BSC: Rocket-powered VTOL - We have a winner!

[HazelPine]

Man, So close! Good job Giggleplex777, Ravenchant , Tarmenius , MiniMatt !

EDIT: Hey look! my 123st post!

Edited February 16, 2014 by SaplingPick

[briansun1]

top 10 yay...

good job to everyone who tryed they were all fun to mess around with

[Xeldrak]

It's time for the final vote! It will run for two days - please read

BSC: Challenge Guidelines Mk.II - even if you just want to vote!

The vote is public - everyone will be able to see what you have voted.

[MiniMatt]

Wowzers! As 1950s Batman would say. Pleasantly surprised that an appreciation of science and snacks got into the finals.

And supremely pleased that there is some staggeringly strong competition within those finals (and a teensy bit sad that the staggeringly strong competition of a good half dozen other contenders have fallen by the wayside).

Looking back at my initial vote I see I placed Giggleplex, Ravenchant & Tarmenius in 1st, 2nd, and 4th respectively and it's going to be hard to find anything between them for my final vote.

[Majorjim!]

Lucky Thirteen! yay?

I got the impression that peeps liked the asthetics of my LLTV but not the higher part count.

As I didnt actually make this for the competition, I don't feel too bad.

Thanks for all who voted for me.

MJ

[Rhomphaia]

Things were close in the middle of the pack...

Congrats to the finalists. Off for another round of tests.

[MiniMatt]

OK. Had another quick play with all the finalist's entries (excluding my own).

Thoughts from page 14 largely still remain.

I came back to thinking "What are stock craft for?" They should be fun to play with sure, but they should also be inspiration for players' own creations. A new player should be able to see how they work and say "hey! that's a neat idea! I'm borrowing that!". And perhaps in a way a stock craft should be imperfect, a new player should be able to think "I reckon I can improve that!".

Then I realised. I am a new player. Only been here since Summer 2013, still haven't actually been to half of the planetary bodies available.

All three of my brethren finalists have made fine craft worthy of being stock, all have inspired, and all I think I could tweak a bit. But with which craft did I as a new player actually do this? It was Giggleplex's entry. I've already stolen the method (s)he used for radially mounting 48-7S engines via small docking ports (and I've no doubt (s)he likewise "stole" that from someone else's idea way back). I've already thought "I reckon I can improve on this" - and went ahead and did just that (in my mind) because it was fun to do so.

I've treated Giggleplex's craft like a stock craft. I've stolen bits from it, and I (reckon I) have improved it. Demonstrably therefore, Giggleplex's craft is, to me, a stock craft and as such gets my final vote.

[BagelRabbit]

Wow. #5. I never thought I would get this far! Only one spot away from the finals!

Thanks to all who voted for me, and I'll certainly be back in the thick of it when the next BSC competition rolls around (when, not if).

I personally voted for MiniMatt in the finals. The Snack Wagon handles great, looks great, has a surprisingly good range and, of course, carries Snacks. (Of the final four, I would rank the Snack Wagon as highest, followed by the Damselfly, then the Bullfrog and finally the Pack Mule.)

Congrants to the finalists!

[Giggleplex777]

I happen to have the four finalists parked on top of the VAB already.

[Giggleplex777]

OK. Had another quick play with all the finalist's entries (excluding my own).

Thoughts from page 14 largely still remain.

I came back to thinking "What are stock craft for?" They should be fun to play with sure, but they should also be inspiration for players' own creations. A new player should be able to see how they work and say "hey! that's a neat idea! I'm borrowing that!". And perhaps in a way a stock craft should be imperfect, a new player should be able to think "I reckon I can improve that!".

Then I realised. I am a new player. Only been here since Summer 2013, still haven't actually been to half of the planetary bodies available.

All three of my brethren finalists have made fine craft worthy of being stock, all have inspired, and all I think I could tweak a bit. But with which craft did I as a new player actually do this? It was Giggleplex's entry. I've already stolen the method (s)he used for radially mounting 48-7S engines via small docking ports (and I've no doubt (s)he likewise "stole" that from someone else's idea way back). I've already thought "I reckon I can improve on this" - and went ahead and did just that (in my mind) because it was fun to do so.

I've treated Giggleplex's craft like a stock craft. I've stolen bits from it, and I (reckon I) have improved it. Demonstrably therefore, Giggleplex's craft is, to me, a stock craft and as such gets my final vote.

Thanks! I accidentally figured out the docking port technique while I was trying to avoid using cubic struts.

I was going to vote for your entry, but I clicked on the wrong one. *Facepalm* Tarmenius's entry was pretty good anyways.

BTW, it's "he".

[MiniMatt]

...but I clicked on the wrong one.

Bless! And thank you! Although as I'm sure you'll agree there is no such thing as a wrong vote in a competition this strong (with the exception of our own entries thanks to mutual self-deprecation).

BTW, it's "he".

Shall endeavour to remember and will doubtless forget I've been trying to remember where I left my car keys all day.

BTW, curious nobody went for the rapier engines. Jet/rocket mode toggleable on an action group and three degree vectoring strike as strong qualities. I did knock up a variant using them but the mass felt a bit unwieldy (though was using two of them).

[AmpsterMan]

Love the entries here, really learned a lot from watching this. I ended up not posting because the only thing I could come up with was really horrible to fly. It goes against the spirit of these challanges. Still, here are a few pictures.

BTW, curious nobody went for the rapier engines. Jet/rocket mode toggleable on an action group and three degree vectoring strike as strong qualities. I did knock up a variant using them but the mass felt a bit unwieldy (though was using two of them).

Interestingly, that was my first set up when I started working on my vehicle. The control authority ended up not being as big a deal as I thought. The increased weight ended up killing it for me.

Edited February 17, 2014 by AmpsterMan

[Xeldrak]

Well, Ampster, I have to say - your contraption does have a unique apperarence

[AmpsterMan]

Well, Ampster, I have to say - your contraption does have a unique apperarence

Haha Yes . I was going to post it but then I realized that it handles and feels more like a helicopter than a Rocket powered VTOL. I could have gone the easy way and just made something that was completely symetrical but it wasn't as fun IMO.

Ever since the Extra-Heavy lander challenge I have had a hard time coming up with things for your challenges Xeldrak . I wonder what you have planned when we run out!

[DisarmingBaton5]

Between Bullfrog and Snack Wagon, it is close. I'd rather use the Bullfrog, though.

[Tarmenius]

Maybe since it takes the jet engine a while to spool up, and you're not in the air instantly, it might seem to be "underpowered."

Actually, I don't mind the spooling up time for lift-off. It's more about those moments when you're descending too fast and by the time the engine speeds up and acceleration kicks in, you've already crashed. So, I suppose it isn't a matter of power, but of responsiveness. Guess I worded it wrong originally

Everyone's hating on the jet-powered entries, but I recently learned to fly jet VTOLs from testing these entries. They may be difficult to fly at first, but they provide a good learning experience later on.

I love the jet-powered VTOLs. In fact, the Bullfrog is the only VTOL in my hangar that's rocket-powered. Reviews would have been orders of magnitude more difficult for me had the target Stock craft not been "Rocket-powered."

And thanks to everyone who voted for the Bullfrog! I'm genuinely very surprised to have placed 3rd. As for the final vote, I chose MiniMat's SnackWagon. The pre-set thrust limiter with notes on that in the description was really what set it above the Pack Mule in my mind. It's going to change how I design my craft in the future, for sure.

[Andrew Hansen]

Woohoo! I'm glad to see the voting has ended, and how high-quality the finalists' entries are. I plan to test them a bit before I make my vote. I'm surprised to see that only one entry had the option of being powered by jet engines - the Damselfly!

One important aspect I'll be testing the finalists on is balance throughout the flight. I'll be using the RCS Build-Aid mod in addition to test-flying to see the amount of torque that is caused by the engines.

Why am I testing this? Mainly because my entry, the Wernhermobile, sadly didn't have perfect balance, and I think it's nice for a stock craft to show new pilots how to build balanced crafts.

[Giggleplex777]

Haha Yes . I was going to post it but then I realized that it handles and feels more like a helicopter than a Rocket powered VTOL. I could have gone the easy way and just made something that was completely symetrical but it wasn't as fun IMO.

Ever since the Extra-Heavy lander challenge I have had a hard time coming up with things for your challenges Xeldrak . I wonder what you have planned when we run out!

BSC, Revisited!

[Andrew Hansen]

OK, testing completed. I kind of cheated by moving engines around to achieve the greatest stability possible according to the RCS mod, then tested them. So if the creator of the craft made a mistake and placed an engine too far forward/backward, I corrected that and only tested the crafts according to how fuel drained during flight.

In addition to flying all the crafts to the VAB once more, I tested each of them to see how long they took to tilt over and hit the ground with SAS off. Here are the results:

Pack Mule: 17 seconds until destruction

Damselfly (Rocket): 41 seconds until destruction

Damselfly (Jet): 43 seconds until destruction

Damselfly (Rocket + Jet): 26 seconds until destruction

Bullfrog: 14 seconds until destruction

Snack Wagon VTOL: 5 seconds until destruction

The Damselfly seemed to have the least amount of COM shifting during flight, so it lasted the longest. It tilted forward, then backward as the fuel drained and thus increased its flight duration.

Plus, I also like the Damselfly for its rocket/jet function. So that's the craft I voted for. By the way, I'll be sharing an improved version of the Wernhermobile with you shortly. Hint: it uses the RAPIER engine, has barely any COM shifting, less confusing action groups, less parts, and is more awesomer.

[Andrew Hansen]

OK! I'm here once more with my promised "improved" version of the Wernhermobile. I totally redesigned it from the ground up, even though it still looks sort of similar.

This craft is called the Falcon 87. It's 8.9 tons and 35 parts, features near-zero COM shifting, is powered by the RAPIER engine, has simpler action groups, and can even get into orbit (it's an SSTO)! Plus, its more stable as a rover and even features a docking port you can use for vertical navball orientation. In addition, it works even better with a rocket than the Wernhermobile, since the COM is literally spot on the center of the structural plate.

Download Here

ADVERTISEMENT:

Here's the promised link to a video of a VTOL Duna SSTO in case anyone's interested.

Edited February 18, 2014 by Andrew Hansen

[Giggleplex777]

I like how you made it more compact. It looks a lot nicer now!

[Xeldrak]

Hm....thats really neat. I want to mount it on top of a rocket an fly to the Mün with it

[Xeldrak]

Aaaaaaand....we have a winner! It's Giggleplex! Again!

Now this marks his third time he wins a BSC contest - so special congratulations to Giggleplex.

It's been an awesome Challenge (once again) with suprisingly few incidents (none). Thank you guys once again for all your contributions - BSC would not be possible without you.

[briansun1]

yay.

so whens the next one

[HazelPine]

YAY! Congrats Giggleplex! @ Xeldrak, whats the next BSC going to be?