Docking has killed my Kerbal fun

[Skorpychan]

Good Luck!

Thanks.

I'm 3.6km away from the target, going at about the same speed. <1 m/s on Target. How do I get closer? Do I need to be going faster or slower in the orbit?

This is the closest I've ever intentionally got to another spacecraft.

[Guest]

ae35unit, if you were really bad at, say, skydiving or sword swallowing, I would agree with your decision to quit trying. But not with docking. You'll get the hang of it. It's not easy at first. Rest assured that it is something you can master and it will become second nature to you. Take a break and come back to it when you're not feeling so frustrated.

[dharak1]

Thanks.

How do I get closer? Do I need to be going faster or slower in the orbit?

This is the closest I've ever intentionally got to another spacecraft.

If you set the nav ball to target node burn on the pink marker that's almost a circle.

Then speed up to around 10 m/s until 700m then slow to 2.5m/s the speed is your relative to the target so as long as its prograde then you are fine. When you are within 20m slow to 0m/s and switch to docking mode and start docking!

[Anton P. Nym]

Thanks.

I'm 3.6km away from the target, going at about the same speed. <1 m/s on Target. How do I get closer? Do I need to be going faster or slower in the orbit?

This is the closest I've ever intentionally got to another spacecraft.

Simplest route is to point at the target, thrust towards it (fairly quickly, somewhere between 15-30m/s depending upon your fuel budget) and flip over until pointing retrograde to the TARGET velocity vector on the Navball. Sometime between 100-200s later, when you're as close to the target as the maneuver will take you, thrust until your velocity relative to the target is about 0m/s. If you're within about 100m, then switch to RCS and move in to dock; if you're further away, try a slower burn (no more than 1/100th the distance, so if you end up 1km away don't burn faster than 10m/s) and flip, then brake to a relative stop when close.

It's not the most fuel-efficient, but it's the most straightforward way to execute a rendezvous. It'd be more fuel-efficient to execute another mini-Hohmann transfer, but I find those immensely hard to get right and I tend to spend more fuel fixing my foul-ups than I'd spend doing a direct approach.

-- Steve

[Superfluous J]

I love this forum. OP insults both young people who play the game (You're 13 so have nothing better to do, you lout) and older people (You're old and STILL have nothing better to do, you schlub) and gives absolutely no information on the problem (Just "I can't do it!") and what are the next 6 pages full of? Anger? Resentment? NO.

We've got 6 solid pages of attempts to help, cries for more information, and ... well all right a little ire and anger but come on, he insulted all of us, it's to be expected

Cheers, KSP community. You guys rock.

[Pixel of Life]

The ideal approach to a rendezvous and/or a docking is to place a maneuver node and raise/lower the node's apoapsis/periapsis to your target's orbit and play around with the node until you get a good closest approach (<10km) exactly at the new apoapsis/periapsis. Follow the node, then circularize at your new AP/PE and you should end up on the same orbit as your target and with nearly zero relative velocity. Your distance to your target will depend on how well you planned your maneuver. After this it's just a matter of thrusting towards your target, getting close enough, flipping around and thrusting the other way until your relative velocity is 0. Activate RCS and go in for the docking.

It really isn't that difficult. I don't understand why some people cry about not being able to dock right away - it's rocket science, for god's sake! You can't expect to master it on the first try, especially if you have no basic understanding of orbital mechanics A couple hours of practice a day for a few days and it becomes second nature. We've all had to go through it.

[boxman]

I love this game and have logged a couple hundred delightful hours exploring it so far.

I suck at docking though. It takes me hours, generally ends in failure and, being something I need to do in order to accomplish the rest of the stuff I'd like to do in the game, has absolutely destroyed the fun of the game for me.

There's Mechjeb and ORDA, but they take forever and seem to fail ten times for every success. I'm not 13, I have a life to live outside of the game and can't spend tens of hours failing to dock two ships.

It truly saddens me to say that I'll have to hang up KSP now because of this one shortcoming. I absolutely love every other aspect of the game.

I know some do just fine with it (yes, I've watched Scott Manley dock sooo many times on YouTube), but not me for some reason. I'd really like the ability to select two ports and hit "dock" when I'm within 100m.

Lacking that, I'm afraid I'm done.

That is just the reality of docking both in real life and in the game. It takes for most people hours and hours of practice and even in real life they failed the first attempts to rendezvous/dock.

Dumbing this aspect down would turn it into arcade, which would ruin the game completely for us who actually like having a game that is somewhat realistic.

Why not take a break and give it a try it again later?

[Skorpychan]

Simplest route is to point at the target, thrust towards it (fairly quickly, somewhere between 15-30m/s depending upon your fuel budget) and flip over until pointing retrograde to the TARGET velocity vector on the Navball. Sometime between 100-200s later, when you're as close to the target as the maneuver will take you, thrust until your velocity relative to the target is about 0m/s. If you're within about 100m, then switch to RCS and move in to dock; if you're further away, try a slower burn (no more than 1/100th the distance, so if you end up 1km away don't burn faster than 10m/s) and flip, then brake to a relative stop when close.

It's not the most fuel-efficient, but it's the most straightforward way to execute a rendezvous. It'd be more fuel-efficient to execute another mini-Hohmann transfer, but I find those immensely hard to get right and I tend to spend more fuel fixing my foul-ups than I'd spend doing a direct approach.

-- Steve

To hell with Hohmann, this is KSP. Brute force involves less mental calculations.

That is just the reality of docking both in real life and in the game. It takes for most people hours and hours of practice and even in real life they failed the first attempts to rendezvous/dock.

Dumbing this aspect down would turn it into arcade, which would ruin the game completely for us who actually like having a game that is somewhat realistic.

Why not take a break and give it a try it again later?

I've been doing that for weeks. I AM GOING TO LEARN HOW TO DO THIS DAMMIT.

[SuperWeegee4000]

I love this game and have logged a couple hundred delightful hours exploring it so far.

I suck at docking though. It takes me hours, generally ends in failure and, being something I need to do in order to accomplish the rest of the stuff I'd like to do in the game, has absolutely destroyed the fun of the game for me.

There's Mechjeb and ORDA, but they take forever and seem to fail ten times for every success. I'm not 13, I have a life to live outside of the game and can't spend tens of hours failing to dock two ships.

It truly saddens me to say that I'll have to hang up KSP now because of this one shortcoming. I absolutely love every other aspect of the game.

I know some do just fine with it (yes, I've watched Scott Manley dock sooo many times on YouTube), but not me for some reason. I'd really like the ability to select two ports and hit "dock" when I'm within 100m.

Lacking that, I'm afraid I'm done.

May I say something?

I'm thirteen, dude.

Your honor, the OP is being mean. ;n;

[Eric S]

Not going to help an actual rocket, mind. Shifting center of gravity and such.

Actually, it still does, at least for the payload section. I've picked up tricks for minimizing the shift so that my RCS works fairly well no matter how much fuel and monoprop I've used. I used that addon to fine tune my technique on both the orbiter and lander for an apollo style Mun mission, and docking was cake.

Also, the addon now adds a second (red) CoM indicator to show your dry-mass CoM, so you can tell where it's going to shift to.

[SuperWeegee4000]

I am so sick of people complaining about what OP said.

Tell me, do 13 year olds work 8+ hours a day and have to worry about things like a family and paying for themselves?

No, because they're 13. Like it or not, you have more time on your hands than an adult.

Which has what to do with me not having a life outside of video games?

Let's just not even start any flamewars. Just... let's... sigh.

[sal_vager]

Which has what to do with me not having a life outside of video games?

Let's just not even start any flamewars. Just... let's... sigh.

And you (Mercy) were doing so well, you've reverted to being upset all the time, you need to stop worrying about how others play a game.

[Anton P. Nym]

For datum, I'm in my 40s working 40+ hour weeks and I somehow have time to learn how to rendezvous and dock. Admittedly I'm not a parent, so some potential demands on my time aren't there, but I've chatted with a few parents who also have found time in their busy days to do so too.

As I said earlier in response to the OP: [NoFix] PEBKAC (Problem Exists Between Keyboard And Chair).

-- Steve

[sal_vager]

The biggest mistake I find with docking is that it takes a lot more patience than you first expect, it's almost as if you are playing chess when docking, making a move (thrusting) and seeing how your craft responds to it each time.

[Rufus Callahan]

you know it's a good game when people of all ages can enjoy it and become a community... I'm one of the old people (33) but am completely obsessed with it

[SuperWeegee4000]

And you (Mercy) were doing so well, you've reverted to being upset all the time, you need to stop worrying about how others play a game.

Huh?

I don't understand.

[magnemoe]

Simplest route is to point at the target, thrust towards it (fairly quickly, somewhere between 15-30m/s depending upon your fuel budget) and flip over until pointing retrograde to the TARGET velocity vector on the Navball. Sometime between 100-200s later, when you're as close to the target as the maneuver will take you, thrust until your velocity relative to the target is about 0m/s. If you're within about 100m, then switch to RCS and move in to dock; if you're further away, try a slower burn (no more than 1/100th the distance, so if you end up 1km away don't burn faster than 10m/s) and flip, then brake to a relative stop when close.

It's not the most fuel-efficient, but it's the most straightforward way to execute a rendezvous. It'd be more fuel-efficient to execute another mini-Hohmann transfer, but I find those immensely hard to get right and I tend to spend more fuel fixing my foul-ups than I'd spend doing a direct approach.

-- Steve

Yes, first kill speed, burn towards the braking node until speed is 0-0.1 m/s, then burn towards target. Speed dependent on how much hurry you are in and dV budget, I tend to do 100 seconds jumps so 500 meter is 5 m/s and two kilometers is 20 m/s. now for an 3 km intercept you are likely to miss the target with 100-200 meters, Then the braking and target direction node get to far apart, burn towards the braking node until you stop and do an new burn towards target. Stop at an suitable distance 10-50 meters depending on ship sizes.

[Rainbow-Dashie]

I have yet to dock anything... I've tried a few times... but to no avail... Though I did get to within 14 kilometers of my target, and i think i might have been able to dock with it if my ship didn't run out of fuel. I had to watch a few videos to learn how, and i think I understand the concept of how you would dock, I just need to work on actually carrying the mission out.

As with anything it takes the right teacher, tools, and a bit of practice.

[Uncledad]

Hi,

I've been trying to learn how to dock properly now for a good while and it's gotten me thoroughly frustrated. I've watched a bunch of videos and read tutorials on how it should be done, I've balanced my craft weights, quick save to practice the approach and i think I'm getting there after a series of successful attempts.

However, one dock has alluded me so far...

I get the approach aligned well and slowly slowly catchy monkey... but nothing. the ports just sit there... staring at each other. I've done this by eye, instrumental, with the laser cam docking thing... i even let mechjeb have ago... nothing.

I'm wondering if there's something missing about the big docking ports or weather it is actually a problem with the game.

[sal_vager]

The ports must be the right way around and both of the same size, also if they are sunk into another part or blocked in any way they will fail to attach.

Other than that the approach angle and speed need to be within tolerances, too fast and you won't dock, then you need to back off to allow the ports to reset.

When you are close you should experience the magnetic attraction of the ports, if there is no attraction then there is something wrong.

Docking is something you can take time doing (and should take time doing, rushing results in docking rage), for me I find landing on the runway much harder as there is much less time to think and plan.

[Anton P. Nym]

Docking is something you can take time doing (and should take time doing, rushing results in docking rage), for me I find landing on the runway much harder as there is much less time to think and plan.

Also, there's no runway magnetism. (I have put plenty of craft down on the grass along side it after having blown an approach with not enough fuel left for a go-around.)

-- Steve

[Uncledad]

They're defiantly the same size and placed correctly. I used the 3 way symmetry to place 3 of them down on the same piece so they should all be identical. I managed to get the other 2 ports to dock relativity easy.

Here is a pic, From the nav-ball you can see every thing is aligned, or have just moved past alignment and the ports are basically touching.

Edited August 17, 2013 by sal_vager
Fixed pic :)

[boxman]

Hi,

I've been trying to learn how to dock properly now for a good while and it's gotten me thoroughly frustrated. I've watched a bunch of videos and read tutorials on how it should be done, I've balanced my craft weights, quick save to practice the approach and i think I'm getting there after a series of successful attempts.

However, one dock has alluded me so far...

I get the approach aligned well and slowly slowly catchy monkey... but nothing. the ports just sit there... staring at each other. I've done this by eye, instrumental, with the laser cam docking thing... i even let mechjeb have ago... nothing.

I'm wondering if there's something missing about the big docking ports or weather it is actually a problem with the game.

Do you notice any magnetic pull from the target docking port at all when you get them close to each other?? Might be some kind of bug unknown bug you are experiencing if nothing happens at all when you get close.

[TomcatMVD]

Contains racial slurs. There's prolly better material out there.

Definitely, I wouldn't go by that "tutorial" at all. Anyway, like people said, I'd give the Lazor Docking Cam a try, it really helps a lot. I learned docking before installing it and now I just feel like I'm cheating.

[Uncledad]

Do you notice any magnetic pull from the target docking port at all when you get them close to each other?? Might be some kind of bug unknown bug you are experiencing if nothing happens at all when you get close.

None, I'm defiantly inside the range for the pull... even if it was to just throw me off.