SOS HELP MY CAPULE ESCAPED ORBIT AND ONLY HAS ION ENGINE!!

[jkeller098]

so my first mission in creative was a partal succes it made it to orbit but had to much momentum and is drifting off to space it has a ion engine to slow down any ideas on what to do?

[Snark]

Moving to Gameplay Questions.

10 minutes ago, jkeller098 said:

so my first mission in creative was a partal succes it made it to orbit but had to much momentum and is drifting off to space it has a ion engine to slow down any ideas on what to do?

Can you explain exactly what the situation is, and what you don't like about it?

From what you've written, I'm guessing that what you mean is something like this:

• You were trying to put a craft into orbit
• You goosed it too hard and actually raised its speed above escape velocity
• So now it's still inside Kerbin's SOI, but it's on an escape path so that it will end up in solar orbit unless you do something
• You don't like this and want the craft to stay in Kerbin orbit.

Is that correct?

Assuming that it is... what's the problem, exactly?  You said the craft has an ion engine.  Is it nonfunctional, somehow?  i.e. is there some reason you can't just use your ion engine to thrust to slow the ship down so it stays in orbit rather than escaping Kerbin?  (Ion-powered craft tend to have very large dV, so I'd be surprised if you can't use the ion engine to fix your trajectory.)

What altitude above Kerbin is your craft?  And how fast is it going?  Could you post a screenshot of the situation, e.g. in map view?

(Or have you already escaped Kerbin, and are currently in orbit around the Sun, and your problem is how to find your way back to Kerbin again?)

[Geonovast]

Did you go straight up to get to "Orbit", or did you do a gravity turn and just accidentally pushed too hard to escape velocity?

It's pretty hard to accidentally leave Kerbin's SOI if you're launching to a low orbit.  Going straight up and getting to space isn't orbit, it's just space.  If that's what you did, even if you aren't leaving Kerbin's SOI, you're still going to crash back down pretty hard.

Some screenshots, especially from map view, would help greatly.

[jkeller098]

14 minutes ago, Snark said:

Moving to Gameplay Questions.

Can you explain exactly what the situation is, and what you don't like about it?

From what you've written, I'm guessing that what you mean is something like this:

• You were trying to put a craft into orbit
• You goosed it too hard and actually raised its speed above escape velocity
• So now it's still inside Kerbin's SOI, but it's on an escape path so that it will end up in solar orbit unless you do something
• You don't like this and want the craft to stay in Kerbin orbit.

Is that correct?

Assuming that it is... what's the problem, exactly?  You said the craft has an ion engine.  Is it nonfunctional, somehow?  i.e. is there some reason you can't just use your ion engine to thrust to slow the ship down so it stays in orbit rather than escaping Kerbin?  (Ion-powered craft tend to have very large dV, so I'd be surprised if you can't use the ion engine to fix your trajectory.)

What altitude above Kerbin is your craft?  And how fast is it going?  Could you post a screenshot of the situation, e.g. in map view?

(Or have you already escaped Kerbin, and are currently in orbit around the Sun, and your problem is how to find your way back to Kerbin again?)

the engine is just under powered also one of the pods solar panels got damaged when the booster separated and yes it was intended to be orbiting instead it is on a collision course with duna any advice as to how to stop this? and yes it escaped orbit.

Edited December 5, 2018 by jkeller098
forgot to put one part in

[Zosma Procyon]

Cheat. Open the debug menu and use the "set orbit" feature to plop your capsule back in a safe orbit. There is no problem with occasional cheating, especially when you or the game screw up.

[Snark]

2 hours ago, jkeller098 said:

and yes it escaped orbit. 

Sure.  But the problem (and the reason I was asking those highly specific questions) is you keep using the phrase "escaped orbit", which isn't very meaningful.  In KSP terms, it might be either of the following:

1. "I'm still inside Kerbin's SOI, but I'm on an escape trajectory that will take me outside of it if I don't do anything."
2. "I have already left Kerbin's SOI and am currently in solar orbit."

Those are two completely different things, and the advice we might give you would be very different in those two cases.  So, which one is it?  #1 or #2?

2 hours ago, jkeller098 said:

the engine is just under powered

No it's not.  In your current situation, there's no such thing as "under powered", as long as the power is greater than zero-- you're not trying to fight gravity to launch off a planet, you're not trying to boost from low orbit, so TWR doesn't matter.  As long as it has any power at all, it'll get the job done... as long as you have sufficient fuel supply.

The fact that it's a low-powered engine simply means that the burn will take a long time, that's all.

Can you post a screenshot of your ship in map view so we can see what its trajectory looks like relative to Kerbin?

Also, how much dV do you have?  (Or if you don't know the answer to that, we can calculate it for you.    What's the ship's total mass, and how much xenon does it have aboard?)

2 hours ago, jkeller098 said:

one of the pods solar panels got damaged

Okay, that will mean that less electricity will be available to run the ion engine, which (depending on how many solar panels remain) may mean that you can't run the ion engine at full throttle because it wouldn't have enough electricity.

But as long as you have any solar panels remaining, then you have some electricity, which means you can run the engine.  It just means that you might need to run it at reduced throttle (and therefore a longer burn).

Could you post a screenshot of your ship so we can have an idea of what you're dealing with?

34 minutes ago, Zosma Procyon said:

Cheat. Open the debug menu and use the "set orbit" feature to plop your capsule back in a safe orbit. There is no problem with occasional cheating, especially when you or the game screw up.

Sure, that's an option.  But it's not necessarily the "best" one, since different players want different things.  For example, I like it when I have unexpected problems like this, because figuring out ways to solve unexpected problems (a la Apollo 13) is, for me, much of the appeal of KSP-- I get a real sense of accomplishment when I figure out a way to "pull it out of the hole".   So for a player with tastes similar to mine, using a set-orbit cheat would defeat the point of playing the game.  On the other hand, other players have a low tolerance for shenanigans and would view a setback like this as an annoying hassle rather than a fun opportunity, and for someone like that, using the cheat could be great advice.

My own advice to @jkeller098 here would be:  ask yourself what you like.  Rescuing your mission without using a "cheat" is probably very doable... but will be a challenge and will take some work on your part.  So you should ask yourself:  "do I view this stray ship as an annoying hassle that I have to deal with?  or is it a fun opportunity to develop my l33t KSP skillz and see if I can rise to the challenge?"

If it seems like more of a hassle to you, then by all means use the "set orbit" cheat to return your ship to LKO.  On the other hand, if you like challenges and would like to figure out how to rescue your ship on your own, then we're happy to provide advice for how you could accomplish that. 

[jkeller098]

1 hour ago, Snark said:

Sure.  But the problem (and the reason I was asking those highly specific questions) is you keep using the phrase "escaped orbit", which isn't very meaningful.  In KSP terms, it might be either of the following:

1. "I'm still inside Kerbin's SOI, but I'm on an escape trajectory that will take me outside of it if I don't do anything."
2. "I have already left Kerbin's SOI and am currently in solar orbit."

Those are two completely different things, and the advice we might give you would be very different in those two cases.  So, which one is it?  #1 or #2?

No it's not.  In your current situation, there's no such thing as "under powered", as long as the power is greater than zero-- you're not trying to fight gravity to launch off a planet, you're not trying to boost from low orbit, so TWR doesn't matter.  As long as it has any power at all, it'll get the job done... as long as you have sufficient fuel supply.

The fact that it's a low-powered engine simply means that the burn will take a long time, that's all.

Can you post a screenshot of your ship in map view so we can see what its trajectory looks like relative to Kerbin?

Also, how much dV do you have?  (Or if you don't know the answer to that, we can calculate it for you.    What's the ship's total mass, and how much xenon does it have aboard?)

Okay, that will mean that less electricity will be available to run the ion engine, which (depending on how many solar panels remain) may mean that you can't run the ion engine at full throttle because it wouldn't have enough electricity.

But as long as you have any solar panels remaining, then you have some electricity, which means you can run the engine.  It just means that you might need to run it at reduced throttle (and therefore a longer burn).

Could you post a screenshot of your ship so we can have an idea of what you're dealing with?

Sure, that's an option.  But it's not necessarily the "best" one, since different players want different things.  For example, I like it when I have unexpected problems like this, because figuring out ways to solve unexpected problems (a la Apollo 13) is, for me, much of the appeal of KSP-- I get a real sense of accomplishment when I figure out a way to "pull it out of the hole".   So for a player with tastes similar to mine, using a set-orbit cheat would defeat the point of playing the game.  On the other hand, other players have a low tolerance for shenanigans and would view a setback like this as an annoying hassle rather than a fun opportunity, and for someone like that, using the cheat could be great advice.

My own advice to @jkeller098 here would be:  ask yourself what you like.  Rescuing your mission without using a "cheat" is probably very doable... but will be a challenge and will take some work on your part.  So you should ask yourself:  "do I view this stray ship as an annoying hassle that I have to deal with?  or is it a fun opportunity to develop my l33t KSP skillz and see if I can rise to the challenge?"

If it seems like more of a hassle to you, then by all means use the "set orbit" cheat to return your ship to LKO.  On the other hand, if you like challenges and would like to figure out how to rescue your ship on your own, then we're happy to provide advice for how you could accomplish that. 

ok thanks for advice also it has already left orbit was more asking for advice to return to kerban with out cheating.will post screen shot soon of ship and map. ima try to come up with a solution if i have any more questions will ask thanks guys.

Edited December 5, 2018 by jkeller098
forgot to put some parts in

[Snark]

56 minutes ago, jkeller098 said:

it has already left orbit

Dude, you did it again.    "left orbit" isn't useful, because it could mean either one of the following two things:

1. "Left orbit", as in "I'm still inside Kerbin's SOI, but I'm on an escape trajectory that will take me outside of it if I don't do anything."
2. "Left orbit", as in "I have already left Kerbin's SOI and am currently in solar orbit." 

So do you mean #1, or #2?  (And if you're having trouble understanding what I mean when I describe those two things, and therefore you don't know which one?  That's fine!    But in that case, please let me know so I can explain better.)

From what you've already said, I'm guessing that you mean #2, and when you keep saying "orbit" when you really mean "Kerbin's SOI".  If so... you really need to switch your term usage, because "orbit" means something completely different from how you're using the word, and you're likely to highly confuse people you talk to, because they'll think you mean one thing when you mean another.  Basically, if your ship's path in map view is a circle or ellipse around the planet, then it's "orbit".  Otherwise, it's not "orbit" even if you're still inside the SOI.

1 hour ago, jkeller098 said:

asking for advice to return to kerban with out cheating

The good news is that it is very probably possible.    How hard it will be, though, will depend on a few things, such as:

• where your ship is
• what its velocity is, relative to Kerbin
• how much dV your ship has (which will be a function of its ship mass and how much xenon fuel it's carrying)

We'll be able to give you a better idea when we have the above info, i.e. screenshots.

The most likely scenario, I'm guessing, is that you'll have enough dV, and that the return will be a reasonably straightforward bit of navigating-- but you'll need to be patient, because once you start your burn, you might have to burn for many minutes (possibly even an hour or more, depending on circumstances).  We'll be able to say better when we've got some screenshots to work with.

[jkeller098]

ok it is no longer orbiting kerban is is closer to duna then kerban better?

[Snark]

4 minutes ago, jkeller098 said:

ok it is no longer orbiting kerban is is closer to duna then kerban better?

Ah, okay, thanks!  That answers the question. 

So, you left Kerbin's SOI and are now in interplanetary space, quite some distance from Kerbin.

Question:  Do you have full control over your ship?  That is, are you able to rotate it as desired, turn the throttle on/off, etc.?

Reason I'm asking:  If the ship is uncrewed, and if you've got KSP's "CommNet" feature turned on, and if you originally designed your ship to only stay in low orbit, then maybe you don't have a long-range antenna on the ship, which means if it's halfway to Duna it might be out of range of KSC.

On the other hand, if it has crew aboard, or if you do have a long-range antenna on it, or if your game settings have CommNet turned off, then it might not be an issue for you.

I ask because if you don't have full control of your ship, then your job will be harder.

[bewing]

Why don't you want to go to Duna?

Duna is a fun place. It has giant canyons and cute little polar ice caps and stuff.

Is there a kerbal in your craft, or is it a robotic probe?

 

[jkeller098]

its crewed

[Snark]

1 minute ago, jkeller098 said:

its crewed

Ah, okay.  I guess it makes sense that you want to get it back, then. 

One thing:  if you're halfway to Duna and didn't just leave Kerbin's SOI a minute ago, then you'll need to do actual navigation in order to find your way back.  It's totally doable, and we can talk you through it, but we'll need to know what tools you have at your disposal.

Specifically:

• Are you playing a sandbox game, or career?
• If you're playing a career game:  Have you upgraded the tracking station?  What about Mission Control?

[jkeller098]

sand box more for practice and to test designs. also to improve my skill 

[Snark]

28 minutes ago, jkeller098 said:

sand box

Ah, okay, good.  That means you'll have accurate trajectory info in the map view, and you'll also have access to maneuver nodes when you're setting up the necessary burn (or burns) for getting back to Kerbin. 

So I think all the necessary ingredients are in place-- all we really need now is:

1. a screenshot of your map view (ideally looking "straight down" at the sun's north pole), with a view of the solar system, showing the orbits and relative positions of Kerbin and your ship, and
2. a screenshot of your ship (with solar panels visible), and
3. the mass of your ship, and
4. how much xenon fuel you have.

 

[jkeller098]

ok

 

[jkeller098]

update crash landed on duna.....now what

[bewing]

Now you need to send a rescue ship.

 

[jkeller098]

2 hours ago, bewing said:

Now you need to send a rescue ship.

 

ok tried this rescuers now need rescue as they landed a bit too hard

[Curveball Anders]

5 hours ago, jkeller098 said:

ok tried this rescuers now need rescue as they landed a bit too hard

That's a Kerbal standard mission

[Zhetaan]

7 hours ago, jkeller098 said:

ok tried this rescuers now need rescue as they landed a bit too hard

 

2 hours ago, Curveball Anders said:

That's a Kerbal standard mission

Indeed.  Welcome to KSP, @jkeller098; you're officially no longer a novice player.  And that's no joke:  you can successfully field an interplanetary mission and both encounter and land on another planet.  That isn't beginner-level.

However, I will suggest that your rescue mission carry both parachutes and landing rockets.  Parachutes alone aren't always enough on Duna.  Also take an engineer to repack them if you want to use the parachutes again to land on Kerbin when you come back, or else take extra parachutes.  In the meantime, remember that Duna is lovely; try to enjoy the place.  Grab some science and go for a few hikes.  If Ike's in the sky, you can advance the timewarp and watch it librate.

[jkeller098]

17 minutes ago, Zhetaan said:

 

Indeed.  Welcome to KSP, @jkeller098; you're officially no longer a novice player.  And that's no joke:  you can successfully field an interplanetary mission and both encounter and land on another planet.  That isn't beginner-level.

However, I will suggest that your rescue mission carry both parachutes and landing rockets.  Parachutes alone aren't always enough on Duna.  Also take an engineer to repack them if you want to use the parachutes again to land on Kerbin when you come back, or else take extra parachutes.  In the meantime, remember that Duna is lovely; try to enjoy the place.  Grab some science and go for a few hikes.  If Ike's in the sky, you can advance the timewarp and watch it librate.

ok well good to know i am no longer novice despite crashing twice

[Wallygator]

We’re all novices here - In one way or another - there’s always something we’ve never tried. Just try and remember the thrill and the fear and the frustration you experienced in these first steps. That’s what make it all so engaging. 

Welcome!

[jkeller098]

oh by landed too hard i ment that the chutes didn't work at all and the kebals had to effectively bail out as there craft spiraled out of control because it lacked a control surface on one of the wings......still need to get better. but they survived and hiked to the person they were trying to rescue. so now 2 kerbals stranded on a rock with only a 1 seater craft thats horribly damaged. ima probably set orbit cheat on the rescuers and try once more this time with control surfaces and better engines. also fingers cross lot of that in KSP.(one seater is all thats left of rescuers craft is the extra seat that ended up being only part to survive along with one pilot)

Edited December 7, 2018 by jkeller098
forgot to put some parts in

[Duck McFuddle]

That happens to me a lot when I'm landing on Duna - the atmosphere is very thin so parachutes might not work very well. Always have enough fuel to land with just engines as if there is no atmosphere. I don't go to Duna very often because of this; it can be very frustrating and painful to quicksave and quickload over and over trying to land. When I do an interplanetary mission it is normally to Jool because the SOI is so big that an encounter is very easy. It is also fun to go to Eve (If you're not coming back) or a moon of someplace. Personally, when I'm bored but don't want a challenge I go to Minmus because it's fun and easy. Just do whatever you feel like and enjoy the most - after all, that's what the game is about.