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Kenny Kerman
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Urses

Urses

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Hmm it seems like a Collision Radar would be a option from your work around. Something like allista have in his mod. This goes in a interesting way.... if you get bearing and Range you can build a map of the plane with all obstakels in the way, warn in some defined Range or do a Autoevade maneuver...like i said interesting...

Funny Kabooms 

Urses

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Toastie_Buns

Toastie_Buns

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6 minutes ago, Kenny Kerman said:

The idea is to have ONE rectangle around the NavBall (total width like twice a 110% navball), with all is needed to navigate a plane wihtout hi-tech : just like IRL... Ok, before the GPS... It's ... like done... Gonna make a simple fixed reticle with graduation, for the 2). Need time*motivation to code.

Oh, I get that. The 'windows' are fixed monitors, they don't create screen clutter. You have 3-4 fixed monitors, but you can create several (or more) screens for them to display.

Edited by Toastie_Buns
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Kenny Kerman

Kenny Kerman

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10 hours ago, Toastie_Buns said:

Oh, I get that. The 'windows' are fixed monitors, they don't create screen clutter. You have 3-4 fixed monitors, but you can create several (or more) screens for them to display.

I'm gonna make some NanoGauges bigger and with a numeric display below their analogic/logarithmic display, make the "Camera" one wider and some other little adjustments.

 

10 hours ago, nascarlaser1 said:

oh ok srry :(.

Imagine you can be inside a transparent navball. The mouse has a tooltip showing you what's written on the NB. So you can navigate without GPS, always knowing where you are in the landscape. Old-school way. + I really can make a YT clip.

Guys.............(first of the list...). :7fTO

(Now I have a (4) :/ Or I make a (3) doing the 3 others...)

Edited by Kenny Kerman
More kerbology.
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Urses

Urses

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36 minutes ago, Kenny Kerman said:

(how to move this thread to a "mod" place ?)

Ping a Moderator with a @ Message.

I Think you Must rename the Tread too in sth like "WIP- ..." or close this Tread and copy needed parts and make a absolutely fresh Tread in Addon Development

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Vanamonde

Vanamonde

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There's quite a bit of discussion here in this thread, which would make switching it to a modding subforum confusing. I'd suggest starting a new thread for that in the appropriate subforum instead. 

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Ithirahad

Ithirahad

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On 3/30/2017 at 6:27 AM, Veeltch said:

Yeeeaaah, this whole thread is probably not needed.

The navball is a compass. It's even better than a compass because it doesn't wobble and is perfect for space travel. KSP is a game about space exploration. Compasses only work around Earth's/Kerbin's/any planet with magnetosphere so no real use for it in deep space.

Why the hell are people taking "compass" in a game context, to mean "a device utilizing a magnet to align with a planet's magnetosphere and determine your approximate orientation, typically using a free-floating magnet in liquid which can result in wobble"... when "compass" for ingame navigation purposes only ever means "a UI element that indicates your exact orientation relative to the cardinal directions"? Whoever or whatever implied that it would need to somehow simulate the behaviour of the real device? The OP is just asking for some way to orientate yourself in a forward-facing ground/air vehicle such as a rover or plane, as the navball's north mark isn't particularly useful in that situation... is that so complicated?

Edited by Ithirahad
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Kenny Kerman

Kenny Kerman

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"Why do people..". Because they don't know navigation on a map: navigation for them is to set a waypoint and follow it. Seen on ships and on the road... There's also a difference between a player and a gamer.

"a UI element that indicates your exact orientation relative to the cardinal directions". The exact orientation of an image relative to any relevant direction... "Your" up/down, N/S, target, custom, customs...

The navball is an old-way compass, not really ergonomic (it's 2D and you don't see the half of it...). But easy to understand.

With this you see all within 3D radar range, have a zoom and AND a precision reticle, in the surface of some nanogauges  : Chws2.png

Of course, fun is : you have to know the bearing of things to put it on the screen.

Edited by Kenny Kerman
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Urses

Urses

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Hi Kenny,

Like i said, go for it chummer. I Think there are many Aero-Fans who will realy appreciate your work and the Instruments look realy Great in my opinion!

Godspeed

Urses

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Kenny Kerman

Kenny Kerman

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25 minutes ago, Urses said:

Hi Kenny,

Like i said, go for it chummer. I Think there are many Aero-Fans who will realy appreciate your work and the Instruments look realy Great in my opinion!

Godspeed

Urses

I've add a lot of contract packs, planes are really needed now (so are choppers... which will be ready later). I wanna do a career from Bargain Parts to RemoteTech and beyond! (from Bleriot to Star Wars !). I think guys like linuxgurugamer are quiet on the same tracks. I need at least a good altimeter. I'm gonna make it first. As I have not the faintest idea of the time it will take me, (generally speakin if I can do that I can play...), it seems then that this thread is in the right place at the right time. So is the guy. :P

Anyway this altimeter is a subspecies of a class I need. I should be quiet acceptable lvl in ergonomy.

The best suggestion I can make is : "Unite with OOlite". And you can have a decentralized massively multiplayer galactic KSP.

Edited by Kenny Kerman
I can explain.
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Urses

Urses

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Hmm in the IVA you have a altimeter Reading for above ground. And KER and (maybe) MJ have the numbers too. And there is a Mod that changes the Upper altimeter from above See to above Ground (sorry the Name is Not present at the moment)[for code]. I Think it will be a interesting option to see both numbers at Same time. You get the ability to extrapolate the slope of the ground below you by the Tumb? As a thoughoption.

PS: Hmm for your playstile (Aeroheavy) have you seen the "Unmanned before manned" Mod? This mode provide many Aerosciencenodes at Start and for manned Spaceflights you get the parts more in the midgame. Before it is more manned at homeworld Probes in space.

Urses

 

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Kenny Kerman

Kenny Kerman

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16 minutes ago, Urses said:

Hmm in the IVA you have a altimeter Reading for above ground. And KER and (maybe) MJ have the numbers too. And there is a Mod that changes the Upper altimeter from above See to above Ground (sorry the Name is Not present at the moment)[for code]. I Think it will be a interesting option to see both numbers at Same time. You get the ability to extrapolate the slope of the ground below you by the Tumb? As a thoughoption.

PS: Hmm for your playstile (Aeroheavy) have you seen the "Unmanned before manned" Mod? This mode provide many Aerosciencenodes at Start and for manned Spaceflights you get the parts more in the midgame. Before it is more manned at homeworld Probes in space.

Urses

 

Ain't my playstyle :) It's History playstyle. Exploring Kerbin is just the first thing to do if you want easy science points... If you can't fly a plane you can't fly a rocket. And ok I miss combat actions, and the general loneliness in KSP is quiet..... Lonely :).

I think I have the "unmanned" ("unkerballed"?) mod, too...

IVAs are mainly unusable to pilot/navigate, but the "fully transparent" ones. I want a full-screen display, with instruments giving lot of info, and action buttons, in the smaller usable rectangle. I can deploy that as an IVA. Later... First a working altimeter. Than a publiable one.

Edited by Kenny Kerman
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Urses

Urses

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12 minutes ago, Kenny Kerman said:

And ok I miss combat actions, and the general loneliness in KSP is quiet..... Lonely :)

B9 Armory for weapons?

And maybe "Throttle Controlled Avionics" by allista. Squad Command Module. You can program a plot for a group of vehicles. And he has a good dev tool for automatic flight (lastly he brough a long time docking Test twich on a asteroid, his autopilots get more and more a bummer). This would be a Way to get some drones as enemys for you. If you are so far in your workaround look at his Code and ask for support and advice maybe?

Urses.

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Kenny Kerman

Kenny Kerman

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5 hours ago, klgraham1013 said:

Having the navball switch into a compass sounds nifty.  Not sure if that would be doable.  Either way, I'd definitely use a compass mod if you made one.  Best of luck.

Could you tell me the difference between a navball and a compass....? (ok this one doesn't have a vertical graduation, as it's less usefull on the sea... But some have like 30° of vertical graduation.)

"Not sure if that would be doable." <--- it's done. On several mods. Like HUDs. I don't want a hud on my Blériot XI.

 

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ZooNamedGames

ZooNamedGames

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25 minutes ago, Kenny Kerman said:

Could you tell me the difference between a navball and a compass....? (ok this one doesn't have a vertical graduation, as it's less usefull on the sea... But some have like 30° of vertical graduation.)

"Not sure if that would be doable." <--- it's done. On several mods. Like HUDs. I don't want a hud on my Blériot XI.

 

Difference is the navball is for 3 dimension vs a compass' 2 dimensions (I'm ignoring the whole magnetic aspect seeing as you answered that already). A compasses is good for when you've got a common plane (in reality's case, everyone's on the same plane that is Earth). However when your in the air or in space, it gets harder to identify which plane is common between two points.

As basic geometry tells as, there are an infinite number of planes running through two points. Which makes it harder to identify 'up'. So a nav-ball functions by having 'up' being the constant perpendicular point from the planet's surface.

Technically, a compass is just one face of a nav-ball with some of the markings removed and it only rotates on one axis (spinning, or in the aeronautical business, "roll") verses 3 axes on a navball (rolling (spinning clockwise (right) or counterclockwise (left)), yaw (moving left or right), or pitch (moving up or down)).

It's complex but it makes sense for those who operate aircraft seeing as without a fixed 'ground' plane, your lack any common reference point. Earth simply removes the need for knowing which was is up when using a compass.

I really do want to help so if something doesn't make sense I'd like to better explain it.

 

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Kenny Kerman

Kenny Kerman

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8 minutes ago, ZooNamedGames said:

Difference is the navball is for 3 dimension vs a compass' 2 dimensions (I'm ignoring the whole magnetic aspect seeing as you answered that already). A compasses is good for when you've got a common plane (in reality's case, everyone's on the same plane that is Earth). However when your in the air or in space, it gets harder to identify which plane is common between two points.

As basic geometry tells as, there are an infinite number of planes running through two points. Which makes it harder to identify 'up'. So a nav-ball functions by having 'up' being the constant perpendicular point from the planet's surface.

Technically, a compass is just one face of a nav-ball with some of the markings removed and it only rotates on one axis (spinning, or in the aeronautical business, "roll") verses 3 axes on a navball (rolling (spinning clockwise (right) or counterclockwise (left)), yaw (moving left or right), or pitch (moving up or down)).

It's complex but it makes sense for those who operate aircraft seeing as without a fixed 'ground' plane, your lack any common reference point. Earth simply removes the need for knowing which was is up when using a compass.

I really do want to help so if something doesn't make sense I'd like to better explain it.

 

Can you please tell me more about the 3rd dimension displayed on the navbal? Here a sea-compass, showing one dimension : azimuth. Some have also an inclination shown. That's 2. What is the 3rd shown on the navball? "Up" is where you decide, JUST LIKE ON THE NAVBALL. I showed a display with 3 dimensions, it's NOT a Navball, and there are A LOT of 3D representations, around, on LOTS of games. Since decades. And HUDs in KSP. "Where is up?" - Well, for me, it's where the letters are not upside-down : the upper side of my screen.

36121-a_1.jpg

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ZooNamedGames

ZooNamedGames

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1 minute ago, Kenny Kerman said:

Can you please tell me more about the 3rd dimension displayed on the navbal? Here a sea-compass, showing one dimension : azimuth. Some have also an inclination shown. That's 2. What is the 3rd shown on the navball?

36121-a_1.jpg

A sea compass like the one shown above is still limited and assumes you've got a common shared point of reference for 'down', which would be the ocean. In the event your 180 upside to the ocean it would be insufficient to tell you to what degree of 'down'. Not to mention a navball is effective at telling you your angle to the horizon (the ground). The sea compass can give you a rough estimate however there is no set degree.

Seeing as crafts in the air or space can angle themselves anywhere in a 3 dimensional world, you need full range of information as to how far one drifts from up, down, or any fixed plane.

Let me know and I'll explain further if need be.

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Kenny Kerman

Kenny Kerman

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1 minute ago, ZooNamedGames said:

A sea compass like the one shown above is still limited and assumes you've got a common shared point of reference for 'down', which would be the ocean. In the event your 180 upside to the ocean it would be insufficient to tell you to what degree of 'down'. Not to mention a navball is effective at telling you your angle to the horizon (the ground). The sea compass can give you a rough estimate however there is no set degree.

Seeing as crafts in the air or space can angle themselves anywhere in a 3 dimensional world, you need full range of information as to how far one drifts from up, down, or any fixed plane.

Let me know and I'll explain further if need be.

Try a HUD mod, and come back explain me what you don't understand.

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Kenny Kerman

Kenny Kerman

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Where is up on a HUD? What is displayed? 2 angles and a distance. That's 3D. Navball has 2 angles, that's 2D. What is "not doable", and thus not done on a HUD? What is shown on a space docking display (supposedly...)? : 2 angles, one distance. Three dimensions, it is. Like X, Y, Z. You can even translate one system into the other and back !!

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ZooNamedGames

ZooNamedGames

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3 minutes ago, Kenny Kerman said:

Where is up on a HUD? What is displayed? 2 angles and a distance. That's 3D. Navball has 2 angles, that's 2D. What is "not doable", and thus not done on a HUD? What is shonw on a space docking display (supposedly...) ?

Don't know what 'distance' you refer to but the common UI elements are altitude and speed. 

With the visual indicators being the same as a navball. You can even see the indicators above and below the horizon. 

Only difference being that instead of showing the entire 3D sphere of rotation, it shows the portion in the front of the craft.  

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