lets talk about eve's oceans

[th3shameless]

During my eve mission today, it got me wondering what the oceans might be made of, I was thinking methane or something of the sort, but according to deadly reeantry its around 150c on the surface which is far to hot for methane to exist as a liquid. It could be some sort of metal. Given eves pressure compared to kerbin though, it could be a lot of things

[Holo]

Sulphur is liquid at that temperature. If you have some kind of colloid in it, I think you might be able to change the colour to match Eve's oceans.

[Good_Apollo]

Someone suggested silver or gallium but silver would still be solid so gallium is possible. This is only useful speculation if the Kerbal universe doesn't have fictitious elements...the way the Kerbol system defies some of our conventional rules in comparison to our Solar System, there must be some unusual elements present to explain the phenomena.

In comparison to Venus, Eve is unusual in having large bodies of liquid as it's not hot enough to melt any rock and only certain types of metals but hot enough to vaporize most everything else. If memory serves, Venus is so scorching with such high pressure that no liquid exists anywhere on the planet's surface. Misty liquid sulpheric acid in the atmosphere though. At a whopping 92 bar though, it sure would feel like swimming if you attempted to 'walk' around on the surface. There weren't Earth-like explosive volcanoes ejecting matter for that reason... they all just sort of oozed out and around which accounts for the impressively weird topography of Venus.

[EDIT] Looking through the elements, I suspect iodine is the most likely candidate with a melting point of 114C and a boiling point of 184C. Eve's surface of 150C is just hot enough for it to be liquid but not hot enough to boil away. That's if the surface temp is at a constant max of 150C though, the wiki says the surface low is -40C which complicates things a bit since the oceans seem to not be centralized to a specific area and, that I know of, we don't have a heat map of Eve nor yearly temperature variations so not too much can be assumed. It's possible, but unseen because of KSP's limited nature, that the oceans freeze over constantly but we don't know much about the planet to speculate too much.

Edited June 28, 2013 by Good_Apollo

[WhiteWeasel]

Mercury? Perhaps, so eve would be hot and toxic.

[Holo]

Mercury is very rare compared to other elements, I don't think that it could exist in large enough amounts to make an entire ocean on Eve.

[Brotoro]

Yes...things like gallium and mercury are pretty rare, so they seem unlikely to be major constituients in Eve's oceans. At five atmospheres, the boiling point of water is a little over 150C, and the boiling point would tend be be even higher if you add impurities (brine can have a boiling point I've 110C if I recall correctly).

I belive that NovaSilisko wanted the seas to be some sort of sludge rich in heavy elements, including blutonium.

[Brabbit1987]

Mercury is very rare compared to other elements, I don't think that it could exist in large enough amounts to make an entire ocean on Eve.

This is a serious question because I don't know. How would you be able to tell what elements are rare and which ones are not if we only have observed a fraction of a fraction of the universe? An element that may seem rare on one planet could be very abundant on another right? Unless, there is a specific reason that Mercury is a rare element? Maybe something to do with it's chemical composition?

[Good_Apollo]

Ah yes it could be mercury, actually. It would still freeze at -40C though. Unless I'm missing something, I never even took Chemistry lol. Atmospheric pressure is a factor, right?

Edited June 28, 2013 by Good_Apollo

[Brotoro]

This is a serious question because I don't know. How would you be able to tell what elements are rare and which ones are not if we only have observed a fraction of a fraction of the universe? An element that may seem rare on one planet could be very abundant on another right? Unless, there is a specific reason that Mercury is a rare element? Maybe something to do with it's chemical composition?

At least in our universe, which may well not be the same universe you find Kerbin in, the relative amounts of heavier elements formed in stars and supernovae determine which elements are rare and which are common in the interstellar gas/dust clouds out of which solar systems form.

[Kryten]

This is a serious question because I don't know. How would you be able to tell what elements are rare and which ones are not if we only have observed a fraction of a fraction of the universe? An element that may seem rare on one planet could be very abundant on another right? Unless, there is a specific reason that Mercury is a rare element? Maybe something to do with it's chemical composition?

It's to do with how elements are ultimately produced; lighter elements (up to iron) are formed by fusion inside stars, but anything above that is formed by less common exothermic processes, and the heavier the element the less of it ends up produced by those processes (very roughly).

[Brabbit1987]

Ok I see. Thanks Brotoro and Kryten.

Now that I think about that, it makes perfect sense. I did do a little look up on google as well. The actual chemical composition itself isn't rare. So would that mean a civilization possibly greater then ours could unnaturally make Mercury and put it on a planet? lol Seems unpractical and I would have no idea why anyone would want to do that, but is it possible?

[Brotoro]

Ok I see. Thanks Brotoro and Kryten.

Now that I think about that, it makes perfect sense. I did do a little look up on google as well. The actual chemical composition itself isn't rare. So would that mean a civilization possibly greater then ours could unnaturally make Mercury and put it on a planet? lol Seems unpractical and I would have no idea why anyone would want to do that, but is it possible?

Sure, if you have aliens with advanced technology (such as matter conversion on a large scale) who can build planets, they could easily put whatever they want on a planet (as long as conditions on the surface allowed the stuff to remain there and not boil away or something).

I'm not saying it's Magratheans...but it's Magratheans.

[Brabbit1987]

Sure, if you have aliens with advanced technology (such as matter conversion on a large scale) who can build planets, they could easily put whatever they want on a planet (as long as conditions on the surface allowed the stuff to remain there and not boil away or something).

I'm not saying it's Magratheans...but it's Magratheans.

lol I see. Good to know.

[robocop]

That's a good point. Using that logic the surface could contain a high concentration of Lepidolite (a purple mineral) This being said, it could mix with the sulfur oceans to create a purple color.

[stupid_chris]

According to the devs, IIRC, it's made out of mostly the prime components of the game's rocket fuel and high concentrations of blutonium. Maybe it'S the blutonium that's purple?

[Nuke]

except uranium makes things yellow.

[Holo]

That's a good point. Using that logic the surface could contain a high concentration of Lepidolite (a purple mineral) This being said, it could mix with the sulfur oceans to create a purple color.

This is my canon now. Liquid sulphur with lepidolite dust suspended in it.

[th3shameless]

This is my canon now. Liquid sulphur with lepidolite dust suspended in it.

that makes sense, after a little research iodine and sulpher did seem like likely ones, galium at that pressure would be liquid as well, same as mercury. who knows, the kerbal system could be in a mercury-rich area of the galaxy haha. mercury would explain the color of the oceans compared to the rest of the planet

[robocop]

that makes sense, after a little research iodine and sulpher did seem like likely ones, galium at that pressure would be liquid as well, same as mercury. who knows, the kerbal system could be in a mercury-rich area of the galaxy haha. mercury would explain the color of the oceans compared to the rest of the planet

But is Mercury deadly to a Kerbal?

[th3shameless]

yes! the emperor of kerbin in 990 was believed to have drunk mercury thinking it has mythical powers. unfortunately, he died

[jfx]

Twenty posts in and no one has even mentioned how pressure affects the boiling point of a substance.

I am disappoint.

Water as example - note the anomaly:

Edit:

Googling for above image I had to see some english speaking people use Fahrenheit in phase diagrams.

They deserve an auto-da-fé.

Edited June 29, 2013 by jfx

[th3shameless]

Twenty posts in and no one has even mentioned how pressure affects the boiling point of a substance.

I am disappoint.

Edit:

Googling for above image I had to see some english speaking people use Fahrenheit in phase diagrams.

They deserve an auto-da-fé.

there was talk about this on the first page, i brought it up and someone else did too about mercury and galium. thats the only way they could stay liquid at such high tempertures due to eve's high pressure.