How to...kill horizontal speed (and doesn't kill Jeb!)

[thescientist]

Hi everyone!

During my first mun landing I touched ground with an horizontal speed of 0.5 m/s and my lander overturned , killing my crew. I were using ASAS and SAS but the ship had (and presently has) an high barycenter, so it weren't enought:(

How can I save my Kerbonaut?

Many thanks for Answers!

Edited June 19, 2013 by thescientist

[capi3101]

Without looking, I would say redesign the lander so that the base is wider and so the whole thing is not as tall. A good way to do this is with outboard fuel tanks and fuel lines; if you use 3 outboard and one centerline FL-T200 tanks, and run fuel lines from the outer tanks to the center, you wind up with the same amount of fuel as a single FL-T800 without it being nearly as tall. Place your lander legs on the outboard tanks.

RCS is helpful for uprighting a lander, incidentally, but you have to have a fair amount of RCS thrust available in order for it to work properly.

[Vanamonde]

Build landers with wide bases, like these,

and if you have RCS and ASAS installed, they will fight to keep the lander from tipping over.

[thescientist]

Without looking, I would say redesign the lander so that the base is wider and so the whole thing is not as tall. A good way to do this is with outboard fuel tanks and fuel lines; if you use 3 outboard and one centerline FL-T200 tanks, and run fuel lines from the outer tanks to the center, you wind up with the same amount of fuel as a single FL-T800 without it being nearly as tall. Place your lander legs on the outboard tanks.

RCS is helpful for uprighting a lander, incidentally, but you have to have a fair amount of RCS thrust available in order for it to work properly.

How can I post screenshot?

My lander is so heavy because I can't perform docking, so it has enought fuel and thurst to go back to Kerbin. It has only a single stage because the radially mounted nuclear engine were damaged in tests by a decoupler. it is made by an X 200-32 fuel tank, four nuclear engines, an FL-R1 RCS tank, an mk2 lander can and some other things...quite an horrible design, but it's the best that I made:)...I hope I'll learn how to dock and to pilot ships...

I'll try with the RCS because I have about 300 unit unused.

Thanks!

[thescientist]

Build landers with wide bases, like these,

and if you have RCS and ASAS installed, they will fight to keep the lander from tipping over.

mmmh...I have RCS and ASAS...it seem so simple to do!

P.s. fantastic landers... mine is horrible...

[spacecake]

See the first post for info on posting a screenshot

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/24533-Show-off-your-awesome-KSP-pictures!

[Vanamonde]

If you already have RCS, you can also hit the N key to press straight down and help "stick" the landing.

[Johnno]

If you already have RCS, you can also hit the N key to press straight down and help "stick" the landing.

On top of doing this I sometimes turn off my engine off the ground and let the lander drop the last few meters, depends on situation though. Mainly I use RCS to control horizontal speed with IJKL keys, which control translation movement. On a lander they'll thrust to the sides and if you thrust opposite of your horizontal 'drifting' you can get your speed under control. It takes some practice and situational awareness.

[Geschosskopf]

@ TheScientist

To post screenshots, you have to upload them somewhere. Then you surround it's URL with the tags and POOF, there it is. This of course assuming the place you uploaded it allows direct linking of the image, like Imgur does. If you use Flickr, you instead can only post links to the pics. There's a third option that allows you to post attachments uploaded directly from your computer but it requires permission from the admins which I don't know how to get.

Anyway, good luck with the lander. As folks have said, low and wide is the key to stability during touch-down. You can test your landing stability somewhat on Kerbin by hanging the lander from those red support leg thingies and various heights above the ground, and you can rotate the whole lander a few degrees in to the side to simulate landing with some slight horizontal speed. Make sure the supports are the 1st stage, below the lander's engine(s), so you can just release the lander without firing the rockets (the reverse of normal practice). The go to the launch pad, lower the legs, and then hit space to drop the lander.

What you learn from this is a bit limited due to Kerbin's higher gravity. Objects bounce a LOT higher on Mun so a slight rotation that doesn't go very far before the lander hits the ground again on Kerbin could actually flip you right over on Mun. Still, you at least get a good drop test of your design to know if it's strong enough to take the impacts .

If you're REALLY worried about flipping over, you can add some parts to help stand the lander back upright again. These can double as auxiliary landing gear, too, protecting the lander itself from damage in the event of toppling. A very useful part in this regard is the Fighter Tailwheel in the Firespitter mod. Put these on the top corners of the lander so they'll hit the ground first if the lander topples. Then set up the Gear action group so the tailwheels retract when you lower the main legs. Then create a custom action group to extend the tailwheel. Once the lander topples and stops bouncing, hit the extend tailwheel action group and the force of the wheel popping down will throw the whole lander up in the air and rotate it back up. You can also set up action groups to control the extension/retraction of each individual main leg, you can use parts from the Danmed/Infernal Robotics mods to rotate/hinge arms. You can use RCS and the capsule's own torque. Just make sure ASAS/SAS is off when you're trying to stand back up because it wants to keep you angled where you are right now.

I'm an inept pilot so righting fallen landers is a common occurrence for me. Provided you stitch your lander together well with struts so it doesn't break apart at the joints, and make sure the only parts that can touch the ground are strong enough to take it, you can flail around all over the place with legs, wheels, RCS, and torque, and utilize any slope of the ground, and eventually stand up again .

[Tokay Gris]

How about this for a really broad base?

EDIT: If anyone is interested in the craft-file, I will provide it gladly, but this will have to wait till next week, when I am at home again.

Edited June 18, 2013 by Tokay Gris

[thescientist]

Thanks to everyone!

and...

My first ribbon

http://ribbons.cgagnier.ca/image.php?ribbon=4399' alt='image.php?ribbon=4399'>

Edited June 19, 2013 by thescientist