[PLUGIN+PARTS][0.23] SCANsat terrain mapping

[Thourion]

*Reads changelog... shakes head left and right rapidly ... looks again ....*

Im starting to think that when you use the word "Build" you have some huge-gargantuan-ancient-miracle of the world kind of "to-build" in mind. And i mean really, beyond the fact that the changes look impressive, i dont think i have ever seen a mod to include a selfdestruct function for an obsolete part before ..

Speechless ...

[KhaosCorp]

Very nice work!

I have only one criticism: The little x symbol's asymmetry annoys me a bit. I don't suppose you could change it to a regular x (or maybe a + or • or even a º)?

I kinda like the little sloppy X..makes it look kinda hand drawn..very kerbal. Of course Im a bit odd....i like the way struts n stuff like that look too lol..

[brienne]

damny, what a work...

Thanks

[Dweller_Benthos]

This is pretty cool, got a full map of Kerbin fairly fast, probably because my orbit wasn't that great, and haven't tried multiple satellites yet. Did get some frame rate drop when I had the BTDT part on a plane with the small map open, but I'm not sure it was because of SCANsat.

A few things I would like to see is the anomalies and other markers on the small map and the zoomed in pop up window available from the small map as well, so I don't have to keep opening the big map to see that info.

Very well done, many thanks for this.

[DMagic]

Everything looks good so far. Performance is much better, with both the grid and orbit overlays on my FPS drops just a little bit, from 60 to about 55, but it stays at 60 with either on alone, and CPU usage doesn't change much with them on.

All the other changes work fine, except that I couldn't figure out how to resize the big map. I was using a touchscreen though, so I didn't try too hard to figure it out.

What's the little symbol and number in the bottom right of the big map?

I like the little "X" markers too, they do look a little funny, but I think that's ok.

I also think a zoom window on the little map would be nice.

Edited November 2, 2013 by DMagic

[damny]

What's the little symbol and number in the bottom right of the big map?

The little symbol would be the resize widget. The number is somewhat related to the frame rate (i.e. it goes down when I do stuff but I haven't actually checked how accurate it is).

I like the little "X" markers too, they do look a little funny, but I think that's ok.

It's the unicode "cross mark" character (✗).

What does everybody think about these other options:

• cross mark (×)
  
• the character x
  
• the character X
  
• nabla symbol (∇)
  
• sun (☉)
  
• star (★)
  
• the asterisk (*)
  

Btw. I'm not sure which ✗ is the offending one, the close widget of the zoom box, or the map marker for anomalies?

[drtedastro]

Just a thought, would it be possible to have the character options be set in a .cfg file.?? That way anyone could choose whatever they liked. Might make it easier for modder and player.?.? Mod dev can show which ones are supported, in a list, and player could choose his own poison.....??? Again, just a thought.

[Thourion]

So far, perfomance wise is good for me as well. The X marker is fine with me also, but if i had to choose from the above for anomalies, i would get the nabla one probably.

Things from the back of my head, after playing this build, is a toggle for the flags ( i do like that they are here, but if you got many on the body it gets a bit crowded ).

The icon mode for the small map is a cool feat of course, but the problem lies when you want to have the map open at the bottom of the screen. After closing it the icon gets in the way, and if you try to move the icon it opens the map again, well its a minor issue but yeah.

And finnaly i would like the removal of the auto-render of the big map when you stop resizing it, reduces the jiggle-lag time if you just want to temp narrow it a bit for example.

So yeah basically minor things.

One feat for later builds could be a Marker addition from the big map for custom points with a small note.

Edited November 2, 2013 by Thourion

[TelluriumCrystal]

I think that the nabla symbol would work out nicely. The sun character would be good as well.

I was just bugged by the ones marking the positions of anomalies, its fine as a button.

[OrtwinS]

Explosive charges for redundant parts? I think you just set a new standard for backward-compatibility-care there .

Before extensive testing will commence, I need to launch more ships with slope-scanners .

The maneuver node + predicted orbit showing up is a true game-changer. Setting up the perfect orbit will no longer be the terrain of the math-o-philes (though I actually count myself as one).

The 'weird' X's annoyed me too at first, but I came to appreciate them later. IF there will be a change, I vote for the sun symbol if the space between circle and dot remains transparent. Otherwise I vote for the 'tidy' cross mark.

The zoom window close button cross mark might be better of as a clean cross mark in any case.

This last update ticks off a lot of points from my list .

(yes, I keep an actual list of 'stuff suggested by people' to prevent myself from duplicating stuff)

[khaine]

- Existing slope sensors have become broken, and a small explosive charge has

been activated remotely for your convenience. You can trigger it via the

right-click menu to get rid of the part on existing vessels.

this mod single handedly revived my inspiration for KSP.

I have been waiting for a map making mod forever, and the mod you are making is brilliant.

And a feature like self destruct for obsolete parts?

Yeah that takes it to a whole nother level

you are my hero good sir

now its time for science!!

[Geschosskopf]

First off, I want to say I LOVE THIS MOD. Just tried out the previous build and came here to say how good it is when I saw a new version just out today. Haven't tried that yet.

Feedback: Please beat Majiir over the head until he makes his Kethane scanners work like your map scanners, as in having multiple probes going at once at multiple planets and you don't have to be watching the paint dry on any of them. Fire-and-forget shotgun mapping. BRILLIANT! This removes the severe annoyance otherwise inescapable with such narrow-beam scanning (compared to ISA). Problem is, I can't take advantage of these wonderful features of your mod because the Kethane scanner doesn't work like this .

[OrtwinS]

My first sat died of energy-drain

I didn't notice the solar panels were folded up, and while I was happily experimenting with the new b3 features the battery drained. (all sensors except BTDT and Traq, with no significant battery capacity to speak of ).

I noticed there are no real consequences of losing power, maybe reduce UI functionality? Like this the maptraq doesn't actually need power to do the exact same of what it always does (show the map). Or maybe hide the markers? No power=no idea where you are.

A note about the slope map: Does the colour legend of the slope map change when zooming in? If you zoom in on the mountains west of KSC (steep red slopes), the zoom window doesn't show any red slopes any more.

The more you zoom in, the more the map seems to think: "nah, these slopes aren't worth mentioning, lets make it all green-yellow-ish." It kinda reduces the slope map functionality if one can't look at a certain region in detail to study the extremity of height differences.

PS: the window re-size thing is great! I make it about half the size of my screen, and then fiddle around with maneuver nodes while watching the predicted ground track change on the fly.

PPS: damny, you once mentioned you thought about adding realistic GPS requirements for position tracking. Maybe you can 'hook up' with Figaro to add that.

Edited November 2, 2013 by OrtwinS

[KhaosCorp]

PPS: damny, you once mentioned you thought about adding realistic GPS requirements for position tracking. Maybe you can 'hook up' with Figaro to add that.

YES!! I second this idea (or making something close).

Figaro is an awesome very fun mod. I honestly havent used it in 0.22 because of memory constraints in general (though its a very lightweight mod) but I do rather miss it.

Fun FIGARO Challenge: get a gps networks thats accurate down to 2meters 100% of the time on kerbin....its really ALOT harder than it sounds.

[Savage117]

I can honestly say I like this mod a lot more than ISA Mapsat, its simpler, it does several things ISA does not (non-active and multiple scanning being primary), and its very well polished for a WIP. Although ISA does have some pros compared to this, this is more of what I was looking for in a mapping plug-in. So far the only bug I have found, not really a bug more like a missing feature, the big map does not always refresh or render completely and I have to switch between global view and flat view to get it to refresh. A refresh or re-render button would be appreciated for the big map. Also I agree with making the delete map button harder to hit by accident. Only thing I really want to see are better looking parts, im tempted to just use existing models for it but im pretty sure you will get to that eventualy and ill be patient and wait. Great mod, try not to burn yourself out in its making, and don't take any crap from those people who don't seem to understand this is your creation and you are providing it for free. Speaking of free I beleive it was mentioned but you should allow donations, if I had money right now id give you some just to help out.

On a side note, did anyone else catch the easter egg/anomaly in the middle of the ocean south of the KSC, it can only be seen with this mapping plug-in, never knew that was there. I'm assuming its underwater, makes me want to get Hooligan Labs Submarines just to explore it.

[KhaosCorp]

It can be seen other than with mapping mods...like driving an experimental rover/submersible into the canyon that is the mouth!

Also there was some screens of that posted in the ISA thread sometime during v0.19..somewhere else too.

CRAZY FEATURE REQUEST!

I dont know how hard it would be...maybe better for another mod, but it kinda seems to go along with mapping and general sensor based exploration in general...but...

An sstv reciever would be awesome! Especialy since decoding software is free and easy to get, I know that Duna gives off a decodable sstv signal, and I suspect there is at least one more, maybe 2....but its kinda a pain to isolate the signal well enough, then its kinda a chore to record it so it can be fed through the decoder....

I know...probably should be different mod..just figured Id throw it out there.

[DMagic]

So far the only bug I have found, not really a bug more like a missing feature, the big map does not always refresh or render completely and I have to switch between global view and flat view to get it to refresh. A refresh or re-render button would be appreciated for the big map.

You can refresh the big map by clicking on the map-type button again. So if you are looking at an altitude map on a rectangular projection just push the altitude button again and it will refresh, at least that's how it should work. Also, I think you can see that smiley face on ISA maps, too, it's just not quite as clear.

[Geschosskopf]

On a side note, did anyone else catch the easter egg/anomaly in the middle of the ocean south of the KSC, it can only be seen with this mapping plug-in, never knew that was there. I'm assuming its underwater, makes me want to get Hooligan Labs Submarines just to explore it.

Yeah, I even took a pic of it. A sailing ship carved in the sea bed? An upside down jellyfish?

Anyway, I have now given b3 a good workout at Mun and Minmus. Definitely the best way to go is to be as low as you can go if you want to minimized game time, although this forces your realtime consumed to increase. Still, it's handy that the mapping and Kethane both scan about the same width on the ground per pass so it's easier to put both on the same probe. I just wish both of them scanned wider so I could fly higher and warp faster .

This mod is working fine for me, although I wish the "Forget Map" had an "Are You Sure?" warning because I tend to drink a bit when I play and sometimes hit that button instead of "Big Map" (which I think is the best possible name for it).

I'm very tempted to launch a whole fleet of probes with this and build several long-term manned missions around the data, but I suppose a major change will come along while all my stuff is en route so I guess I'd better wait. Don't want to just haul more parts that turn into bombs, although that was amusing one time .

[Savage117]

You can refresh the big map by clicking on the map-type button again. So if you are looking at an altitude map on a rectangular projection just push the altitude button again and it will refresh, at least that's how it should work. Also, I think you can see that smiley face on ISA maps, too, it's just not quite as clear.

Looking at my mapsat maps and your right its there but its so faint I never noticed it. It really pops out on this mapper. I tried all the buttons and it doesn't refresh unless I go from one mode to another, pressing the button im currently on does nothing. Possibly a mod conflict somewhere? Its not a big deal, was the only thing I could nit pick about since this program works so well. Damn you Damny for your excellent bug squashing skills!

Yeah, I even took a pic of it. A sailing ship carved in the sea bed? An upside down jellyfish?

Anyway, I have now given b3 a good workout at Mun and Minmus. Definitely the best way to go is to be as low as you can go if you want to minimized game time, although this forces your realtime consumed to increase. Still, it's handy that the mapping and Kethane both scan about the same width on the ground per pass so it's easier to put both on the same probe. I just wish both of them scanned wider so I could fly higher and warp faster .

This mod is working fine for me, although I wish the "Forget Map" had an "Are You Sure?" warning because I tend to drink a bit when I play and sometimes hit that button instead of "Big Map" (which I think is the best possible name for it).

I'm very tempted to launch a whole fleet of probes with this and build several long-term manned missions around the data, but I suppose a major change will come along while all my stuff is en route so I guess I'd better wait. Don't want to just haul more parts that turn into bombs, although that was amusing one time .

Geschosskopf, actually a higher orbit is shorter, yes it takes longer to get around the globe, but it covers more ground because the world is turning below it, plus you can warp faster. What does ingame time matter anyway? Unless you are using a life support mod, but if you are, you shouldnt be baby sitting probes with Kerbals waiting for you out there. Take a look at this post: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/27999-ISA-Mapsat-Ideal-and-Non-Ideal-Altitudes Its meant for ISA but a lot of the info can be used for any mapping plugin, that includes Kethane. The ideal time to do one full scan, that is before it starts to cross areas its already scanned, is actualy shorter at higher altitudes.

Edited November 3, 2013 by Savage117

[brienne]

Would it be possible to merge Scansat and Kethane datas to a single map?

[drtedastro]

I would love to be able to have Kethane on these maps.... But i certainly do not want to loose these maps to just a 'Kethane' type map... There are needs for both styles.... IMHO...

[Estel]

this mod is awesome!! i just sent a transport ship with five sat to jool to scan all the moons in one go. now i only need eeloo and i can start planning landing missions...

i have also noticed a bug with the maps of tylo, in the middle of the right side there is a vertical line, it can be seen on every map, but is clearly visible in the slope greyscale one

Edited November 3, 2013 by Estel

[damny]

i have also noticed a bug with the maps of tylo, in the middle of the right side there is a vertical line, it can be seen on every map, but is clearly visible in the slope greyscale one

That's actually a feature of the terrain:

It looks like Tylo uses a height field texture, and it's not completely seamless. All the planet textures KSP uses seem to start at 90°E whereas SCANsat displays maps starting at 180°, that's why the fault line is clearly visible and not hidden by being on the edge of the map.

[OrtwinS]

OK, time for some observations...

• SCANsat's core functionality is pretty much complete, it can map, and it does it well.
  
• With only 2 updates damny has added a LOAD of UI tweaks that make it easier to use, and lots of new useful indicators and features (projections, ground track, zoom...). One quickly forgets the most 'explicit' bugs and UI-clumsy parts once they are fixed .
  
• SCANsat is quickly gaining popularity, with it being the only modern mapping plugin.
  
• There are no known 'fatal' bugs, and there have never been any that we know of (extra kudos for damny)

I think the only things we 'miss' is some non-essential polish, like

• New part models & textures (we have volunteers working on that)
  
• Tech tree integration (sensors spread across several nodes)
  
• Shrink/hide the 'forget map' button, or perhaps add confirmation?
  
• Toggle button to show/hide flag markers
  

Looking at the above achievements, and the difficulty to find anything serious to complain about, I'd like to suggest the next release will no longer be a 'Beta'.

Most plugins continue development after 'release' in the showcase forum. And the beta release in the development forum has (I think) thoroughly proven we have no major usability or performance issues.

Recap of future stuff people have already suggested:

Requested new features

• Mapping generates science (X points for every Y% map completeness has been suggested several times)
  
• Height dependent scan surface, with different sensors having different optimum altitudes (I made a little ramble about that earlier)
  
• OR sensors have a fixed view angle, resulting in larger area coverage with increasing altitude (at the price of reduced resolution)
  
• Add a colour legend for height and slope maps
  
• Add new aerodynamic BTDT scanner for use in planes (a duplicate scanner with new model)
  
• List of all found anomalies with coordinates
  
• Ability to export sensor data to external applications
  

Some 'far future' suggestions people made

• Kethane overlay
  
• FIGARO integration (GPS requirement for accurate location marking)
  
• Replace map-view planet textures with 'optical scan' results (non-scanned areas have a solid colour. This forces one to scan/map planets before being able to see features such as craters, mountains etc.)
  

NOTE: This is not an official or suggested todo list, nor my personal wishlist.

This is just an attempt at making a comprehensive recap of the past 20+ pages.

If I have forgotten some great idea or severe bug(fix) that has been mentioned, please tell me.

Edited November 3, 2013 by OrtwinS
typos, formatting

[TheCardinal]

I've noticed that the kethane mod doesn't work when the MapSat mod is added. It might be my machine/in game mod collection. Does anybody else have the same problem?