Poll, Do/Should Kerbal Genders exist?

[dlrk]

I really don't care, and I doubt most others do either. Some people like to be offended, and chose this as their issue, for whatever insane reason/

[lajoswinkler]

Sex is male or female, based merely on genitalia.

Gender is based on the individual's orientation and we know that with the idea of becoming special and unique snowflakes, a lot of people get crazy with gender definition (and today we have a huge variety of genders). I don't want to put my opinion on this gender topic here because the ****storm would be too great considering fellow posters' opinions.

Well, if we consider genitalia only, things aren't that simple. There are various abberations. Sometimes there are both sets of genitalia, sometimes there aren't any, sometimes one set is visible and another is embedded in the body cavity...

Even with chromosomes there are surprises, more than people think, because the resulting phenotype is usually not special at all.

The only way to correctly determine someone's sex is to look for one gene that's, for most males, on Y chromosome. One gene is responsible for kickstarting the phenotype to turn male during embryonic development.

Gender has to do with brain morphology and it's even more complicated than sex, but in almost all cases follows sex closely. Nature is a wild thing indeed.

I really don't care, and I doubt most others do either. Some people like to be offended, and chose this as their issue, for whatever insane reason/

Yeah, the poll clearly shows most people don't care. /sarcasm

[OtherDalfite]

I really don't care, and I doubt most others do either. Some people like to be offended, and chose this as their issue, for whatever insane reason/

Yeah, for some reason one side always seems to be offended by nothing.

On the topic of Kerbal sexes, I am fine with having a male/female side, but for gods sakes don't go making them super kawaii supermodels with thighs that could crush a bus. Space suits aren't meant to be slimming, and sex flight isn't made to be sexy.

[Sapphire]

Yeah, for some reason one side always seems to be offended by nothing.

On the topic of Kerbal sexes, I am fine with having a male/female side, but for gods sakes don't go making them super kawaii supermodels with thighs that could crush a bus. Space suits aren't meant to be slimming, and sex flight isn't made to be sexy.

Sex is male or female, based merely on genitalia.

Gender is based on the individual's orientation and we know that with the idea of becoming special and unique snowflakes, a lot of people get crazy with gender definition (and today we have a huge variety of genders). I don't want to put my opinion on this gender topic here because the ****storm would be too great considering fellow posters' opinions.

Gender has nothing to do with sexual orientation. Is bisexuality or asexuality a gender?

[OtherDalfite]

-snip-

These are absolutely perfect. I know the first is a Fan-Drawing, but what of the second? I really hope they come out to look like that.

Edited September 27, 2013 by OtherDalfite
Mixed up images

[PDCWolf]

Gender has nothing to do with sexual orientation. Is bisexuality or asexuality a gender?

Gender identity is what I'm against and what I've been talking about.

Bisexuality or asexuality can either be referring to a medical condition or sexual orientations, neither of them are genders.

If we keep this argument up we'll end up stepping on feminism and other heresies of even bigger level.

[luchelibre]

Man, I wish I could be a fly on the wall watching and listening to Harvester as he reads this thread.

[Alguien]

Yeah, the poll clearly shows most people don't care. /sarcasm

i dont see how the poll shows most people care either, one may prefer female/male and another may prefer monogender, that doesnt mean they actually care if is implemented or not

These are absolutely perfect. I know the first is a Fan-Drawing, but what of the second? I really hope they come out to look like that.

as far as i know, the team seems to go with that idea of Kergals or girlbals, or what ever you want to call them

[lajoswinkler]

People who don't care usually don't even read the stuff. I don't care about lot of stuff on this forum. If I cared, I'd be more engaged in the discussions. So far 245 folks have expressed their care by voting. That has to mean something.

[NoMrBond]

Easiest way to diffuse situation; add equal number of perceived 'feminine' particles to the name generator.

Name generating system simply takes care of the rest as players would get a equal number of Brenda's and Sally-Jean's as they do Scott's and Billy-Bob's without any immediate need to differentiate the models, while not discounting the possibility of differentiating them later.

[OtherDalfite]

Easiest way to diffuse situation; add equal number of perceived 'feminine' particles to the name generator.

Name generating system simply takes care of the rest as players would get a equal number of Brenda's and Sally-Jean's as they do Scott's and Billy-Bob's without any immediate need to differentiate the models, while not discounting the possibility of differentiating them later.

I think this would be a great alternative as well, then the devs wouldn't even have to work on implementing Kerbal female models, if they decide to do so.

[Tw1]

I think this would be a great alternative as well, then the devs wouldn't even have to work on implementing Kerbal female models, if they decide to do so.

As I said earlier in the thread, I'd find that a cop out of a solution. I have a Milly Kerman. Her name sounds like a girl's one, but she looks the same as all the guys.

As a human, looking at a human like species, it's a little jarring.

Implementing female Kerbals (not just male ones with longer hair-and whatever) would be a worthy use of time by one of the developers who is that way skilled, IMHO, but doesn't need to get in the way of things like resources. We can wait.

Edited September 27, 2013 by Tw1

[suzin.felipe]

I think this would be a great alternative as well, then the devs wouldn't even have to work on implementing Kerbal female models, if they decide to do so.

No half arsed solutions please. This is not a riot or an angry mob, these are people requesting for a feature that is indispensable.

Devs can take their time as long as they do it right. It's a bit sad that female models were not there from the beginning, but now that the mistake was made, they better fix it properly than a poor fix.

[PolecatEZ]

Its a pressing question, as I'm trying to figure out a way to Kerbalize my high school biology classes. I'm currently going over the new state standards with the university faculty to see which concepts we can work into the game. The main goal will be genetics concepts, and for that sex-linked traits and such would be an important part. I've discussed with chemistry teachers also on ways to Kerbalize their chemistry classes, as well as physics teachers on ways to better put basic physics concepts in the game so they're more transparent to the student.

After we Kerbalize science...English and literature will be next! For this though, we don't need female Kerbals, as classically all roles in Shakespearean plays were played by men.

[NoMrBond]

Kerbals have been anthropomorphised as male because the in-game names applied or generated are overwhelmingly, if not exclusively masculine, so the existing Kerbal model has come to be 'male' with the implied association.

If the names had been an even mix of masculine and feminine since the beginning this may not have been the case.

The model themselves are intended to be genderless as are all Kerbals, this intent is damaged by the present masculine identification of those models for which there is a solution which can be implemented without needing to apply human dimorphism

[OtherDalfite]

Kerbals have been anthropomorphised as male because the in-game names applied or generated are overwhelmingly, if not exclusively masculine, so the existing Kerbal model has come to be 'male' with the implied association.

If the names had been an even mix of masculine and feminine since the beginning this may not have been the case.

The model themselves are intended to be genderless as are all Kerbals, this intent is damaged by the present masculine identification of those models for which there is a solution which can be implemented without needing to apply human dimorphism

This is kind of what I was trying to get across with my statement of simply adding more names, rather than a whole new model. Kerbals are not meant to represent male or female, but people for some reason have deducted they are male, even though we know nothing of their biology.

[suzin.felipe]

Kerbals have been anthropomorphised as male because the in-game names applied or generated are overwhelmingly, if not exclusively masculine, so the existing Kerbal model has come to be 'male' with the implied association.

If the names had been an even mix of masculine and feminine since the beginning this may not have been the case.

The model themselves are intended to be genderless as are all Kerbals, this intent is damaged by the present masculine identification of those models for which there is a solution which can be implemented without needing to apply human dimorphism

Sorry, if you go back to all the posts from females in this tread you will see that they clearly identify the models as males and are asking for a female model. Changing names won't cut it.

Unless of course you want to alienate a big part of the player base.

[NoMrBond]

Adding to the existing simple text list for names is a specific suggestion that's immediately actionable at a low opportunity cost, while adding models, animations and textures have higher costs and are therefore more likely to be displaced or delayed by other development targets.

Why delay the immediate low-cost fix which is available because the related high-cost ideal fix isn't also ready? It's like being on fire and refusing to be put out until you reach the hospital.

Names are part of the problem which can be addressed immediately and cheaply while other materials are readied.

[_Aramchek_]

Sorry, if you go back to all the posts from females in this tread you will see that they clearly identify the models as males and are asking for a female model. Changing names won't cut it.

Unless of course you want to alienate a big part of the player base.

Why should things change to suit "female gamers" just because?

There is no good reason, and "equality" is not a valid reason in this issue It's an excuse used to try and get what you want.

[OtherDalfite]

Why should things change to suit "female gamers" just because?

There is no good reason, and "equality" is not a valid reason in this issue It's an excuse used to try and get what you want.

I can totally agree with this. In a game where you fly rockets, land them, and dock them all together, you rarely spend time just watching the Kerbals sit in their capsules, and you hardly see their faces when you go on EVA. Maybe girl kerbals can be added later, but right now, while KSP is in ALPHA of all things, it's ridiculous to demand something as silly and insignificant as female body types or facial structures.

[NoMrBond]

It's not appropriate to say an issue doesn't exist, or isn't important, just because you're not being impacted.

I haven't seen anyone demanding an Amazon style all female universe, just disappointment that the avatars people are empathising with, and vicariously experiencing the game through, are not accommodating everyone.

[regex]

I haven't seen anyone demanding an Amazon style all female universe, just disappointment that the avatars people are empathising with, and vicariously experiencing the game through, are not accommodating everyone.

^this.

In fact, the general consensus among those who want to see female Kerbals seems to be that we should eventually see female Kerbals. No one is "demanding" anything.

[Hayoo]

Why should things change to suit "female gamers" just because?

There is no good reason, and "equality" is not a valid reason in this issue It's an excuse used to try and get what you want.

Things have already changed, it just happens to look male. Are you ok with Wernher von Kerman, Gene Kerman, Neil Kerman, and Bobak Kerman being added? If so, why? If not, would you have them removed?

[suzin.felipe]

Why should things change to suit "female gamers" just because?

There is no good reason, and "equality" is not a valid reason in this issue It's an excuse used to try and get what you want.

Mainly because I don't want KSP to end up in one of these lists:

http://www.cracked.com/blog/6-sexist-video-game-problems-even-bigger-than-breasts/

That website is read by millions of people, future customers.

You can also read the comment below as well, and if you can't see the problem still, you should really pay more attention on what women are saying in this tread.

[_Aramchek_]

Mainly because I don't want KSP to end up in one of these lists:

I doubt that's why, I'm betting you want it simply because it's a personal preference, and you'll use whatever excuse you can to try and support your argument.

By the way that article is heavily flawed in a few key areas, check the comments out for some really good reasons as to why.

Besides, not a single one of the things on that list, or the other one they made a few months back can reasonably be applied to KSP.

It's not a good supporting argument for your stance.

And to be honest I think we'd all be better off if the pretense about equality was simply dropped and you just admitted you want it simply because you want it.

There is absolutely no representation of sexuality or gender in KSP, and there doesn't need to be. And in my opinion that should be left out of the game.

And the white knighting going on is sexism too, "positive" discrimination is still discrimination.