[1.4.x] BDArmory Continued v1.2.2.2 [8/8/2018] + Vessel Mover, Camera Tools, BDMk22, Destruction Effects, Burn Together

[simtom]

Hello,

After a long time I decided to reinstall BD Armory and see what has changed. Everything went well apart from the Radar Warning Receiver. It did work the first time but when I loaded another aircraft it stopped working (as in not showing up anymore). I'm really not sure what caused this.

Another question I have (though not really related to this mod) is why KSP lags a lot when there are explosions. I've seen videos online where the game keeps running smoothly but that's not the case for my game. I do have everything maxed out though, so maybe there is one particular slider that has effect on this?

Last question, where can I find some example craft? I'm not that good at building my own. 

[XOC2008]

6 minutes ago, simtom said:

Hello,

After a long time I decided to reinstall BD Armory and see what has changed. Everything went well apart from the Radar Warning Receiver. It did work the first time but when I loaded another aircraft it stopped working (as in not showing up anymore). I'm really not sure what caused this.

Another question I have (though not really related to this mod) is why KSP lags a lot when there are explosions. I've seen videos online where the game keeps running smoothly but that's not the case for my game. I do have everything maxed out though, so maybe there is one particular slider that has effect on this?

Last question, where can I find some example craft? I'm not that good at building my own. 

Did you refresh the data? You added a new craft so you have to make sure that you refresh the data to receive from the radar source you specified.

Example craft come with BDA, as well as being able to find them on KerbalX.

[simtom]

56 minutes ago, XOC2008 said:

Did you refresh the data? You added a new craft so you have to make sure that you refresh the data to receive from the radar source you specified.

I'm not sure if this is related to my problem. I'm not trying to use the Radar Data Receiver, the Radar Warning Receiver is integrated into the Weapon Manager. 

UPDATE:
I do hear the sound effect of the radar. I just don't see it.

 

56 minutes ago, XOC2008 said:

Example craft come with BDA, as well as being able to find them on KerbalX.

Just checked the BDA folder and found four craft. I'll also take a look at KerbalX.

Edited August 13, 2017 by simtom

[XOC2008]

4 hours ago, simtom said:

I'm not sure if this is related to my problem. I'm not trying to use the Radar Data Receiver, the Radar Warning Receiver is integrated into the Weapon Manager. 

UPDATE:
I do hear the sound effect of the radar. I just don't see it.

 

Just checked the BDA folder and found four craft. I'll also take a look at KerbalX.

My mistake, misread it. There are some comments earlier in the thread of a similar problem and there may be an answer to be found there.

[simtom]

40 minutes ago, XOC2008 said:

My mistake, misread it. There are some comments earlier in the thread of a similar problem and there may be an answer to be found there.

Things are getting weird because all of a sudden it started working again. I'll do some more testing to see what's causing it.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, simtom said:

Things are getting weird because all of a sudden it started working again. I'll do some more testing to see what's causing it.

Same issue I had. Read these posts:

https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/155014-13-bdarmory-continued-v0300-7282017-vessel-mover-camera-tools-bdmk22-destruction-effects-burn-together/&do=findComment&comment=3132394

https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/155014-13-bdarmory-continued-v0300-7282017-vessel-mover-camera-tools-bdmk22-destruction-effects-burn-together/&do=findComment&comment=3133514

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by Guest

[simtom]

8 hours ago, dundun92 said:

Same issue I had. Read these posts:

https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/155014-13-bdarmory-continued-v0300-7282017-vessel-mover-camera-tools-bdmk22-destruction-effects-burn-together/&do=findComment&comment=3132394

https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/155014-13-bdarmory-continued-v0300-7282017-vessel-mover-camera-tools-bdmk22-destruction-effects-burn-together/&do=findComment&comment=3133514

 

Thanks!

Now that this problem is out of the way, I do have another question:

Is there any way to intercept missiles or break their lock?

I've tried a variety of configurations but the missile will always hit my aircraft. I've used the Chaff Dispenser, Smoke Dispenser, Flares and the Jammer but nothing seems to help. I've also tried to use the Laser but it fails to destroy the missile in time (it does lock onto to it however). 

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

6 hours ago, simtom said:

Is there any way to intercept missiles or break their lock?

Yup, all of the ways you have tried, thing is each countermeasure only works for 1 type of missile,  flares for heatseekers. smoke for laser IR guided, and chaff for radar. and are totally ineffective against the wrong type ( I have recently been testing all these against new missiles so can confidently state they all do the job they are supposed to)

You must also make sure the engagement options are set correctly for your weapons. they can be specifically set to engage missiles, however if you neglect the setting they'll do nothing.

  A modern style radar guided missile is capable of locking and intercepting almost any missile, non of the other types can really pull it off. The AI can also target missiles with guns, although on an aircraft turreted weapons are more trouble than they're worth, and fixed guns will not be able to target incoming missiles.

Ground based anti missile turrets like for example the BDA goalkeeper are quite effective, there are also plenty of other mod turrets sporting CIWS turrets ( Anti Air and anti missile is one of my particular specialties, I make a lot of stuff just for that purpose)

And of course the Radar jammer, which only works for radar locked or guided missiles, useless for IR or Heat.

[simtom]

21 minutes ago, SpannerMonkey(smce) said:

Yup, all of the ways you have tried, thing is each countermeasure only works for 1 type of missile,  flares for heatseekers. smoke for laser IR guided, and chaff for radar. and are totally ineffective against the wrong type ( I have recently been testing all these against new missiles so can confidently state they all do the job they are supposed to)

Thank you for the detailed explanation. I installed all of the countermeasures on one aircraft and started Competition Mode, so now the AI Pilot was in control of the countermeasures. This proved me wrong because they were actually working now. 

 

21 minutes ago, SpannerMonkey(smce) said:

A modern style radar guided missile is capable of locking and intercepting almost any missile, non of the other types can really pull it off. The AI can also target missiles with guns, although on an aircraft turreted weapons are more trouble than they're worth, and fixed guns will not be able to target incoming missiles.

So I just select the missile through the Radar window? Often things go so quick that I don't even have the time to do that, haha  

[Guest]

Just now, simtom said:

So I just select the missile through the Radar window?

Yeah, bassicaly. But if your missle tries to hit another missle, theres gonna be a small chance of it if it is small.

 

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

Just now, simtom said:

So I just select the missile through the Radar window? Often things go so quick that I don't even have the time to do that, haha

If your running manual rather than AI yup that's the only way, the downside being that the missile can be so small in cross section that the radar has difficulty locking it, in which case counter measures and evasive maneuvers are your best option,  it also pays to know what's being fired at you, and different missiles will require different tactics.

4 minutes ago, Murican_Jeb said:

theres gonna be a small chance of it if it is small.

Thats not such an issue now,  with the detonation range options  all the intercept missile has to do is get within a few meters of the target and the blast radius will deal with the hostile missile it doesn't need to physically hit the target. The biggest problem, for intercept missiles is speed and maneuverability at speed, if you can get those tuned nicely anti missile actions are fairly successful 

[Guest]

Can you add the AN/ALQ-144?

Its a contermeasure for heat seeking misssle, execpt in a pod. Most helicopters use this to defend agains't any heat seeking missles. Or you could add it on your OV-10 Bronco, like in this picture. Note that the pod is red.

Spoiler

i think you could just thake the ECM Jammer code and set it to confuse heat seeking missle instead, and then put the new code into the model.

As you can see, its kinda octigonal, which makes it hard to make the model, but if you give up you can make it a circle shape I guess.

Don't forget that it is shiny

Edited August 14, 2017 by Murican_Jeb

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

1 hour ago, Murican_Jeb said:

Its a contermeasure for heat seeking misssle

Hiya, checked it out as i was curious to know how a supposed heatseeker jammer would work,  and it doesn't I suspected from the pic that it was some kind of optical jammer and that's exactly what it is. An IR jamming pod (cool)   It works by emitting pulses of IR controlled by the shutters. Saying that though, I think an IR jammer could be a thing. May be worth making it a feature request for record.   ( little link for the AN/ALQ-144 ) (btw, this based on BDA not real world, in BDA heat and IR are not related)

Edited August 14, 2017 by SpannerMonkey(smce)

[Next_Star_Industries]

6 minutes ago, SpannerMonkey(smce) said:

Hiya, checked it out as i was curious to know how a supposed heatseeker jammer would work,  and it doesn't I suspected from the pic that it was some kind of optical jammer and that's exactly what it is. An IR jamming pod (cool)   It works by emitting pulses of IR controlled by the shutters. Saying that though, I think an IR jammer could be a thing. May be worth making it a feature request for record.   ( little link for the AN/ALQ-144 )

You realize heat is IR right?

[DoctorDavinci]

1 hour ago, Next_Star_Industries said:

You realize heat is IR right?

Yes, heat is part of the Infra Red spectrum of light.

However, the AN/ALQ-144 was designed for helo's and only serves to fool IR missiles due to the amount of heat (or lack thereof) being generated by the engines which are already sheided and have the exhaust directed at such an angle that to reliably shoot the helo down you generally have to be behind and above it to get a proper lock if the jammer is part of its load out

In terms of jets, the amount of heat generated by a jet engine is magnitudes above the heat generated by a helo turbine which would land the AN/ALQ-144 useless since the power rating on the jammer would have to be in the kilowatt level of intensity to break the lock (that is unless you got a direct hit on the IR sensor with the jammer IR beam ... chances of that happening are infinitesimally small) ... let alone the fact that you would need at least 2 of these modules (if not 3) in order to have proper coverage around your craft since IR beams do not pass through solid objects such as a helo superstructure or a jet fuselage

So great idea but, unless helo's become a thing in BDAc KSP, the teams time would be wasted

And just so I don't get corrected ... yes, there are helo's that have been created by @Azimech in KSP but I'm unsure if they would be BDAc battle ready

Source: Check my signature

Edited August 14, 2017 by DoctorDavinci

[Next_Star_Industries]

5 minutes ago, DoctorDavinci said:

Yes, heat is part of the Infra Red spectrum of light.

However, the AN/ALQ-144 was designed for helo's and only serves to fool IR missiles due to the amount of heat (or lack thereof) being generated by the engines which are already sheided and have the exhaust directed at such an angle that to reliably shoot the helo down you generally have to be behind and above it to get a proper lock if the jammer is part of its load out

In terms of jets, the amount of heat generated by a jet engine is magnitudes above the heat generated by a helo turbine which would land the AN/ALQ-144 useless since the power rating on the jammer would have to be in the kilowatt level of intensity to break the lock (that is unless you got a direct hit on the IR sensor with the jammer IR beam ... chances of that happening are infinitesimally small) ... let alone the fact that you would need at least 2 of these modules (if not 3) in order to have proper coverage around your craft since IR beams do not pass through solid objects such as a helo superstructure or a jet fuselage

So great idea but, unless helo's become a thing in BDAc KSP, the teams time would be wasted

And just so I don't get corrected ... yes, there are helo's that have been created by @Azimech in KSP but I'm unsure if they would be BDAc battle ready

Source: Check my signature

I agree, your absolutely right, very ineffective for jets, but great for a helicopter. IR doesn't pass very well through some materials, but can be detected through others including solid materials, this is how things like the future James Webb telescope will work, is by being able to see IR through things such as dust and many, many, other materials. I do agree that until, if ever, BDAc adds helicopters this wouldn't be a very useful part and would be set pretty low on the priority scale, however this part would be very useful for mods that already have helicopters created and the team could jump them all by having the part already made for them to use.

[DoctorDavinci]

47 minutes ago, Next_Star_Industries said:

I agree, your absolutely right, very ineffective for jets, but great for a helicopter. IR doesn't pass very well through some materials, but can be detected through others including solid materials, this is how things like the future James Webb telescope will work, is by being able to see IR through things such as dust and many, many, other materials

I'm fairly certain that anyone would be hard pressed to fit the technology contained in the JW telescope into a missile as the telescopes mirror alone is 6.5 meters across (21 feet and 3.906 inches) ... fit that into a missile 

53 minutes ago, Next_Star_Industries said:

I do agree that until, if ever, BDAc adds helicopters this wouldn't be a very useful part and would be set pretty low on the priority scale, however this part would be very useful for mods that already have helicopters created and the team could jump them all by having the part already made for them to use.

Mods that have helo's?

Links please, I'd like to see them

[Next_Star_Industries]

21 minutes ago, DoctorDavinci said:

I'm fairly certain that anyone would be hard pressed to fit the technology contained in the JW telescope into a missile as the telescopes mirror alone is 6.5 meters across (21 feet and 3.906 inches) ... fit that into a missile 

Mods that have helo's?

Links please, I'd like to see them

I'm trying to behave myself, but you did ask for links here they are:

https://mods.curse.com/ksp-mods/kerbal/221780-kerbal-aircraft-expansion-kax

There are others, but they haven't updated to KSP 1.3. It's not the mirror in the telescope that's used to detect IR it's the hardware and software in it that does and yes they will fit into a rocket.

Edited August 14, 2017 by Next_Star_Industries

[DoctorDavinci]

@Next_Star_Industries - thanx, I knew about those already but, for the sake of posterity, I figured that the mods you were talking about should at least have links provided since they are relevant to the conversation at hand

[Next_Star_Industries]

Just now, DoctorDavinci said:

@Next_Star_Industries - thanx, I knew about those already but, for the sake of posterity, I figured that the mods you were talking about should at least have links provided since they are relevant to the conversation at hand

Absolutely

[UnknownEclipse]

On 8/1/2017 at 7:53 AM, SpannerMonkey(smce) said:

A little bit more than that , all you need is referenced below.

So for a one stage missile, would I cut out the boosterTransform section? I assume FC1 and FC2 are the fins?

Sorry, I'm a unity noob

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

31 minutes ago, UnknownEclipse said:

So for a one stage missile

Hi yes sorry should have said, this is of course for the auxiliary booster version but as you have surmised it's just a simple matter of not making a booster,  if your missile has an internal booster as some do, just place the relevant transforms at the exhaust point.  Generally all my small missiles are one part with all fins still attached to the body, with custom collider for  all the parts , the FC's are actually colliders and not really relevant to your question .

[UnknownEclipse]

1 hour ago, SpannerMonkey(smce) said:

Hi yes sorry should have said, this is of course for the auxiliary booster version but as you have surmised it's just a simple matter of not making a booster,  if your missile has an internal booster as some do, just place the relevant transforms at the exhaust point.  Generally all my small missiles are one part with all fins still attached to the body, with custom collider for  all the parts , the FC's are actually colliders and not really relevant to your question .

Does the current BDA code support jettisonable nosecones and terminal maneuvering thrusters? (Im working on THAAD)

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

21 minutes ago, UnknownEclipse said:

Does the current BDA code support jettisonable nosecones and terminal maneuvering thrusters?

Jettisonable nose cones are not supported, as such , BUT what you can do is create the missile and include the nose cone and use the booster decouple mechanism to fire the nose cone.

Terminal thrusters will not do any good, terminal maneuvering is currently carried out via code,  and there's no need to provide extra vector control, ALL BDA vector control is via an aero process rather than thrust vectoring or other means.  All missile thrust is produced in relation to the center line only,  the visible FX do not necessarily ( and usually dont )indicate an origin  of thrust, for example the TOW missile appears to have a vectored thrust, it doesn't really, control is pure aero and despite the location of the FX the thrust is still generated down the center line as determined via code.

Also if you intend to push the missile to real world speeds you'll have to seriously beef up the missiles strength, terminal maneuvers can and do cause high speed  missiles to break up before reaching the target, the maneuvers are quite violent and subject the missile to massive stress.

Worth noting is that more often than not a high speed super or hypersonic missile will end up missing it's target if subjected to terminal maneuvers and it's best suited to slower missiles ( imo of course)

 

[UnknownEclipse]

1 minute ago, SpannerMonkey(smce) said:

Jettisonable nose cones are not supported, as such , BUT what you can do is create the missile and include the nose cone and use the booster decouple mechanism to fire the nose cone.

Terminal thrusters will not do any good, terminal maneuvering is currently carried out via code,  and there's no need to provide extra vector control, ALL BDA vector control is via an aero process rather than thrust vectoring or other means.  All missile thrust is produced in relation to the center line only,  the visible FX do not necessarily ( and usually dont )indicate an origin  of thrust, for example the TOW missile appears to have a vectored thrust, it doesn't really, control is pure aero and despite the location of the FX the thrust is still generated down the center line as determined via code.

Also if you intend to push the missile to real world speeds you'll have to seriously beef up the missiles strength, terminal maneuvers can and do cause high speed  missiles to break up before reaching the target, the maneuvers are quite violent and subject the missile to massive stress.

Worth noting is that more often than not a high speed super or hypersonic missile will end up missing it's target if subjected to terminal maneuvers and it's best suited to slower missiles ( imo of course)

 

Ok, Thanks. Ill get to work!