Do you Cheat?

[Umlüx]

Do you cheat when playing KSP? Occasionally or regularly?

i would not consider mods like MechJeb a Cheat, but putting your craft into orbit with HyperEdit or editing the savefile is.

I have 2 saves in the moment, one i go completely wild and one i try to play legit. I couldnt stand it and had to edit my savefile once or twice to brig poor Jeb back from the dead.

[Odo]

I've never cheated, and never intend to I don't use any assistive mods like mechjeb either.

[PDCWolf]

Never cheated. By the way, both in hyperedit and mechjeb you have to press a button to go to orbit, unless you made a really crappy and uncontrollable rocket, so how comes one is cheating and the other isn't?.

Anyways, before anyone gets mad, I like to believe that definition of cheating is just for this thread and not in general, even if people agrees with it outside the thread.

[Sephta]

Why is it important to someone, if someone else cheats in a single-player game? Ego-boost? Affirmation? Something else?

You play as you like, if you reach your goals in the game and you're satisfied: good for you! Someone else has different goals, draws his satisfaction from another point of the game, that's perfectly ok and it doesn't effect you in the slightest way.

So: why ask? (This is a serious question, because I don't get the point btw.)

[karolus10]

"Cheating" is a bad world, You just spawning on Jool orbit, because You're the awesome hacker !

Also You can't cheat in game without player competition .

[Brotoro]

If the game screws me over with some bug or weird behavior, I'll certainly edit the save file to fix things... so I've cheated by Umlüx's definition.

Also, I needed a certain flag for the astronauts on a vessel launched back in version 0.19, so I edited the save file to give them that flag (instead of the generic flag). So I cheated again.

I'm so bad.

[Umlüx]

@ Sephta

its perfectly fine to play the way you want. i'm just curious, nothing more to it.

[Kialar]

Is Kerbonaut-Name-Editing = cheating?

[Psycho529]

Is Kerbonaut-Name-Editing = cheating?

Not really... just picking a crew

[Van Disaster]

I've used Hyperedit in the past when I'm fed up with replacing randomly exploding stations, that's about it. I didn't feel cheated, so that wasn't cheating.

[joppiesaus]

Nope, sometimes I quicksave, only if I do something new(landing on a planet where you haven't landed before)

[Kialar]

Not really... just picking a crew

Then. I don't cheat.

Never used quicksave btw. If a mission fails, it fails.

[Uncle Mort]

I would consider that using Hyperedit to put some normally unlaunchable craft in to orbit to be the nearest thing to cheating in this game. I spent about an hour's worth of play trying to get a new super-duper kethane mine craft in to orbit. Made it in the end and the pleasure I got made it worthwhile; now I just have to refuel it for transfer to the Mun.

[Akalaël]

Why is it important to someone, if someone else cheats in a single-player game? Ego-boost? Affirmation? Something else?

You play as you like, if you reach your goals in the game and you're satisfied: good for you! Someone else has different goals, draws his satisfaction from another point of the game, that's perfectly ok and it doesn't effect you in the slightest way.

So: why ask? (This is a serious question, because I don't get the point btw.)

I don't get the point myself. I've got too bad English to answer the question, but I think we got here a nice philosophical subject...

Is it the structure of the actual games ? You can't have nowdays a game without some achievements, success, something that congrats the player, that puts him in a hierarchy. Is it the society ? Always be performant, be classified and so on ?

See, I've got 125 sucess for the Lambda game, I'm the 12598th in the world classment !

The difficulty in this game, talking about hierarchy and so on, is that THERE IS NO CLASSEMENT, no sucess, no score, no nothing.

We want to be the first, the only one, the best. And we merely can't.

We have to figure out to find auto-satisfaction by our achievements.

And then, when we get the satisfaction to accomplish something that we find great (put a mega orbital station into Laythe's orbit) we can see that someone did the same thing with [insert here your loved/hated addons].

And that's breaking the satisfaction we need.

Is that why it is important to know why some are cheating or not ? To restaure our own satisfaction ?

[Henri von Braun]

I don't get the point myself. I've got too bad English to answer the question, but I think we got here a nice philosophical subject...

Is it the structure of the actual games ? You can't have nowdays a game without some achievements, success, something that congrats the player, that puts him in a hierarchy. Is it the society ? Always be performant, be classified and so on ?

See, I've got 125 sucess for the Lambda game, I'm the 12598th in the world classment !

The difficulty in this game, talking about hierarchy and so on, is that THERE IS NO CLASSEMENT, no sucess, no score, no nothing.

We want to be the first, the only one, the best. And we merely can't.

We have to figure out to find auto-satisfaction by our achievements.

And then, when we get the satisfaction to accomplish something that we find great (put a mega orbital station into Laythe's orbit) we can see that someone did the same thing with [insert here your loved/hated addons].

And that's breaking the satisfaction we need.

Is that why it is important to know why some are cheating or not ? To restaure our own satisfaction ?

Exactly. Who cares about that, its just you and YOUR game, no one else, right ? No hierarchy needed, just your gameplay.

[Kerbal01]

I use hyperedit to get stations Up in orbit nothing else

[AlternNocturn]

Depends what you mean by "cheating". If you mean

, then yes. But only because people keep asking this question. Edited June 12, 2013 by AlternNocturn

[Umlüx]

who says something about hierarchy or ego boost? i am far from judging anybody, i just wanted to know how the kerbal community thinks...

you can get satisfaction from achieving orbit yourself, or just to see your ship edited there and floating amongst the stars. its a sandbox and you choose your own goals. i was merely interested in the way, players try to achieve them.

[Tortoise]

Who cheats in a game like KSP? If you do, you really shouldnt play it.

[MDBenson]

I use MechJeb2 for a lot of guidance and piloting. It's not a cheat, it's computerised guidance, most modern rockets have it.

I use Hyper Edit to drop test craft into orbits and transfer windows to run test simulations on landing behaviour, transfer times etc. Again this is something modern space programs do all the time.

I don't 'cheat' as in just build all my stuff and put it on planets and the like. Once I hit a good design and the sims prove it will work I go fly it, however that might be (usually several launches then assemble in orbit and then fly it).

Edited June 12, 2013 by MDBenson

[stibbons]

I cheat a little. For my RelayTech communications satellites, I launch them and put them in orbit myself. I'll get the peri and apo within a couple of hundred metres and the inclination as close as I can without using MechJeb. But after that I edit the orbit parameters to get a more stable orbit. That means I can have three or four satellites in almost identical orbits, without having to go and tweak their orbits every couple of days to make sure they keep a good spread.

Seems to me to be a good compromise between the challenging part of setting up a network, and the tedious part of maintaining it. But I might look in to MechJeb soon to help nail sats to nice orbits.

[jwenting]

Well said MD. Real orbital trajectories, burn points and durations, etc. etc. aren't plotted by hand, they're done by mission computers.

In fact the Soviets had their cosmonauts on board pretty much as passengers, their ships were effectively guided missiles, guided by a combination of on board computers and the big systems at mission control.

Mechjeb and Kerbal Engineering Redux perform those functions, and still leave plenty of time for seat of the pants flying as they can't do everything.

[Sephta]

Esactly the point, why I wonder...

there's no competition anywhere in KSP - you have to think of a way to achieve your own set goals. If you do, great, if you fail: you'll find another or a better way. All by yourself.

Mechjeb, editing the persistent file... all different kinds to safe time, make it more comfortable - or is it cheating? I'm replenishing my Kethane deposits - a complete refill of my interplanetary carrier takes more Kethane, than Mün normally provides (it also takes around 20 trips to the surface an back, so yes, I use mechjeb - after the 200th time I was bored to steer manually).

On the other hand: I stay away from overpowered mod-parts - for me, the way to get things to other points in the system is too easy then.

Comes back the question: when cheating is different for everybody in a sandbox game, why ask? You can't get a reliable answer anyway.

[tek_604]

I use MechJeb2 for a lot of guidance and piloting. It's not a cheat, it's computerised guidance, most modern rockets have it.

I use Hyper Edit to drop test craft into orbits and transfer windows to run test simulations on landing behaviour, transfer times etc. Again this is something modern space programs do all the time.

I don't 'cheat' as in just build all my stuff and put it on planets and the like. Once I hit a good design and the sims prove it will work I go fly it, however that might be (usually several launches then assemble in orbit and then fly it).

This is my thinking also. I use MJ for everything, but, I still find the challenge in designing stuff that will fly correctly, without MJ overloading itself, or giving an unrealistic launch profile (I once designed a launcher, which even with MJ, would actually burn towards the ground as the lower stages got spent, and then right itself after. This design was flawed, so I ditched it).

But, I don't even use HyperEdit to test designs in my live game. Designs are tested in flight. If a lander doesn't have enough fuel to land, or do an injection burn, then mission failed, they get renamed "Planet Shot n", and remain in Kerbol orbit.

[Decho]

I use mechjeb for any burns using ions, and for launching anything big if I've done it a few times already and can't be bothered. I use kerbal engineer redux because I hate having to go into map view and mouse over the apo or peri apsis to see what it is and time to. Other than that and occasionally allowing clipping in the VAB/SPH I don't cheat, and I do almost all 'flight' myself, certainly for things like correcting orbits, because mechjeb can't get them as precise as I like (mainly a concern for keosynchronous)