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NASA SLS/Orion/Payloads

_Augustus_

By _Augustus_
in Science & Spaceflight

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Green Baron

Green Baron

Posted
Posted (edited)

Ok, i actually read the Nasa announcement (August 2017) for the gateway thing :sticktongue:

- it is an announcement

- it could be a cooperation with Roscosmos

- it is meant to explore procedures and techniques for long term crewed space missions

- it is a demonstrator for the capabilities of SLS and Orion

- no fixed orbit (electric propulsion system)

- could be a gateway to the moons surface

- could test long term crew support (1 year, in 2020 at the end of the 2020s)

- could be made into a vehicle traveling to Mars

 

My comments: it still could be the logical next step in manned space exploration but this is all a little too soft for my taste. The timeline for the crew mission is too narrow ambitious given the fact that nothing of that exists.

 

Edit: corrected because i misread !

Edited by Green Baron
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tater

tater

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5 minutes ago, DAL59 said:

So it might provide support for lunar missions?  They have to decide or it will be cancelled. 

Because there is no reason for surface missions to stop first at DSG.

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Canopus

Canopus

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2 minutes ago, tater said:

Because there is no reason for surface missions to stop first at DSG.

Well for a reusable lander it would provide a better staging point than LLO but i agree that you probably wouldn't need a full Space station for that.

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Bill Phil

Bill Phil

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3 hours ago, tater said:

Because there is no reason for surface missions to stop first at DSG.

There's plenty of reasons. It takes less energy to go to EML-2 than TLI, meaning that you can send a larger payload there, provided that the vehicle has the capability to launch heavier payloads. Considering the lower performance of SLS Block 1B compared to the Saturn V, stopping first at DSG would be helpful. And the implied mobility of the DSG could finish the transfer to LLO.

Assuming DSG is based out of L-2...

According to this:

https://www.fbo.gov/index?s=opportunity&mode=form&tab=core&id=33368e53181a28d9fb7d9e8582aff8c7

DSG will likely be mobile.

Edited by Bill Phil
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_Augustus_

_Augustus_

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Bill Phil said:

And the implied mobility of the DSG could finish the transfer to LLO.

If you're able to use SEP to move your space station around, you're also able to just use SEP for lowering the orbit of the lander, no station needed......

Edited by _Augustus_
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insert_name

insert_name

Posted
Posted
21 minutes ago, _Augustus_ said:

If you're able to use SEP to move your space station around, you're also able to just use SEP for the lander, no station needed......

This isn't ksp, ions have an extremely low twr, usually in the 0.1 newton range

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Bill Phil

Bill Phil

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46 minutes ago, _Augustus_ said:

If you're able to use SEP to move your space station around, you're also able to just use SEP for the lander, no station needed......

Well, no. DSG will use electric propulsion for its mobility. Which cannot land on the Moon. Not only that, but electric engines are very expensive. 

According to the request for information, they want the first module to have 2 tonnes of xenon propellant.

Edited by Bill Phil
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_Augustus_

_Augustus_

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Posted
48 minutes ago, insert_name said:

This isn't ksp, ions have an extremely low twr, usually in the 0.1 newton range

 

30 minutes ago, Bill Phil said:

Well, no. DSG will use electric propulsion for its mobility. Which cannot land on the Moon. Not only that, but electric engines are very expensive. 

According to the request for information, they want the first module to have 2 tonnes of xenon propellant.

I'm saying to use SEP to haul the lander from EML2 to LLO, not land. I'm not stupid.

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DDE

DDE

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10 hours ago, DAL59 said:

That's my point.  NASA isn't making real progress.  Wouldn't a manned mars mission give even more jobs though?   

Why should it? It’s achieving the primary objective, nobody whose requests they have to honour is asking for more.

10 hours ago, DAL59 said:

Actually, NASA doesn't plan to land until 2043.  But even boeing thinks it will happen 10 years sooner.  

Boeing doesn’t even have Powerpoint slides.

10 hours ago, Green Baron said:

it could be a cooperation with Roscosmos

Roscosmos has largely confirmed its interest.

Edited by DDE
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Green Baron

Green Baron

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I am not the biggest fan of Nasa, they produce too little outcome for too much money and often shouting out too loud when something was found. Sometimes they even stray from the path of evidence based findings :-) On the other hand, for example the momentarily most successful machine for space exploration in terms of scientific publications, the VLT, is doing its job much less pretentious than the Hubble telescope.

But saying that Nasa doesn't make progress isn't really reflecting reality imo. Nasa is a huge apparatus and cannot be reduced to manned missions, in contrary, their space telescopes and probe missions helped and help A LOT with our understanding of what's going on around us.

 

Manned missions apparently do not have a high priority for now. There is a bit of a Mars-hype going on that was refueled lately with Musk's coming out. As soon as it becomes clear that things aren't as easy as advertised the hype will cease again. As long as there are no spaceships capable of carrying anybody beyond Leo all the hype about gateways, Moon and Mars are games of the mind anyway.

 

Edit: oh, i forgot: ... and in the last 10 years Nasa has been extremely helpful in helping start-ups ! A few billions helpful if i get it right.

 

Edited by Green Baron
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kerbiloid

kerbiloid

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, DDE said:

Boeing doesn’t even have Powerpoint slides.

What a useless company. :(

Though I believe, all those space maintainers should focus on KSP modding, rather than powerpoints and animations.
If they are interested in making a hype (otherwise why draw those pictures at all?), they should make official kits of their spacecrafts and launch vehicles to let the people try that themselves.
Anyway they have ready-to-use models.

Edited by kerbiloid
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DDE

DDE

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12 minutes ago, kerbiloid said:

What a useless company. :(

Though I believe, all those space maintainers should focus on KSP modding, rather than powerpoints and animations.
If they are interested in making a hype (otherwise why draw those pictures at all?), they should make official kits of their spacecrafts and launch vehicles to let the people try that themselves.
Anyway they have ready-to-use models.

A few years ago (August 2015) the Russian PopMech ran an article on reusable rockets which pitched a Makeeyev design, which featured a 3D model...made in stock KSP.

e1485922c5.jpgoriginal.jpg

Spoiler

To: [email protected], [email protected]

Ракетчики разыгрались?

Уважаемый редакционный коллектив!
В августовском номере этого года представлены схемы и изображения ракеты "Россиянка" Государственного ракетного центра им. Макеева. Помимо неправильной маркировки топливного бака 2ой ступени, хотелось бы отметить, что данная ракета-носитель, судя по "эскизу", состоит из следующих компонентов:

  • Clamp-O-Tron Shielded Docking Port (андрогинный стыковочный порт с аэродинамической защитой)
  • Mk1-2 Command Pod (трёхместный СА)
  • 2 х Mk2-R Radial-Mount Parachute
  • Rockomax Brand Decoupler (разделитель ступеней)
  • Advanced S.A.S Module, Large (маховики и электронный блок управления)
  • 2 х солнечные панели серии SP-W (с защитной крышкой)
  • TVR-400L Stack Quad-Adapter
  • 4 х FL-R25 RCS Fuel Tank (баки для манёвровых ракет)
  • 4 х RV-105 RCS Thruster Block (сами рулевые двигатели)
  • RV-105 RCS Thruster Block (перевёрнутый)
  • Rockomax X200-16 Fuel Tank
  • RE-L10 "Poodle" Liquid Fuel Engine (предположительно; высокоимпульсный двигатель для вакуума)
  • Rockomax Brand Decoupler
  • 4 х EAS-4 Strut Connector (соединительная стяжка)
  • Rockomax X200-32 Fuel Tank
  • RE-I5 "Skipper" Liquid Fuel Engine (предположительно; средний ЖРД)
  • Rockomax Brand Decoupler
  • TVR-400L Stack Quad-Adapter
  • 4 х LV-T30 "Reliant" Liquid Fuel Engine
  • 4 х Small Hardpoint (исходя из предположения, что первая ступень на разделяется на пять блоков - не представляю, как посадить их раздельно)
  • 4 х Rockomax X200-32 Fuel Tank
  • 4 х 2 х Aerodynamic Nose Cone
  • 4 х 2 х Rockomax Brand Adapter
  • 4 х Mk-55 "Thud" Liquid Fuel Engine
  • 4 х 3/4 х 24-77 "Twitch" Liquid Fuel Engine (подруливающий)

С каких пор вместо просто компьютерной графики используются скриншоты из Kerbal Space Program, причём в версии ниже 1.0, вышедшей в феврале?

Get your excrements together, Boeing!

 

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tater

tater

Posted
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4 hours ago, Canopus said:

EM-1 goes into a distant retrograde orbit. DSG is supposed to use the Near rectilinear halo orbit 

Can't give more likes. LOL

Yes, you are correct, NRO, not DRO. My bad.

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DAL59

DAL59

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Posted

 

6 hours ago, Canopus said:

I just found this: http://spirit.as.utexas.edu/~fiso/telecon/Duggan_8-9-17/Duggan_8-9-17.pdf

Everything is pretty vague but it is something.

13 launches just for a Mars orbit mission????  And another several for a Mars lander?

Plus, the Moon lander is two stage, so it can't be reused.  

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