1.11 for console

[crazykerbal 2467]

when is 1.11 for console? is there will be a revamps? why is it updating slower than the pc version? i am waitig for the 1.11 for consoles i have both dlc

[Corona688]

By longstanding tradition, they don't publish hard dates and it's against the rules to beg for them.

Console is much harder to program for than PC.

[Curveball Anders]

On 4/19/2021 at 6:24 PM, crazykerbal 2467 said:

when is 1.11 for console? is there will be a revamps? why is it updating slower than the pc version? i am waitig for the 1.11 for consoles i have both dlc

The thing is that the console version is made by another company, after Squad has frozen their latest version.

So, sadly, console versions will always come several months after the main releases.

The only good thing is that you doesn't have to deal with xx.0, xx.1, xx.2 ...

[Guest]

18 hours ago, Corona688 said:

Console is much harder to program for than PC.

C++ is more ‘involved’ I agree, but I think Unity is still used in the console version so uses C# anyway? 

I think more likely:

13 hours ago, Curveball Anders said:

The thing is that the console version is made by another company, after Squad has frozen their latest version.

So, sadly, console versions will always come several months after the main releases.

The only good thing is that you doesn't have to deal with xx.0, xx.1, xx.2 ...

 

And because it’s a different company it could be anything from a completely different business model to a ‘behind the scenes’ licence issue that limits the version they can release. No idea but it is what it is unfortunately.

[Jack Mcslay]

20 hours ago, Corona688 said:

By longstanding tradition, they don't publish hard dates and it's against the rules to beg for them.

Console is much harder to program for than PC.

Not really, PS4 and X1 are basically gaming PCs already, their CPUs and GPUs are only slightly different than what's in a desktop computer. The difference is that console manufacturers are much more strict in what software is allowed, and KSP isn't exactly the most stable game out there. They need to do extensive testing to make sure the update won't be likely to cause the game to crash, freeze or do a soft lock or Microsoft and Sony will bite them in the ass.

[Curveball Anders]

3 hours ago, FruitGoose said:

C++ is more ‘involved’ I agree, but I think Unity is still used in the console version so uses C# anyway?

The thing is that Squad doesn't have resources/skills to develop for consoles.

So they've chosen to contract an external partner, with said resources/skills, to port/adapt their code to consoles.

It's bread and butter in software development,

But it also means that the external partner will not touch a target in motion, they will not get engaged until Squad says "this is the release".

Made even more obvious by the fact that you can't post an "oops, sorry patch" on consoles
since every release has to be evaluated of each console masterminds.

2 hours ago, Jack Mcslay said:

Not really, PS4 and X1 are basically gaming PCs already, their CPUs and GPUs are only slightly different than what's in a desktop computer. The difference is that console manufacturers are much more strict in what software is allowed, and KSP isn't exactly the most stable game out there. They need to do extensive testing to make sure the update won't be likely to cause the game to crash, freeze or do a soft lock or Microsoft and Sony will bite them in the ass.

CPU and GPU is irrelevant in most cases.

PS4 and XBox have a quite different software environment, they don't run on standard Win/Mac/Linux.

Which actually makes is easier to code for consoles, but messes up porting from Win/Mac/Linux.

And few studios (or software developers at large) are actually coding for one platform anymore.

Much more profit if the software, regardless of what, can run on as many platforms as possible.

[Bej Kerman]

I don't think posts asking for a console/switch/toaster port should be allowed. It's a bit of a tired topic now - asking for Squad to hurry up on a 1.11 release or to make a Nintendo Toaster port won't affect anything, and the answer is always usually 'it's already being worked on' or 'no'.

[Jack Mcslay]

20 minutes ago, Curveball Anders said:

CPU and GPU is irrelevant in most cases.

PS4 and XBox have a quite different software environment, they don't run on standard Win/Mac/Linux.

Which actually makes is easier to code for consoles, but messes up porting from Win/Mac/Linux.

And few studios (or software developers at large) are actually coding for one platform anymore.

Much more profit if the software, regardless of what, can run on as many platforms as possible.

CPU was extremely relevant in PS2 and PS3, it required a good expertise in programming in order to better optimize the game.

The difference between X-Box and Windows are small, that was the idea for the XBox from the beginning, to have a console that could easily bring PC developers, the 'X' comes from that it uses a DirectX API.
Playstation is n the same ballpark with Linux, as it's largely base in implementations of open source APIs with their proprietary extensions.

It is far easier to port a Windows game to X-Box than porting that same game to a Mac. Squad can keep releasing their multiple versions simultaneously only because the Unity engine does the porting for them.

[Curveball Anders]

10 minutes ago, Jack Mcslay said:

 Squad can keep releasing their multiple versions simultaneously only because the Unity engine does the porting for them.

Indeed, remember that Unity and short time from idea to market was a critical part of KSP's existence ...

Harvester was given a short amount of time (6 months?) to prove that it could be done.

So Unity was his way forward, there's no way that he could have proven his business plan to his bosses that fast coding from scratch.

[Corona688]

On 5/14/2021 at 7:44 AM, Jack Mcslay said:

Not really, PS4 and X1 are basically gaming PCs already

Take it from someone who has actually ported software to strange architectures:  The day you can program for one without the assistance of a real computer is the day you can call them equivalent.  They have the right parts, but they're not connected the same way, and the only OS they have to speak of is mostly concerned with preventing access to anything.  Programming for them is therefore a real pain in the ass.

On 5/14/2021 at 6:16 AM, FruitGoose said:

C++ is more ‘involved’ I agree, but I think Unity is still used in the console version so uses C# anyway?

Who said anything about C++?  i'm talking architecture and operating system.

The test release crashed?  Better post the logs LOL there aren't any because you're on console.  Et cetera.  Lacking a true operating system and being incredibly restricted in access of all sorts makes programming for console environments an incredible pain in the ass, so much so that the programming isn't done on the console, but specialized software on an actual computer attached to it.

And if only it were as easy as Unity doing all the porting for you, then the console port would have been perfect first try.

Edited May 16, 2021 by Corona688

[Guest]

7 hours ago, Corona688 said:

Who said anything about C++?  i'm talking architecture and operating system.

The test release crashed?  Better post the logs LOL there aren't any because you're on console.  Et cetera.  Lacking a true operating system and being incredibly restricted in access of all sorts makes programming for console environments an incredible pain in the ass, so much so that the programming isn't done on the console, but specialized software on an actual computer attached to it.

And if only it were as easy as Unity doing all the porting for you, then the console port would have been perfect first try.

 

Yes but you don’t release untested software on a format you can’t get logs from. The testing process needs to be more thorough (or you wait until a stable version has been achieved in other ports- hence the delay in releasing for console as originally asked).

TBH I’ve never ported anything to console, but if it’s anything like porting from Windows to Linux or iOS or Android it is the same as the program you’re using does the ‘translating’ for you. And as Unity is very ‘new-user friendly’ I’d be very shocked if it doesn’t do the same (again never done for console to be clear).

 

[kspnerd122]

On 5/14/2021 at 9:44 AM, Jack Mcslay said:

Not really, PS4 and X1 are basically gaming PCs already, their CPUs and GPUs are only slightly different than what's in a desktop computer. The difference is that console manufacturers are much more strict in what software is allowed, and KSP isn't exactly the most stable game out there. They need to do extensive testing to make sure the update won't be likely to cause the game to crash, freeze or do a soft lock or Microsoft and Sony will bite them in the ass.

Thats just false, look at actual specs, RAM is excrements, so be prepared for lag

[Jack Mcslay]

17 hours ago, kspnerd122 said:

Thats just false, look at actual specs, RAM is excrements, so be prepared for lag

X1 has 8GB of ram with a higher bandwidth than dual-channel DDR4-3200, which according to Steam's statistics is better than nearly 40% current gamers' PCs. Unless the devs want to exclude around 40% of their potential customer base then they would have to have a game that could run on it anyway.

[Corona688]

On 5/16/2021 at 3:01 AM, FruitGoose said:

TBH I’ve never ported anything to console, but if it’s anything like porting from Windows to Linux or iOS or Android it is the same as the program you’re using does the ‘translating’ for you.

In theory.  Remember the console release?  Yea...  it's really not that easy.  There's always corners and issues the computer can't fix for you.

Porting to Linux is relatively easy, because (ironically) it's one of the least forgiving software environments - it will make a 30-page list of your programming flaws and staple it to your forehead.  30 years of being ported to every toaster gave Linux devs practice at porting.  I was heavily involved back when home computers went 64-bit.  That ripped the floor out from under a lot of old software, when lazy assumptions that worked for 30 years straight suddenly didn't.

Edited June 10, 2021 by Corona688

[wpetula]

On 4/19/2021 at 12:24 PM, crazykerbal 2467 said:

when is 1.11 for console?

Same release date as Half Life 3.