it did for me in 1.10 ^^

[RoverDude]

2 hours ago, mcortez said:

I haven't tried to build anything using the new KSP features.  Is the PackRat all updated so that it can be built in-situ with the new stock Cargo and Assembly features, or is KIS/KAS still going to be needed at this point? 

Val & Bob cruising in style, doing the first loop of the KSC Science gathering. 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

It will require an update.  It's on my short list (as I am looking at deprecating all KIS/KAS support and swapping to stock).

1 hour ago, mcortez said:

Looks like we're going to need Cargo and Inventory definitions for all the parts.

Cargo Part modules presumably define the stacking and volume parameters, and Inventory modules define slots and volume limits.

I tried using the EVA Construction mode, and I couldn't seem to move any of the Packrat's  parts, or the Sounding Rocket science parts.  But I could move around the stock thermostat and pressure sensor, so there must be a module to flag which parts can be worked with in EVA Construction mode.  Perhaps the Cargo Part module?

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Yep - this will be the work mentioned above   Plus PackRat needs new modeling anyway - kinda have to do it as it is the one mod my 11 year old asks for by name.

1 hour ago, Ksp Slingshooter said:

I have installed the latest MKS and I don't see any WOLF parts nor any UI's. What am I doing wrong? I'm playing in 1.8.1

GameData folder?  Manual install?

1 hour ago, Moon Goddess said:

CKAN won't install it because it says dependencies are out of date, is that expected?

What dependencies?  Literally the entire constellation got updated.

2 minutes ago, JamesonKerbal said:

The explosion of infrastructure from 1 small harvester to 1 large harvester is quite the shock

 

Indeed it is

1 minute ago, TheBackIsBAck said:

Yup, it's because Firespitter is listed as compatible for 1.8.9 or something? so you need to enable mods for down to 1.8 to install MKS... Everything should work, least it did for me in 1.10 ^^

Ah - I need to upload the Firespitter zip - my bad

[mcortez]

I tried a cheat of sorts, based on Atlas Gaming's Inventory for All mods -- but it didn't seem to work for me.  Maybe someone better versed in MM scripts could get it to work.

Spoiler

@PART[*]:HAS[@MODULE[ModuleKISInventory],!MODULE[ModuleInventoryPart]]
{
	MODULE
	{
		name = ModuleInventoryPart
		InventorySlots = #$../MODULE[ModuleKISInventory]/slotsX$
		@InventorySlots *= #$../MODULE[ModuleKISInventory]/slotsY$
		packedVolumeLimit = #$../MODULE[ModuleKISInventory]/maxVolume$ 
	}
	
}

@PART[*]:HAS[@MODULE[ModuleKISItem],!MODULE[ModuleCargoPart]]
{
	MODULE
	{
		name = ModuleCargoPart
		packedVolume = #$../MODULE[ModuleKISItem]/volumeOverride$
	}
}

 

 

@RoverDude awesome work as always, looking forward to the updates whenever you get to them!  Packrat is still a great bit of kit.  Both the Packrat and the Akita always make an appearance in my KSP careers.

[JamesonKerbal]

It's a pity we can't soft-start WOLF with reverse-hoppers that take a certain quantity of eg: MKS MaterialKits Per Hour and convert them into WOLF Material Kit Availability.

There is no biome on Minmus in my game which will allow the production of Transport Credits. Here's the minimal infrastructure required to support 1 Transport Module (43 parts, 157t):

To create resource routes between biomes requires Transport Credits. To produce Transport Credits requires all the resources.

Edit: forgot about the BioReactor which allows Agriculture Module -- Biomass --> BioReactor --> Chemicals or Polymers

Edited December 23, 2020 by JamesonKerbal
bioreactor is a thing

[TBenz]

13 minutes ago, JamesonKerbal said:

It's a pity we can't soft-start WOLF with reverse-hoppers that take a certain quantity of eg: MKS MaterialKits Per Hour and convert them into WOLF Material Kit Availability.

There is no biome on Minmus in my game which will allow the production of Transport Credits. Here's the minimal infrastructure required to support 1 Transport Module (43 parts, 157t):

To create resource routes between biomes requires Transport Credits. To produce Transport Credits requires all the resources.

 

I believe your best bet for kickstarting production would be to establish a depot on Kerbin that can produce Transport Credits, and then set up a transport route from Kerbin to Minimus. (In fact, I assume that is one reason that Depots on Kerbin get material kits by default, to overcome the bootstrapping issue).

Once you have established yourself better on Minimus, you can see about cutting off your reliance on Kerbin entirely.

The way WOLF works and the way the stock resource system works means that "reverse hoppers" would be very easy to cheat with. 

Edited December 23, 2020 by TBenz

[JamesonKerbal]

7 minutes ago, TBenz said:

I believe your best bet for kickstarting production would be to establish a depot on Kerbin that can produce Transport Credits, and then set up a transport route from Kerbin to Minimus. …

Now why didn't I think of that? It does after all mirror the bootstrapping I do with MKS: shipping DIY kits and MaterialKits to Minmus to set up my ground assembly facility from where I set up the mining infrastructure, then the Material Kits production, then the Specialized Parts and Machinery.

Now I just need a way to destroy the infrastructure I've already built.

Edited December 23, 2020 by JamesonKerbal

[notthebobo]

Is it a bug that the WOLF MHU-100 Bulk Harvester (Harvester_175) does not require power while the  WOLF MHU-500 Bulk Harvester (Harvester_375) requires 5 power?

Or is there a design reason I'm missing?

Screenshot

[JamesonKerbal]

21 minutes ago, notthebobo said:

Is it a bug that the WOLF MHU-100 Bulk Harvester (Harvester_175) does not require power while the  WOLF MHU-500 Bulk Harvester (Harvester_375) requires 5 power?

The MHU-100 basically destroys your resources. It consumes 5 "Abundance" and provides 2 "Available". The MHU-500 consumes 5 "Abundance" and produces 10 "Available".

I'm still figuring this out myself, but I can't think why I'd want to destroy that abundance given that shipping resources anywhere requires transport credits, and if you're going to set up a transport module you'll have the energy and kerbals to provide the inputs for the MHU-500 anyway.