[0.90] Procedural Dynamics - Procedural Wing 0.9.3 Dec 24

[DYJ]

Update to 0.3 released, should fix the rightclick issues and add working FAR support.

[Subcidal]

Yay this was my main compatability concern starting up on KSP again.

Cheers.

[Wyseman76]

Link isn't working

[Doomydoom]

I don't think the FAR support is working quite right.

http://i.imgur.com/acRbI98.jpg

I don't think airplanes work like this: http://i.imgur.com/eeClM9G.jpg

Edited May 28, 2013 by Doomydoom

[DYJ]

http://i.imgur.com/Lp56WDV.jpg

Not sure what to tell you, planes are crazy pWings or not.

[Doomydoom]

Argh, maybe FAR has some new problems or something then.

[DYJ]

FAR isn't perfect so it's quite possible to make weird stuff with pWings that breaks the FAR math, your second example is probably a good example of this. Maybe I should add "Warranty void on impossibly shaped wings"

[White Owl]

Thank you so much for FAR support! If this works out, I may never use a stock wing part again.

[Camacha]

Thank you so much for FAR support! If this works out, I may never use a stock wing part again.

Same here. Can't live without FAR, but this is promising to be pretty funky too.

[ferram4]

@Doomydoom: The FAR problems can basically be explained by "if you have enough thrust you can make anything fly as fast as you want." Really, the problem there isn't that you're managing to get the plane to go that fast, it's that it isn't flying apart as it goes transonic. That can probably be handled with some extra code...

[Konraden]

@Doomydoom: The FAR problems can basically be explained by "if you have enough thrust you can make anything fly as fast as you want." Really, the problem there isn't that you're managing to get the plane to go that fast, it's that it isn't flying apart as it goes transonic. That can probably be handled with some extra code...

Can we not turn this into cartoon X-Plane?

[Doomydoom]

I'm just using the stock engine. FAR didn't have a replacement in this latest version.

Something has to be backwards. My designs based on gliders are flying much much faster than those based on actual supersonic aircraft. Like 1.5 Mach faster at the same altitude. They're also obscenely maneuverable when they shouldn't be able to maneuver much at all.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Doomydoom

[ferram4]

Ah, I messed up and didn't bring over the change to the engines for this version; will be in the nest one.

Gliders actual have much less drag than supersonic craft below Mach 1, so if the increase in drag from mach effects isn't great enough then the glider-based designs will have an advantage. Realistically, delta wings always make less lift than straight wings, it's just that they have better drag characteristics and are less likely to be ripped off at transonic and supersonic speeds.

I'll go and look into fixing that.

[White Owl]

Okay, I've played around with it a little bit, and this mod is every bit as good as advertised. My only wish is for allowing the same treatment to all-moving control surfaces - what the stock game calls winglets.

Edit: Ah, you can save and reload a custom wing part with the subassembly loader. Verrry nice.

Edit again: This works with Tweakable Parameters too! I am so excited about the possibilities.

Edited May 29, 2013 by White Owl

[Taverius]

Okay, I've played around with it a little bit, and this mod is every bit as good as advertised. My only wish is for allowing the same treatment to all-moving control surfaces - what the stock game calls winglets.

Edit: Ah, you can save and reload a custom wing part with the subassembly loader. Verrry nice.

Edit again: This works with Tweakable Parameters too! I am so excited about the possibilities.

DYJ started work with control surfaces, but there's some issues with pesky symmetry copies, so it might be a ways off

[KhaosCorp]

Not sure if 'wow' even comes close....

this is really amazing.....and so many uses past makin wings

honestly I was a bit iffy about this when I first looked at it...but 5min in game messin with wing sections and I can tell this is something im gonna end up using a lot!

Awesome Mod!!!!!

[Camacha]

Like everyone here I feel I am going to use this mod a lot. The only quibble I have is that wings, due to them being a single entity, seem a little stronger and less vulnerable than stock wings. I understand this is probably because of how KSP handles parts - I am not sure how to fix this besides making a wing out of multiple pWings - but I always kind of dislike mods that make KSP easier.

[White Owl]

I'm rebuilding a shuttle using these pWings. I'm ecstatic about the freedom to create exactly the wing shape I want... but there's one small bug. None of the pWing parts are crossfeeding fuel, so I have to run fuel lines all over the vehicle.

[DYJ]

Camacha - We currently calculate the attach strength of the part based on the size, but they are definitely on the strong side. We might want to tone it down a little. I could look into a aeroelastic variant too, sort of like the helicopter rotorblades I made a while ago.....

White Owl - I'll add crossfeed to the .cfg . Though I thought they already had that .

Also:

[White Owl]

The cfg file does have crossfeed enabled. That's why it's a bug.

Just a small quibble, anyway.

[DYJ]

Looking at my pics from yesterday I can see that crossfeed was clearly working as intended then, want to post a pic of what isn't working?

[White Owl]

Oof, I just realized my mistake and was coming back to edit the previous post, but you're too damn fast! LOL

False alarm. The problem isn't necessarily with this mod. I used Tweakable Parameters to add fuel and oxidizer to a couple of wing parts, stuck more wing parts to the tips, and hung engines on them. Since your wings crossfeed fuel just fine under normal circumstances, the bug most likely is with Tweakable Parameters.

Nothing to see here; carry on. Feel free to smack me upside the head if you like.

Edit: Here's a new thought. I'm using several pWing pieces to make a wing with kind of complex geometry. When I adjust the size of one small wing piece, I have to be very very careful not to allow my mouse cursor to stray onto any neighboring pieces. It's fiddly and occasionally frustrating work.

Would it be possible to make some kind of lock, so that a given piece will be safe from accidental edits?

Edited May 30, 2013 by White Owl

[Taverius]

Oof, I just realized my mistake and was coming back to edit the previous post, but you're too damn fast! LOL

False alarm. The problem isn't necessarily with this mod. I used Tweakable Parameters to add fuel and oxidizer to a couple of wing parts, stuck more wing parts to the tips, and hung engines on them. Since your wings crossfeed fuel just fine under normal circumstances, the bug most likely is with Tweakable Parameters.

Nothing to see here; carry on. Feel free to smack me upside the head if you like.

Edit: Here's a new thought. I'm using several pWing pieces to make a wing with kind of complex geometry. When I adjust the size of one small wing piece, I have to be very very careful not to allow my mouse cursor to stray onto any neighboring pieces. It's fiddly and occasionally frustrating work.

Would it be possible to make some kind of lock, so that a given piece will be safe from accidental edits?

Nope. You've just found out why nobody does wings with fuel in them. It breaks fuel flow.

The other being that since wings are very light, adding fuel to them multiples the drag they do by large factors. No bug here, merely how KSP works and LF is defined as a resource.

Like everyone here I feel I am going to use this mod a lot. The only quibble I have is that wings, due to them being a single entity, seem a little stronger and less vulnerable than stock wings. I understand this is probably because of how KSP handles parts - I am not sure how to fix this besides making a wing out of multiple pWings - but I always kind of dislike mods that make KSP easier.

There is a long-standing bug in KSP which makes symmetry copies of a surface-attached part flex less, and snap first under forces. In order to minimize the amount of struts you need to make your plane fly somewhat straight instead of always turn to one side, the connection strength formula is somewhat generous.

The connection forced are easy to modify:

public float connectionFactor = 150f

public float connectionMinimum = 50f

connectionFactor is the number by which square root of the lift of a pWing, and its child parts which are also pWings, is multiplied.

connectionMinimum should be obvious, its just a floor we apply so that if you make very small wings they will not move by meters under the influence of the smallest force, as they are wont to do.

Small wings in KSP do not have set connection force values and use the default value, so if you set the minimum to 0 you will have very strange results with very small wings, where they move from their position by multiples of their dimensions without snapping off.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Taverius

[Camacha]

Camacha - We currently calculate the attach strength of the part based on the size, but they are definitely on the strong side. We might want to tone it down a little. I could look into a aeroelastic variant too, sort of like the helicopter rotorblades I made a while ago.....

If it is on the radar, I am happy. Just wanted to make sure this was mentioned.

[White Owl]

I've been wanting to make a tail like this for a while now.