Kerb-ernational Space Station

[Popestar]

In my career mode, I've been focusing  a lot on contracts and earning funds and such...and I've grown tired of it.  I want to stretch my legs and really start growing as a space program.  So I've decided that my next undertaking will be to put a space station in orbit around Kerbin, one that can possibly refuel rockets and such to make it easier for them to get to the Mun, Minmus, and, eventually, the other planets (I have yet to go anywhere near the other planets).  And with this comes multiple questions about how to accomplish this.

1. How does one build a space station, really?  I know I have to built it in pieces/sections and fly the individual sections up to orbit, and then somehow dock them (I have to go through the docking tutorial yet).  But how does one actually build the sections?  As an example, take a look at the Resolute from Lost in Space.  I know it's a ship, but a large portion of this ship is circular tubing, which you see in all kinds of science fiction ships.  How do you go about building these?  And would you have to build a half-circle, get that into orbit, then the other half?
2. Part of being able to refuel ships is to actually process mined ore...which there are no tutorials on that I can see.  In fact, I've got a contract available in my career game right now to go grab 450 lbs. (lbs?  ounces?  Kerb-units?  Kilos?) of ore from the Mun, but I don't see any drilling equipment or drilling parts.  How does one actually drill for, extract, return, and process ore?
3. Which is better to launch pieces of a space station into orbit - a rocket, or a plane?  I'm not overly worried about reusability here, primarily because with the rocket I'll at the very least be able to recover the command module every time.  And because this is a game, cost is no issue; if I run low on funds, I just pluck a few "take these tourists to space" contracts, fulfill them, and I've got cash.  I also don't know really how to fly a spaceplane - I can get off the ground...but landing is a bit sketchy.  But, if a spaceplane is better for this, I'm all for learning.
4. As a semi-related question, I'm not quite sure how to get Action Groups working properly.  Specifically, I've been creating satellites and using the Alligator Joint to extend solar panels.  I'm sure that there are actual claws and such later on in the game, but how do I program an action group to automatically extend these to 90 degrees?  I can click on the Action Groups in the VAB, and I can select the Alligator part...but I don't see an option for extending/retracting.  I always end up right-clicking and then manually setting the target angle.  I'd like to figure this out because I'm assuming I'll be able to use these later on with the space station building.

Any help here would be keen, and I thank you in advance.  I'm sure I'll have more questions later!

[Fraktal]

56 minutes ago, Popestar said:

How does one build a space station, really?  I know I have to built it in pieces/sections and fly the individual sections up to orbit, and then somehow dock them (I have to go through the docking tutorial yet).  But how does one actually build the sections?  As an example, take a look at the Resolute from Lost in Space.  I know it's a ship, but a large portion of this ship is circular tubing, which you see in all kinds of science fiction ships.  How do you go about building these?  And would you have to build a half-circle, get that into orbit, then the other half?

Kinda, First you need to decide where you want the station to be. Every module you attach shifts the station's center of mass and makes it wobble to an increasingly greater degree if you try to change its orientation, so consider the station to be un-movable beyond small orbital correction maneuvers once you start putting it together. You can, however, work around this by packing the station up via attaching every module end-to-end in a straight line to minimize thruster torque before moving the station, then unpacking it once you arrive. And for the sake of whatever deity the kerbals worship, use autostruts!

For docking, you need one docking port on each module (obviously). Each docking port can only dock with ports of the same size (so the junior and senior ports can only dock with themselves and none of the others can dock with these two) and the bigger the docking port, the more structurally stable it's going to be. Do some orbital rendezvous maneuvers in low Kerbin orbit and familiarize yourself with RCS translation controls first but the gist of it is that you need to point your docking port at the other docking port (SAS can do this for you if you have a high enough level pilot or probe core to set SAS to hold-target and set the other docking port as target) and approach head-on at slow (<1 m/s) speed until you get close enough for the magnets kick in and pull the two docking ports together into a lock.

Expect your first docking maneuvers to be hour-long games of patience but once you get the hang of using RCS, you'll be working much faster. You can do Control from Here on docking ports so that the navball, SAS direction locking and RCS controls all use the docking port's orientation as fore/aft/left/right/up/down directional reference. As docking is a very precise and low-speed/low-acceleration maneuver, you don't need a lot of delta-V for it; most of the time, 20 units of monopropellant is more than enough for a docking maneuver with a 1.25m ship. What matters more than fuel is that you place the RCS thrusters as close to the craft's center of mass as possible to minimize torque; I recommend grabbing the RCS Build Aid mod for this, it's really good.

If you want the station to be a fuel depot for interplanetary flights, place it in a low orbit. Aside from being easier to reach from the surface for refueling purposes, your ships will be able to make better use of the Oberth effect. Once you've got mining down pat, you can consider setting up an orbital fuel depot above Minmus because 1) it's near the outer edge of Kerbin's SOI so you don't need to burn much to go interplanetary and 2) its surface gravity is very low, so hauling ore/fuel up from the surface to keep the station topped up is very easy. Minmus works better for this purpose than the Mun.

56 minutes ago, Popestar said:

Part of being able to refuel ships is to actually process mined ore...which there are no tutorials on that I can see.  In fact, I've got a contract available in my career game right now to go grab 450 lbs. (lbs?  ounces?  Kerb-units?  Kilos?) of ore from the Mun, but I don't see any drilling equipment or drilling parts.  How does one actually drill for, extract, return, and process ore?

Mining parts are at the tail end of the tech tree's bottom nodes. First you need to send a Survey Scanner to the Mun on a moderately high polar orbit and have it get the rough distribution of ore deposits on the surface. Next, use a Narrow-Band Scanner and a Surface Scanning Module to find spots with good ore yields.

The mining vehicle needs a Drill-O-Matic (radially-mounted drill, it needs to be able to reach the ground while extended), a Convert-O-Tron (turns ore into fuel) and an ore tank. The Convert-O-Tron also produces a helluva lot of heat while cooking and will shut down if it overheats, so bring radiators and/or Thermal Control Systems. You're also going to need power; solar will suffice but if your mining vehicle has conventional liquid fuel/oxidizer engines, a Fuel Cell is ideal because the Convert-O-Tron will cook fuel faster than the Fuel Cell uses it up, making the process self-sustaining.

As the contract says, you can also transport ore off-world but be advised: filled ore tanks are heavy. Also, mining and refining goes faster if the mining vehicle has a high-level engineer onboard.

56 minutes ago, Popestar said:

Which is better to launch pieces of a space station into orbit - a rocket, or a plane?

Depends on how big a piece is. Two junior docking ports, a girder and some antennas plus batteries don't need more than a moderately-sized 1.25m rocket. If it's a science lab or Hitchhiker Storage Module, you'll need something bigger. Fairings or cargo bays are recommended in either case.

Also don't forget that putting the module into orbit is not enough, you also need to get it to the station. For that, you can either equip whatever lifter vehicle brought the module to orbit with RCS, or build a dedicated worker craft with RCS only and have it do the hauling: bring the module close to the station, stop, dock the worker to the module, undock the module from the lifter, use the worker to slot the module into place on the station.

Edited November 14, 2020 by Fraktal

[eatU4myT]

Depending on your feelings about mods, you may want to look into Nertea's "Space Station Expansion Redux", as it adds a huge amount of options here. Not to say you can't do it in stock, but I found it enormously more satisfying with these extra parts. Nertea's Near Future - Solar and Near Future - Construction are also worth a look for space stations. Also, there is a mod called something like Docking Port Rotation, which is a revelation for building space stations in my mind - I always used to get grumpy that my lovely symmetrical designs in the VAB ended up wonky in space because I didn't get them perfectly rotated when docking, and this takes away that frustration at a stroke.

A common way to build is to start with a core, that is packed with docking ports, and then add modules to that with specific purposes - a living space module, a solar array, a science module perhaps, some big fuel tanks. Just remember - you need docking ports spare at the end so that other ships can dock with your station! Generally, how ever many docking ports you need, put on more!

I would suggest using rockets to get the pieces up there, as it is easier, and you aren't over-concerned about funds. It also means you have more leeway over the shape of the module you are sending up - it doesn't have to be the same shape as the spaceplane's cargo bay!

You'll discover that you don't actually want your space station in LKO to have ore processing equipment. As Fraktal says, ore is heavy! A more convenient set up is usually to drill for ore and process it at the same site, and then fly the resulting fuel to your LKO station to build up a stockpile to refuel visiting rockets. So, plenty of fuel tanks is what you need at this stage!

To control robotic parts I think you need the big yellow "KAL" controller part (or whatever it is called). Lots of people will be able to help with that, but it's probably worth asking as a separate question!

 

[Fraktal]

2 hours ago, eatU4myT said:

A more convenient set up is usually to drill for ore and process it at the same site, and then fly the resulting fuel to your LKO station to build up a stockpile to refuel visiting rockets.

How about both the miner and the station having processing equipment? Land, mine until the miner's fuel tanks are full, keep mining until the ore tanks are also full, take off, dock, dump the ore on the station, then undock, go back down and resume mining while the station is working on the ore. The miner itself only carries enough fuel for ferrying the ore and self-refuels, the fuel that gets cooked at the station stays on the station.

Edited November 14, 2020 by Fraktal

[Spricigo]

4 hours ago, Fraktal said:

First you need to send a Survey Scanner to the Mun on a moderately high polar orbit and have it get the rough distribution of ore deposits on the surface. Next, use a Narrow-Band Scanner and a Surface Scanning Module to find spots with good ore yields.

Mind you, all that is optimal, since you can compensate for a low yield with extra drills or/and time. I

[Popestar]

Still don't understand how to build a circular section.  Help?

[Popestar]

Anyone?

[Superfluous J]

On 11/15/2020 at 2:38 PM, Popestar said:

Still don't understand how to build a circular section.  Help?

First you need to know that there is 0 in-game reason to do this, and 0 in-game tools to facilitate it. So as far as the game is concerned, you're doing something sub-optimal and are kind of on your own. That said, the rule-of-cool can make this fun anyway (or even because it's outside the norm)

Why do you want a circular section? Do you want to simulate some specific ship, or space station, or something else?

[Popestar]

10 minutes ago, Superfluous J said:

First you need to know that there is 0 in-game reason to do this, and 0 in-game tools to facilitate it. So as far as the game is concerned, you're doing something sub-optimal and are kind of on your own. That said, the rule-of-cool can make this fun anyway (or even because it's outside the norm)

Why do you want a circular section? Do you want to simulate some specific ship, or space station, or something else?

Rule of cool is the reasoning.  And in actuality, what I want to do is create kind of a circular stairway look.  A single shaft in the middle with a spiraling tube section on the outside.  However, with what you said about no in game tools means I will have to go a different direction

[Spricigo]

43 minutes ago, Popestar said:

Rule of cool is the reasoning.  And in actuality, what I want to do is create kind of a circular stairway look.  A single shaft in the middle with a spiraling tube section on the outside.  However, with what you said about no in game tools means I will have to go a different direction

A quick search at kerbalx.com for ring station shows that, even if not practical (to build, deploy or use), ring station are quite possible. 

Anyways, if is inspiration  that you need don't look at me. Look at people like @Matt Lowne 

Spoiler

 

 

[Popestar]

@spiricigo, that doesn't tell me HOW to build it.  The video goes way too fast for me to see how the circular sections are being assembled.

[Spricigo]

10 minutes ago, Popestar said:

The video goes way too fast for me to see how the circular sections are being assembled.

Even if you set the reproduction speed to 0.25? 

Still, don't look at me, I'm not one of those people that are interested in building ring stations. Go find people that are: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=ksp+ring+station+building+tutorial 

[Popestar]

23 hours ago, Spricigo said:

Even if you set the reproduction speed to 0.25? 

Still, don't look at me, I'm not one of those people that are interested in building ring stations. Go find people that are: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=ksp+ring+station+building+tutorial 

Then why are you responding?  I thank you for the YouTube search link, but if this isn't your thing, why make a point to say that?

[Spricigo]

7 hours ago, Popestar said:

 I thank you for the YouTube search link, but if this isn't your thing, why make a point to say that?

I'm just saying if that was something in my repertoire I'd be happy to offer something like a craft file, images of my own creations and explanation of the techniques. But it is something I have seen in Matt's videos.

In other words, while I have the will to help in this question, pointing to better sources of info in the subject seems to be the best in this particular case.

In any case, can't see why to consider a problem if recognise that are people that know more about a subject.

[Popestar]

6 minutes ago, Spricigo said:

I'm just saying if that was something in my repertoire I'd be happy to offer something like a craft file, images of my own creations and explanation of the techniques. But it is something I have seen in Matt's videos.

In other words, while I have the will to help in this question, pointing to better sources of info in the subject seems to be the best in this particular case.

In any case, can't see why to consider a problem if recognise that are people that know more about a subject.

Then it's on me for how I read it.  Tone and inflection are hard to get across in text, and I read it wrong.  Simple as that.

I do again thank you for the YouTube link; I will put that to good use!

[Zhetaan]

On 11/15/2020 at 2:38 PM, Popestar said:

Still don't understand how to build a circular section.  Help?

As I understand it, there are three basic ways.

First, get circular parts.  There are a few mods out there that have single-part habitation rings and such; some of them even spin.  It's obviously the low-creativity solution, but the advantage is that you don't have to worry about alignment or anything like that; so long as you can loft it to orbit, you get a ring station.

Second, build a symmetric ring in the VAB, then send it to orbit.  You should know that there are no ways to build rings in the stock game; it has to do with the 'tree' structure of the parts (the 'tree' system is also why the first part is called the 'root' part).  What this means for you is that every part on your vessel has to have one path linking it back to the root; there can be many branches, but no rings in this system.  This means that your rings are actually curved arms.  However, there are ways around the limitation.  The stock way is to clip a docking port in the end of each section so that they connect; docking ports work a little differently and so can create rings.  The modded way is to use ReCoupler, which creates ring connections.  This avoids docking ports (aside from the ones you want use for, you know, docking ships).  The advantages are that you get good alignment usually right away, and for stability, you can use struts because it's all one vessel in the VAB; the disadvantages are that without docking port or ReCoupler connections,  the station can be wobbly, and getting it to orbit in one piece can be unwieldy.

Third, you can assemble the parts of the rings in pieces and send them to orbit individually.  I'd strongly recommend a mod that either helps you with docking port alignment or else restricts docking ports so that they can only go together when they are aligned properly; otherwise your ring station begins to look like a mangled bicycle wheel.  The advantage here is that you can send it up to orbit in manageable pieces, but you lose the assistance of struts to keep everything stable unless you have a mod that assists with that.