A new Funds to Sci converter Strategy

[Wjolcz]

Currently, (AFAIK) there's not a single mod that does this (KerboKatz had it but it's been dead since 1.4). All I want is to buy Science points with Funds instantly, because that one single thing makes the whole career mode so much better.

And, please, don't suggest using currently in-game strategies. I already tried that and they are all awful and useless.

Edited August 8, 2019 by Wjolcz

[AHHans]

22 minutes ago, Wjolcz said:

And, please, don't suggest using strategies. I already tried that and they are awful and useless. 

O.K. Then I will most emphatically NOT mention strategies!

P.S. SCNR

[Tekaoh]

I can't help but wonder: What is it about strategies that are not working out for you?

I'm also surprised that you'd want to buy science with funds. In my experience, it seems pretty easy to just about max out the tech tree in just a handful of missions within Kerbin's SOI. I'm usually in more of a hurry to sell my science points for funds. Funds are far more valuable in career mode, IMO.

Edited August 7, 2019 by Tekaoh
Typos

[Wjolcz]

37 minutes ago, Tekaoh said:

I can't help but wonder: What is it about strategies that are not working out for you?

Pretty much everything. I'm a bit busy to go into detail, but it's about how the tree is being unlocked. If I can buy Sci with Funds then I have more flexibility when it comes to choosing my own goals, projects and tech paths.

37 minutes ago, Tekaoh said:

I'm also surprised that you'd want to buy science with funds. In my experience, it seems pretty easy to just about max out the tech tree in just a handful of missions within Kerbin's SOI. I'm usually in more of a hurry to sell my science points for funds. Funds are far more valuable in career mode, IMO.

Again, it's about how the tree works. If I want to unlock it I need Sci. To get Sci I need to unlock more experiments. So the career really forces you to be pretty much science-oriented. That doesn't give you much freedom. Also, I don't want to max out the tree right away. I want a challange of spending resources on tech that I might need and working out the solutions with what I have currently, not to grind my way through the tree ASAP.

Strategies generate a steady income of science, when activated. I don't need that. I need to buy science whenever I see a need for a new part.

If KerboKatz ever comes back from the dead try playing career with minimum science rewards and the mod installed. That one small thing completely overhauls career mode by giving you way more freedom over how you want to play it.

Edited August 7, 2019 by Wjolcz

[Tekaoh]

There are strategies for instantaneous one-time exchanges in addition to the steady income ones.

Or I suppose you could make believe by using the Alt+F12 menu to add and deduct science and funds at the exchange rate that you feel would be good for you.

I still don't really understand the use case. Seems to me like science is pretty easy to get access to by just running experiments. A Minmus biome-hopping mission is fast and very scientifically enlightening. I'd personally never want to spend precious funds on science points. The tech tree caps out pretty quickly and then science isn't that useful anymore, other than for gaining funds (or rep, if that's your jam). But there are always unlimited uses for funds. But hey, everyone plays KSP differently.

Alternatively, maybe you'd enjoy bumping your science rewards up a little if you're playing at minimum. Or try something like Science - Full Reward or Science - Full Transmit or both if you want the science to roll in a little more quickly.

Edited August 7, 2019 by Tekaoh

[AHHans]

1 hour ago, Tekaoh said:

There are strategies for instantaneous one-time exchanges in addition to the steady income ones.

IIRC there are only two instantaneous, one-time exchange strategies in the stock game: to sell science for funds and to sell reputation for funds. I guess the canonical way to convert funds to science is to - *drumroll* - use the funds to build a rocket (or plane, or whatever) and perform some experiments.

P.S. And, yes, for what @Wjolcz wants I'd also suggest the Alt+F12 menu.

[KerikBalm]

1 hour ago, Tekaoh said:

There are strategies for instantaneous one-time exchanges in addition to the steady income ones.

There's science to funds instant strategies, and there is rep to funds instant strategies... but nothing to instantly convert funds to science.

I suppose something like an instant "outsourced R&D" could be usefull. They have a "Patents Licensing" strategies, so maybe a "Patents Purchasing" that gives you instant science at the expense of funds?

[Wjolcz]

2 hours ago, Tekaoh said:

I still don't really understand the use case. Seems to me like science is pretty easy to get access to by just running experiments. A Minmus biome-hopping mission is fast and very scientifically enlightening. I'd personally never want to spend precious funds on science points.

 

53 minutes ago, AHHans said:

I guess the canonical way to convert funds to science is to - *drumroll* - use the funds to build a rocket (or plane, or whatever) and perform some experiments.

This is exactly the opposite of what I want and what makes me hate career mode. I don't want to do science to progress. I want to have a choice. What I am saying is "I want to pick to either do science, do World's Firsts (and/or contracts), or both at once", and your answer is basically "Do science or cheat", or just max out the tree right away because rewards can be cranked up to the max (I play sandbox when I want to have all the parts, but thanks). That's not very helpful.

53 minutes ago, KerikBalm said:

I suppose something like an instant "outsourced R&D" could be usefull. They have a "Patents Licensing" strategies, so maybe a "Patents Purchasing" that gives you instant science at the expense of funds?

That would be perfect. Even with some enormous fees/penalties it would be my favourite (and honestly the only one I would use) strategy.

Edited August 7, 2019 by Wjolcz

[AHHans]

2 minutes ago, Wjolcz said:

This is exactly the opposite of what I want and what makes me hate career mode. I don't want to do science to progress. I want to have a choice. What I am saying is "I want to pick to either do science, do World's Firsts, or both at once", and your answer is basically "Do science or cheat".

Why is using a mod that can convert funds to science not cheating, and using the Alt-F12 menu cheating? It depends on how you use it. If you only add science points when you also subtract the corresponding amount of funds, then I don't see why this is cheating. It is uncomfortable. Sure. But IMHO not cheating.

You want to play the game in a way that is different than how most people want to play it. That's fine! But to do so may require some unconventional / inconvenient methods.

[Wjolcz]

11 minutes ago, AHHans said:

Why is using a mod that can convert funds to science not cheating, and using the Alt-F12 menu cheating? It depends on how you use it. If you only add science points when you also subtract the corresponding amount of funds, then I don't see why this is cheating. It is uncomfortable. Sure. But IMHO not cheating.

You want to play the game in a way that is different than how most people want to play it. That's fine! But to do so may require some unconventional / inconvenient methods.

Fair enough. My phrasing was poor. Should've used words like 'inconvinient', or 'painful' instead of 'cheating'.

11 minutes ago, AHHans said:

You want to play the game in a way that is different than how most people want to play it.

Insufficient studies made on the matter. Multiple citations needed.

Have you ever played career with the KerboKatz mod? I have and I loved it. That one small widget that converts funds into Science makes a HUGE difference.

Edited August 7, 2019 by Wjolcz

[linuxgurugamer]

@SpaceTiger is still around, he was last here 5 hours ago. Why don't you send him a message and ask him if hecan get them updated or change the license so that others could take  over supporting the mods

Edited August 7, 2019 by linuxgurugamer

[AHHans]

15 hours ago, Wjolcz said:

Insufficient studies made on the matter. Multiple citations needed.

Have you ever played career with the KerboKatz mod?

No, I haven't tried the KerboKatz mod. But what I do is to turn down the "science rewards" slider in the difficulty settings for my career games down to 50% (standard for "hard" is 60%), after I unlocked the full tech-tree in my very first playthrough even before leaving the Kerbin system. I enjoy the challenge of designing missions with limited technological resources. (But I also enjoy playing with fancy toys, that's what I use a sandbox save for. Right now in my current career save I wait to unlock all the stuff needed for my Eve-ascend-plane.)

And, no, I didn't do a scientific study on how people prefer to play KSP. But looking around on the forums I see more people commenting on how easy it is to unlock the tech tree than there are complaining that it is impossible to convert funds to science.

[Wjolcz]

2 hours ago, AHHans said:

And, no, I didn't do a scientific study on how people prefer to play KSP. But looking around on the forums I see more people commenting on how easy it is to unlock the tech tree than there are complaining that it is impossible to convert funds to science.

The fact that the tree is easy to unlock doesn't mean career mode is well designed.

[Wjolcz]

For anybody interested: today I created a mod that adds a strategy that does exactly what I wanted (basically KerboKatz science exchanger turned into one of the strategies). It works great and it's coming very soon. I just need to work out a couple of details.

[Wjolcz]