Rational Resources 3.0.2 [Sep 24, 2024]

[stk2008]

Brilliant Will give it a go later.

Thanks

[Shoey]

This is probably intentional for balance purposes but I feel like I should mention it anyways. 

Hydrolox refining uses 1.8kg of water per 0.18kg of fuel. Some mass loss makes sense from impurities. refining, etc but 90%... doesn't feel right. Is it based off of something or just balance?

[JadeOfMaar]

4 hours ago, Shoey said:

Hydrolox refining uses 1.8kg of water per 0.18kg of fuel

Aww man. I can't believe that problem was still there. I must have had it confused somehow with the RealFuels version (where the Water input is the same).

You can download and replace GameData/RationalResourcesCompanion/CRP/Opt-in_ConvertOTrons.cfg to apply the fix.

[Shoey]

8 hours ago, JadeOfMaar said:

Aww man. I can't believe that problem was still there. I must have had it confused somehow with the RealFuels version (where the Water input is the same).

You can download and replace GameData/RationalResourcesCompanion/CRP/Opt-in_ConvertOTrons.cfg to apply the fix.

Sweet, thanks. 

While I have your attention I did write a patch to add LqdDeuterium (mainly for Far Future Tech fusion reactors/engines) to the same refining option. I based it off of the percentage of water that is deuterium by mass.

OUTPUT_RESOURCE
{
	ResourceName = LqdDeuterium
	Ratio = 0.0003458128
	FlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
	DumpExcess = True
}

if you want to add it you can just copy it from my patch. Don't have to, of course, just thought to mention it.

[JadeOfMaar]

Just now, Shoey said:

I did write a patch to add LqdDeuterium

Good idea. There's always room for LqdDeuterium. I already have a set value for the fraction of D to H so I likely won't use the exact number you're giving me.

[Shoey]

1 hour ago, JadeOfMaar said:

Good idea. There's always room for LqdDeuterium. I already have a set value for the fraction of D to H so I likely won't use the exact number you're giving me.

Gotcha, gotcha. I'm curious, though. What's it based off of or is it mostly a self consistency thing? Always like talking about this stuff cause it's a good learning opportunity.

[JadeOfMaar]

1 hour ago, Shoey said:

I'm curious, though. What's it based off of or is it mostly a self consistency thing?

I sourced it from this line:

Quote

"Deuterium has a natural abundance in Earth's oceans of about one atom of deuterium among all 6420 atoms of hydrogen (see heavy water)."

-  Deuterium, wikipedia

I think that number is supposed to be "6420." I reduced it to "642" and established "Wherever I provide Hydrogen or Water, provide 1/642 the amount in Deuterium." I reduced the number for playability, to reduce the waiting game to harvest it. My target audience is in large part, interstellar ship builders and players of Galaxies Unbound, and they're going to want to hold lots and lots of Deuterium so why not give them this handicap?

Edited January 11, 2023 by JadeOfMaar

[Shoey]

On 1/11/2023 at 11:59 AM, JadeOfMaar said:

I sourced it from this line:

I think that number is supposed to be "6420." I reduced it to "642" and established "Wherever I provide Hydrogen or Water, provide 1/642 the amount in Deuterium." I reduced the number for playability, to reduce the waiting game to harvest it. My target audience is in large part, interstellar ship builders and players of Galaxies Unbound, and they're going to want to hold lots and lots of Deuterium so why not give them this handicap?

Just realized I never thanked ya.

Thanks, it's been good fun playing with this in JNSQ+MKS. I like tweaking stuff for realism over gameplay so I might make some tweaks and share them eventually, but still. Great fun.

[coper]

WOULD THIS WORK WITH global construction

[JadeOfMaar]

On 1/23/2023 at 12:15 PM, coper said:

WOULD THIS WORK WITH global construction

• Yes. This mod places all the mine-able resources required by Global Construction and doesn't take any away.
• No. It will remove from any non-stock ISRU parts tagged for RR integration, any resource converter modules that are added by Global Construction and other ISRU mods.

[KrakenBeGone]

Tracking down some of the problems with JNSQ, Kerbalism, RationalResources, and some Nertea mods with the emphasis of using kerbalism resource controllers. 

In Nertea's CryoTanks mod making sure the ISRU opt in CryoTanksISRU_opt-in.cfg does not get set, otherwise some stock ISRU modules get added. I modified it directly in CryoTanks so that if the Kerbalism folder of Rational Resources is installed it won't trigger.  There is a CryoTanks.cfg support file in KerbalismConfig to support Hydrogen liquefaction and evaporation using the Kerbalism process controller, but it did not fix the stock controllers being placed in the ISRU.

@PART[MiniISRU,ISRU]:NEEDS[!RationalResourcesKerbalism]:BEFORE[CryoTanks]
{
	CryoTanks_Converter = Set            // Opt-In for CryoTanks LH2, LH2Ox, LCH4, LCH4Ox Converters. 
	                                     // Converter rates will be relative to LF, LFOx Converters.

	// CryoTanks_Power = 1               // (optional) Modifier for productivity. Scale both INPUT_RESOURCE (except the EC) and OUTPUT_RESOURCE   
}

In RationalResourcesKerbalism, best to test if a reliability module already exists so that we don't get duplicate modules in the PAW. I'm not that well versed in Module Manager syntax but this works for me, unless I got it wrong and disabled it in all cases. The parts I play with have reliability already set by Kerbalism.

MODULE:HAS[!MODULE[Reliability]]:NEEDS[FeatureReliability]

It would be best to find the mods that keep adding more stock converters, but in the meantime make sure all of the ISRUs part definitions in the RationalResourcesKerbalism folder have the following (it is occasionally missing), though it won't work if a mod that adds stock converters comes after this one

!MODULE[ModuleResourceConverter],* {}
!MODULE[ModuleOverheatDisplay] {}
!MODULE[ModuleCoreHeat] {}

or for drills and pumps

!MODULE[ModuleResourceHarvester],* {}
!MODULE[ModuleOverheatDisplay] {}
!MODULE[ModuleCoreHeat] {}

Another mod that adds stock method ISRU converters is Near Future Propulsion. No Kerbalism  patch yet. Doesn't seem to be the source of my problems and is removed by the above code.

I've nearly fixed all visual problems but still need to track down why I'm getting a duplicate MettalicOre PAW entry in drill parts, and a duplicate Methane PAW entry in pump parts. The presence of which means I can't select past those items in the configure button of the PAW. My module manager config file doesn't show any other resource being set in duplicate (other than having two different water electrolysis methods or other functional duplicates with properly differentiated methods).

Can't wait to start a career mode game using this mod. Thanks for the great work!

Edited February 7, 2023 by KrakenBeGone

[KrakenBeGone]

Couldn't find the mod that duplicated MetallicOre and Methane in drills and pumps, but I fixed it by looking for and deleting other harvesters using a specific resource, rather than doing so by title or name. For readability I also combined for each resource their Harvester module and Configure module.

	// ---------------------------------------
	!MODULE[Harvester]:HAS[#resource[MetallicOre]],* {}
	MODULE
	{
		name = Harvester
		title = MetallicOre Excavation
		type = 0
		resource = MetallicOre
		min_abundance = 0.02
		rate = 0.0025
		ec_rate = 1.0
	}
	@MODULE[Configure]
	{
		!SETUP[*]:HAS[@RESOURCE[MetallicOre]],* {}
		SETUP
		{
			name = MetallicOre Extraction
			desc = Extract <b>MetallicOre</b> from the surface.
			MODULE
			{
				type = Harvester
				id_field = resource
				id_value = MetallicOre
			}
			RESOURCE
			{
				name = MetallicOre
				amount = 0
				maxAmount = 50
			}
		}
	}
	// ---------------------------------------

Incidentally, are the stock asteroid and comet drill harvesters needed for stock contract purposes? I'd be inclined to delete those too otherwise.

[JadeOfMaar]

On 2/8/2023 at 11:57 AM, KrakenBeGone said:

the mod that duplicated MetallicOre and Methane in drills and pumps

Hi there. What do you think the intent of such a mod is? Perhaps you will find its name by what the mod contributes to gameplay -- how it uses these resources and why you installed that mod. Otherwise, search your MM logs (in <KSP folder>/Logs/ModuleManager/<anyfile>). There might be an MM pass (BEFORE, FOR, AFTER), and a string that clearly reads like "@ PART which HAS whatever Kerbalism Harvester or Configure module" or it clearly targets the pump parts from Stockalike Mining Expansion (including but not limited to SMX_1mInlinePump, SMX_2mStackPump).

You haven't shown a screenshot of your GameData so I can't begin to guess from the mod names that might be in there.

On 2/8/2023 at 11:57 AM, KrakenBeGone said:

Incidentally, are the stock asteroid and comet drill harvesters needed for stock contract purposes? I'd be inclined to delete those too otherwise.

I don't know. I don't play career mode.

[KrakenBeGone]

So to take care of the odd duplicates of MettalicOre and Methane which broke the drills, I deleted the zKerbalism.cfg in RationalResources/CRP. Isn't that duplicated under RationalResourcesKerbalism?

[JadeOfMaar]

On 2/25/2023 at 1:00 PM, KrakenBeGone said:

the zKerbalism.cfg in RationalResources/CRP

Oh damn. I totally forgot that was there. Thanks for spotting it!

[Fragile-Engineering]

Hi!
I am using Rational Resources together with RO/Kerbalism. Although I like this mod, because of the more realistic resources and their distribution, I did not find a way to replace the "Regolith Compacter" process that is provided by the Kerbalism drills to produce the shielding resource. Because the regolith is not available on each planet any more, I cannot use the Kerbalism drills there. Although the area is rich of rock. I see that there are RR-processes that produce concrete and slag out of rock - to my understanding could these products be used like shielding - but I did not find a conversion. It was mentioned that there is a "blacksmith way" to produce shielding - but this is not the same as kerbalism shielding, is it? At least I did not succeed in using the RRWork somehow to produce the shielding resource.

Does someone have a hint for me? Or could a "rock-to-kerbalism_shielding-process" be added to the RR modified ISRU?

[JadeOfMaar]

On 3/12/2023 at 7:12 PM, Fragile-Engineering said:

"rock-to-kerbalism_shielding-process"

It exists. RR provides the Molten Regolith Electrolysis (Rock) process which accepts Rock and produces Shielding, CO2 and Oxygen.

On 3/12/2023 at 7:12 PM, Fragile-Engineering said:

RR-processes that produce concrete and slag out of rock

Slag and Konkrete* are specific to the Wild Blue Industries mods and their own resource library, Classic Stock Resources. There's no parallel to these in CRP afaik and no one has come to me before, seeking to use them with CRP.

On 3/12/2023 at 7:12 PM, Fragile-Engineering said:

It was mentioned that there is a "blacksmith way" to produce shielding - but this is not the same as kerbalism shielding, is it?

Sadly, no. The existing chain there is specific to Kerbal Health, another radiation sim mod. It assumes shielding is made of a hydrocarbon substance while Kerbalism assumes a metal alloy or bio waste, though plain Aluminium is an option.

[Fragile-Engineering]

Thank you for your reply!

6 hours ago, JadeOfMaar said:

It exists. RR provides the Molten Regolith Electrolysis (Rock) process which accepts Rock and produces Shielding, CO2 and Oxygen.

Yes I have found the "Molten Regolith Electrolysis" process in the Kerbalism documentation too. But unfortunately the Kerbalism ROConfig does not contain this process. I don't know why :-/ So, although RR overwrites this process to use rock instead of regolith, I cannot use it, because the ISRU does not contain the original "Molten Regoltih Electrolysis".
I have tried to "readd" it to the ROConfig file - but with no success so far. Will have to dig deeper into the kerbalism config semantics, I think...

[JadeOfMaar]

3 hours ago, Fragile-Engineering said:

RR overwrites this process

No. RR provides this in addition. RR does not delete, does not change, does not overwrite this so it must exist because you have RR Kerbalism. And the name specifically contains "(Rock)" on the end which I made sure to make clear in bold. You may have to do a lot of clicking and cycling of converter processes to get to it. I may have to re-title it to Molten Rock Electrolysis to reduce further chance of this confusion.

If by chance this situation is true, keep it in mind: "You may be getting confused by the parts that are titled ISRU and Mini ISRU. These are clone parts provided by Kerbalism and they only care about life support. RR doesn't touch those. Use the original parts titled Convert-O-Tron 250 or Convert-O-Tron 125."

[JadeOfMaar]

Release 1.43

• Changed requirement of harvesters and refineries from Classic Stock to WBI Pathfinder. When Pathfinder is installed, harvesters can use one module to produce all resources, refineries become switchable and decluttered.
• Fixed excessive Water demand of Hydrolox production (increased Hydrolox outputs).
• Fixed MetalOre and Metal subtypes not showing in Ore tanks. Yay typos.
• Deleted legacy Kerbalism config that caused repeat modules on, and breakage of the stock drills. Thanks @KrakenBeGone
• Updated handling for stock drills and refineries to cover for RO Kerbalism which does not handle the stock parts.

[Fragile-Engineering]

14 hours ago, JadeOfMaar said:

If by chance this situation is true, keep it in mind: "You may be getting confused by the parts that are titled ISRU and Mini ISRU.

@JadeOfMaar : Thank you for the explanation. This was indeed a little confusing. But it seems that this was not the only problem in my installation. After installing your latest version, I recognized that I seemed to have incompatible resource-types between scan, drills, tanks and processes. First I wanted to complain, that the GrayWater resource is missing now, but then I realized, that it doesn't belong to the  CRP. So, after some more reistalls, I successfully set up some ISRU processes (for the first time in RSS/RO!) - Thank you for the great mod and your support!

[allabast]

On 3/14/2023 at 9:47 AM, JadeOfMaar said:

Release 1.43

• Changed requirement of harvesters and refineries from Classic Stock to WBI Pathfinder. When Pathfinder is installed, harvesters can use one module to produce all resources, refineries become switchable and decluttered.
• Fixed excessive Water demand of Hydrolox production (increased Hydrolox outputs).
• Fixed MetalOre and Metal subtypes not showing in Ore tanks. Yay typos.
• Deleted legacy Kerbalism config that caused repeat modules on, and breakage of the stock drills. Thanks @KrakenBeGone
• Updated handling for stock drills and refineries to cover for RO Kerbalism which does not handle the stock parts.

awesome work! but installing Pathfinder with this update seems to break atmo/exo harvesters...the drills and converters seem to work fine but the pathfinder atmo scoops only have "compress oxygen", the demo exoscoop is completely devoid of modules, and the size 3 lasso doesn't exist at all. tried digging through logs but couldn't find a specific culprit, here's my modlist (https://pastebin.com/30AuCnb2) and log https://www.dropbox.com/s/hpa8qcbhdyhn0zg/Player.log?dl=0

[UltraJohn]

Hi.

I'm having some trouble figuring out how to add compatibility for the mod The Gold Standard. From what I understand, RR will by default disable the resources. Unobtanium should already be designed to only distribute on specific planets, so I think I just need to whitelist it for RR? Though GoldOre is more generically distributed on any planet other than Kerbin, so this is where I mainly am unsure how to proceed.

Is there a premade patch available somewhere by chance?

 

Also, I have SMURFF installed and the RationalResourcesSQUAD addon seems to break the SMURFF patch. The mass reverts back to stock. Is there a fix for this?

I could just not use SQUAD addon, but then I don't get any of the tank types to hold the new resources, which is a problem.

Edited April 7, 2023 by UltraJohn

[JadeOfMaar]

@UltraJohn Unobtainium (particularly with how it's presented in Gold Standard) sure seems like a golden example of irrational resources if I may say so. Why should a mod that calls itself rational support it?

As for GoldOre, be my guest and save this basic patch as a new .cfg file anywhere in GameData. I've tested it so it should be good.

Spoiler

// Nerf GoldOre
@GLOBAL_RESOURCE:NEEDS[RationalResources,TheGoldStandard]:HAS[#ResourceName[GoldOre]]
{
	Tag = Spared
	@Distribution
	{
		@MaxAbundance = 4
	}
}

// Spare only the per-planet config that bans Kerbin.
// The Kerbin moons patches are OP but not nearly as bad as the GLOBAL is.
@PLANETARY_RESOURCE:NEEDS[RationalResources,TheGoldStandard]:HAS[#ResourceName[GoldOre],#PlanetName[Kerbin]]
{
	Tag = Spared
}

// Nerf Unobtainium
@PLANETARY_RESOURCE:NEEDS[RationalResources,TheGoldStandard]:HAS[#ResourceName[Unobtainium]]
{
	Tag = Spared
	@Distribution:HAS[~MinAbundance[>0.1]]
	{
		@MaxAbundance /= 20
	}
	@Distribution:HAS[#MinAbundance[>0.1]]
	{
		@MinAbundance /= 20
		@MaxAbundance /= 20
	}
}

 

If you want GoldOre abundance to be controlled by the planet template (and consequently appear at fitting planets in any planet pack that is supported by RR) I can create a template system config for GoldOre, but this will break any existing GoldOre mining facilities.

 

About SMURFF, I'll look into that sometime.

[UltraJohn]

9 minutes ago, JadeOfMaar said:

If you want GoldOre abundance to be controlled by the planet template (and consequently appear at fitting planets in any planet pack that is supported by RR) I can create a template system config for GoldOre, but this will break any existing GoldOre mining facilities.

That would be great. I do agree that its default implementation is too strong, so I will grab that patch.

 

11 minutes ago, JadeOfMaar said:

About SMURFF, I'll look into that sometime.

Thanks. Unfortunately I won't be able to use RR until I get it working with SMURFF. Unless there is some quick and easy way I can make it work for myself, I will have to wait for that that update.

I appreciate your time and effort.