KSP Interstellar Extended Continued Development Thread

[Cosmonauth]

Let me make it clear: I quit testing this mod in career mod since it ruined my game

All results that I'm talking about here - made in sandbox mode, so stop referring to unupgraded technologies.

[yafeshan]

I did same with Cosmonauth. Got bored of testing in career.

It would be nice to test my designs with non-upgraded reactors. I had upgraded radiators in career btw.

Nertea have a useful heat management mod and Freethinker you always wanted to make them usefull to eachother. The problem is that I can not attach heat radiators directly to engine or I can not put heat transfer pipe between them. Parts do not attach them if they are first part. Heat radiate capacity of his parts are also very low.

[FreeThinker]

Nertea have a useful heat management mod and Freethinker you always wanted to make them usefull to eachother. The problem is that I can not attach heat radiators directly to engine or I can not put heat transfer pipe between them. Parts do not attach them if they are first part. Heat radiate capacity of his parts are also very low.

I'm all for improved integration with Nertea NFT, but I can't do it without Nertea assitance.

- - - Updated - - -

I did same with Cosmonauth. Got bored of testing in career.

It would be nice to test my designs with non-upgraded reactors. I had upgraded radiators in career btw.

I'm sorry to hear you frustrasion but this mod is highly complex and I have to fix many things at the same time, all in my free time. So forgive me if something isn't perfectly working or balanced yet. But don't think I'm not listening, I am highly appreciate of any feedback. Less than 1% actualy appears to gives any feedback at all, so any opinion is valuable to me.

Edited June 15, 2015 by FreeThinker

[Nansuchao]

Relax guys, Interstellar is a very complex mod, Interstellar Extended a lot more... FreeThinker is working really hard on this from MONTHS!!!

While, as a player I understand the sadness to not be able to use some parts as they worked in the past, at to be able to make them works properly, we must not forget FreeThinker is doing this all in his free-time, for his and ours pleasure.

I don't agree with all the changes FreeThinker has implemented in Interstellar Extended (Thermal Turbojet overheating???), but I appreciate very much his hard job and his attention to all the little particulars that can improve the play-experience.

So, everyone, we have to remember that Interstellar is complex to use for us (I still remember a Scott Manley video's when he thought about a bug for the Micowave Receiver antenna deactivating for excess of Waste Heat), try to imagine how it will be hard to code, comprehend and change it...

[yafeshan]

I am not angry or frustrated in anyway. Just wanted to give feedback. Most of us here greatly appreciate your work and want to help you perfect the mod.

I have some promising results with low power reactors. Trying to balance power demand and load. Vista seems to be stabilized at 2800-3000 degrees both in atm and vacuum. The only apparent remaining problem is heat transfer to other parts. It is easily can be prevented by heat radiators of Nertea. If it is possible for our radiators to radiate both waste heat and normal heat, thats ideal of course.

Take your time Freethinker. You are already uptading far more frequently than most modders.

[Cosmonauth]

I am not angry or frustrated in anyway. Just wanted to give feedback. Most of us here greatly appreciate your work and want to help you perfect the mod.

I have some promising results with low power reactors. Trying to balance power demand and load. Vista seems to be stabilized at 2800-3000 degrees both in atm and vacuum. The only apparent remaining problem is heat transfer to other parts. It is easily can be prevented by heat radiators of Nertea. If it is possible for our radiators to radiate both waste heat and normal heat, thats ideal of course.

Take your time Freethinker. You are already uptading far more frequently than most modders.

There is a plugin on kerbalstuff, which called "Stock Heat Management for KSPIE". I tried it but didn't saw any difference, so I deleted it to exclude possible incompatibilities.

Can you be so kind, to describe how you achieved Vista stability?

@Nansuchao: As I told before, I understand complexity of this mod and willing to help, not to criticize. Maybe my posts make you think I'm angry, but it's not. I have some difficulties to communicate in English, because my native language is not nearly similar to English)

[*Aqua*]

So I'm asking again, can someone tell me the size of one hexagon of the large microwave transmitter please?

[Nansuchao]

@Nansuchao: As I told before, I understand complexity of this mod and willing to help, not to criticize. Maybe my posts make you think I'm angry, but it's not. I have some difficulties to communicate in English, because my native language is not nearly similar to English)

The same for me... I didn't want to be rude, but from the beginning of the modding community, I saw many wonderful projects or mods never born due to criticism or complaining. If you look at the old mods for 0.23/0.21 period, you'll see a bunch of really marvelous mods, today completely died. When you're a modder or a serious tester, you stop playing, and KSP become a job. No one pay for that and no one must, but if that job isn't appreciated too... (It's not the case now)

[yafeshan]

I used 4 default size fusion reactors(second type small size). Radiators have about 6GW waste heat removal potential. My reactors produce 4-5GW heat.

Atm flight unsuccessfull if i need to deploy radiators. Changed to flat ones. Vista stabilize at 2800-3000. Need more test for more balanced design.

[Nansuchao]

I'm actually testing myself the new Vista configuration, it seems to be no more useful for SSTO spaceplanes.

Btw, it's just a cfg to edit to change at will and pleasure.

[FreeThinker]

So I'm asking again, can someone tell me the size of one hexagon of the large microwave transmitter please?

I suggest you measure using a stock tank which you resize with tweakscale to the exact same size.

[ABZB]

I suggest you measure using a stock tank which you resize with tweakscale to the exact same size.

I use procedural parts, [at least once you are high in the tech tree] you can make a tank as a very thin cylinder, and increment the length using the menu, to a reasonably high degree of accuracy.

[FreeThinker]

I'm actually testing myself the new Vista configuration, it seems to be no more useful for SSTO spaceplanes.

Btw, it's just a cfg to edit to change at will and pleasure.

The Vista was never ment to be used in an atmosphere, let allong be used for an SSTO. Beside creating a huge amount of radiation, it's questionable if you can manage to create fussion at all since the atmosphere will interfere with the inertial fusion process, which can normally only happen in vacuum inside a reactor. But even starting the blasted thing would create a problem as the resulting shock wave would destroy the Vista Engine and SSTO. It's like exploding a small nuclear bomb without the help of a pusher plate and expect to remain in one piece. Edited June 15, 2015 by FreeThinker

[Nansuchao]

I'm not saying you're wrong, just that in the past I built many SSTOs based on Vista Engines, while Interstellar missed a proper lifter and the Vista wasn't so bad as performance.

[yafeshan]

New tests with vista.

i got very interedings results today. Yesterdays vista stabilizing configurations failed with balanced load-demand. There is no good configuration I can find neither atm nor vacuum. increasing heat radiation potential did not help too. I am back to broken vista situation. I have no idea why I could get stable engine yesterday.

It is possible that my energy balance turned to negative, vista lost power and slowly cooled down with frequent start-stops.

The most recent test I am doing while I was writing has interesting results

Heat production ~5GW

30.6GW Radiator maximum dissipation

Vacuum test

Radiators are deployed

I had %96 power utilization when I started. With increased waste heat, my net power turned slightly to negative(%101 tilization). I am getting fusion heating warning but engine still works, and still have thrust. Engine temperature stoped increasing at 3163K degrees.

[iueras]

I think I may have found a bug... I made a testbed ship with the particle bed reactor as the root part. Did not scale it, left it default size. placed fuel tanks and such, with one thermal rocket nozzle and 2 thermal turbojets for initial takeoff and climb to altitude where thermal rocket TWR goes > 1. I will launch with the thermal turbojets and climb to around 18-20km. About 2/3 of the time, when I toggle off the turbojets and turn on the thermal rocket, the rocket nozzle produces a whopping 8kn of thrust instead of the 400+ it should be making. I'm not sure if this is related, but when this happens, if I revert to launch, the reactor is model scaled down to 1.25m and everything attached to it is just kind of "floating" there, but still attached to something (nothing falls apart, can still launch using the turbojets). Once this happens, I cannot make the thermal rocket produce more than 8kN until I revert to assembly and relaunch, even though I CAN still launch with the thermal turbojets.

[Nansuchao]

For the resizing effect, it's a know issue of TweakScale, for the Thrust... I don't know.

@FreeThinker, are you interested in include also other Planet Mods to ORS?

In case, just let me know and in my free time I'll add the resource definition for every Planet Mod I'll find. Sadly, I'm unable to find a way to create maps for the Uranium/Thorium hotspots for Outer Planet Mod.

Edited June 15, 2015 by Nansuchao

[yafeshan]

Vista test for atm flight

heat production 5.49GW

radiator max disspation 21.3GW

Similar configuration works for atm flight too. But I had to use flat radiators since I can not deploy other radiators during atmospheric flight. I barely made to orbit alive with very carefull control. Single vista engine with %95 power utilization start. Reactors reach %102 utilization, I get fusion heat warning then Engines starts to cooldown a little while losing a little thrust.It restarts heating after a short time.

In this case flat radiators can not keep up with vacuum flight. I guess it is because of sun heating. Normal heat radiators can reposition itself to minimze sun exposure while flats can't.

A new test with slight lower power output. System reach over %100 utilization fast and power balance is negative during %90 of the flight. Engine temperature do not even reach 3000K. During the flight engine loses thrust continously but it is enough to reach space and then make circular orbit. Vacuum flight is also stable with continuous thrust loss and below 3000K engine temperature.

[FreeThinker]

@FreeThinker, are you interested in include also other Planet Mods to ORS?

In case, just let me know and in my free time I'll add the resource definition for every Planet Mod I'll find. Sadly, I'm unable to find a way to create maps for the Uranium/Thorium hotspots for Outer Planet Mod.

Yes, I want a definition for every moon and planet offered by other Copernicus Planet Packs

[Nansuchao]

Yes, I want a definition for every moon and planet offered by other Copernicus Planet Packs

Ok, so for every planet that has a real counterpart, as OPM, I'll provide a real definition as made until now. For others, not realistic planets, I'll create some definition "good enough". Can you tell me how to include Antimatter? I know how to calculate the best altitude, but not where the A/M definition is.

[FreeThinker]

I'm not saying you're wrong, just that in the past I built many SSTOs based on Vista Engines, while Interstellar missed a proper lifter and the Vista wasn't so bad as performance.

Well, thermal nozzles, combined with Pebble Reactors and propellants like Ammonia, are now more than capable heavy lifters. I even allow nozzles to be attached radially now, allowing players to launch large contraptions.

Regarding the vista engine, I'm thinking of removing Vista overheating all together and instead Limit Vista to Vacuum of space or Oxygen less atmospheres. This should take care of all the overheating complaining and limit the Vista at something it should be realistically good at, providing High Isp at High thrust levels without fear of blowing it up. On the other hand, the same amount Wasteheat still need be processed by the radiators, but since waste heat capacity is large, it should require quite some time to before it saturates forcing the reactors to cool down.

- - - Updated - - -

Ok, so for every planet that has a real counterpart, as OPM, I'll provide a real definition as made until now. For others, not realistic planets, I'll create some definition "good enough". Can you tell me how to include Antimatter? I know how to calculate the best altitude, but not where the A/M definition is.

Antimatter is not defined in a configuration, it's currently hard coded. I think that should change and somehow be either calculated or defined in some separate configuration file. I prefer to calculate it as that would make it universal compatible with any planet pack. From my understanding, antimatter can be found at bodies with strong magnetic fields. Strong magnetic fields make deep atmospheres possible. So whenever a planet or mun has an deep atmosphere, it must have a strong magnetic field. This can be used directly to derive the availability of antimatter at a body.

Edited June 15, 2015 by FreeThinker

[Nansuchao]

More or less right. Magnetic fields are very important to find A/M, so, the bigger the planet, the more the A/M. The best altitude is the half of the radius of my memory helps me. I'll check it soon.

Also atmosphereless planets will have their A/M, while they have a strong magnetic field (like Moho for example).

About the Vista, please don't do the change. While I can understand it for a realistic reason, I'll suggest you to don't make the change for a gameplay reason. Vista is probably the only engine to be really "nerfed" in Interstellar Extended. It represented in the past the best option before Warp Drive. Making it usable just in vacuum, will make it pointless in the game.

Edited June 15, 2015 by Nansuchao

[FreeThinker]

Making it usable just in vacuum, will make it pointless in the game.

Pointless, how so? It would still provide superior Isp at significant higher thrust than anything in the game (except for antimatter). Also with the engine Overheating gone, you need significantly less radiators. Some would call that Overpowered. But the last thing I want to support is an engine that can rule them all. If it can operate in an atmosphere at all, it should only do so in atmosphere without significant amounts of oxygen, like Duna or Eva at which it should be usable with increased power consumption proportional to the atmospheric pressure. There are many options to get a Vista into space, using conventional rockets, boosters, radially attached thermal nozzles, or build it in orbit or on a mun with extraterrestrial launchpads. Edited June 16, 2015 by FreeThinker

[Nansuchao]

Of course someone can send or build Vista in orbit, but with Magnetic Nozzle and Quantum Vacuum Thrusters, you don't need fuel... Making it useful on other planets without oxygen seems a reasonable idea.

[yafeshan]

I figured out a way for vista to "rule them all". It require more attention but still does the job.If you can manage energy balance slighty over %100 utilization you keep keep your vista cool enough to reach orbit.

Its atmospheric lift capacity completely removes need for thermal nozzles.

I am fine with vista being vacuum only but I think it is better to limit vista thrust based on atmospheric density rather than completely removing its atm flight. Is it possible to make vista thrust 0 at sea level atmospheric pressure(depends on planet) and increase it slowly in upper atmosphere and engine reaches full thrust in vacuum? I would also suggest increasing its minimum size to 5m and power requirement to 5GW, since real one supposed to be giant monstrous engine. We supposed to use this giant nuclear engine in giant starships, not small probes.

This way it won't be equivalent to quantum vacuum or magnetic nozzle and can offer limited use for thin atmosphere planets while removing its main lift engine capacity.