Space Regrets

[MrZayas1]

Hey guys just wanted to have a little chat, I wanted to ask something to you guys. What, if anything, really dissapoints you about the space programs, or finances that all of our space programs have, or problems in life in terms of space?

If i had to say something, it would probably be that if we started colonizing mars in 2 years, i would only regret not being able to live to see our civilization conquering such a beautiful planet.

Tell me what you have to say in the replies I have to go and i am in class right now! Cya!

[John Crichton]

My main disappointment is that the people funding space programs do not take into account profits generated from promoting science in general. A mission might cost $80m, but that's the only figure they look at when deciding whether or not to fund it...without taking into consideration that stuff like that not only leads to technological advances, it also inspires future leaders and inventors.

Also, as someone selling hotels for a living, I'd looooooooooooooooooove to see a functioning space hotel. I would like to stay there...and then sell it. I'd volunteer for property tours too during the sale

[AngelLestat]

I would regret if they try to colonize mars before venus.

[SargeRho]

I'm disappointed that manned Space Exploration basically got shafted after Apollo, and probably in part because of Apollo, too. We could have been on Mars over a decade ago, and perhaps be planning a manned mission into the outter solar system by now, if we had set that goal for ourselves. But no, we've not left LEO since the last Apollo mission. I also find it sad that the reasearch on nuclear engines has been stopped. Nuclear-Thermal Rockets would open up all of the inner solar system, some systems, such as nuclear lightbulbs even parts of the outter solar system, for humans.

And I would be deeply disappointed in humanity if we didn't land on Mars in the next 20-30 years.

@AngelLestat: Why Venus? It's dry, hot, corrosive and on the inner edge, if not beyond the inner edge, of the habitable zone. Aerostats would have to be built on Earth or in space, then shipped to Venus. There is basically nothing there of any economic value.

Mars in turn is worth it in the long term. Thickening its atmosphere is a lot easier than making Venus habitable, since you can mine all the materials you need there. You can't do that on Venus.

Edited February 11, 2014 by SargeRho

[USKnight]

Both Korolev and Von Braun dreamed of sending men to Mars. We never even started on that road or even finished the total scheduled Apollo missions.

[mdatspace]

I would regret if they try to colonize mars before venus.

Venus is harder to get off from. Also, how will you extract resources? Heat resistant technology will not last long in those pressures.

I would say Mercury would be better than Venus in many regards. Ice, easier to take off from, better solar power generation, etc. Cons? The suns gravity well.

http://einstein-schrodinger.com/mercury_colony.html

Edited February 11, 2014 by mdatspace

[AngelLestat]

@AngelLestat: Why Venus? It's dry, hot, corrosive and on the inner edge, if not beyond the inner edge, of the habitable zone. Aerostats would have to be built on Earth or in space, then shipped to Venus. There is basically nothing there of any economic value.

Mars in turn is worth it in the long term. Thickening its atmosphere is a lot easier than making Venus habitable, since you can mine all the materials you need there. You can't do that on Venus.

Venus is harder to get off from. Also, how will you extract resources? Heat resistant technology will not last long in those pressures.

I would say Mercury would be better than Venus in many regards. Ice, easier to take off from, better solar power generation, etc. Cons? The suns gravity well.

http://einstein-schrodinger.com/mercury_colony.html

Mercury does not have atmosphere. Gravity from the sun issue???

I just give my opinion about regreat. Lets not derail the topic.

Just read the last 2 terraforming venus page and you will become in another venus fan.

----------------------

Some other regreats?

Edited February 11, 2014 by AngelLestat
I write venus instead mercury

[Scotius]

My regrets? No nuclear engines, and no SSTO's. But, if VASIMR and Skylon deliver what they promise i might be pleasantly surprised.

[theend3r]

Venus does not have atmosphere. Gravity from the sun issue???

I just give my opinion about regreat. Lets not derail the topic.

Just read the last 2 terraforming venus page and you will become in another venus fan.

----------------------

Some other regreats?

Did I get it right that you think it doesn't have an atmosphere?

Because it does and it's a pretty nasty one on top of that.

[SargeRho]

I think he/she confused Venus with Mercury for a second there.

[sal_vager]

Yep, Venus has a nasty atmosphere, as the Russians discovered

[NASAFanboy]

Venus does not have atmosphere. Gravity from the sun issue???

I just give my opinion about regreat. Lets not derail the topic.

Just read the last 2 terraforming venus page and you will become in another venus fan.

----------------------

Some other regreats?

When reading this, I choked on the bagel I was eating and had a coughing fit. But its good now.

Venus is nasty as crap. Much more so than Mars. Let me give you some statistics.

The Venera probes that landed on Venus were heavily armored. There is plently of speculation that they could even withstand an armor-piercing shell from a tank. They land on Venus, and guess what? The mere force of the atmosphere crushes them to a crisp within several hours. Same thing happened with the USA probes that landed. They come down, and within several hours, they stop relaying back data, because guess what? They are crushed into a simple metal disc on the surface. That's what the atmospherical pressure will do to you. And keep in mind, these are probes that are specially designed for the purpose of landing on Venus. They are compact, and armored like a heavy battleship. There is no type of spacesuit in service or for the foreseeable future that could last five minutes on the Venusian surface. Probably thirty seconds at most, if they were upright.

The surface temperature on Venus is hot enough to melt lead. You got thunderstorms, sulfuric acid everywhere. It is the living planetary emobodiement of hell at its finest. If we still had die-hard religon today, they would say that evil people are transport to Venus in the afterlife. That is, if the radiation didn't kill them. It would be much easier to have an planetary research base on Mars by 2050 than to have one on the surface of Venus by 2100. The only thing that is easier on Venus is probably terraforming. And that's not going to happen before 2070, at the earliest.

____________________________________________________________________________

Now, what do I regret?

I regret everything.

I regret that NASA did not continue the Apollo Missions

I regret budget cutting the Space Shuttle and overtasking it

I regret building the ISS instead of a Moonbase like Reagan wanted it

I regret not launching Skylab H to the moon

I regret cancelling Project Constellation

I regret cancelling the SEI

I regret not funding the Integrated Manned Programme

I regret not following up with the Saturn V

I regret not ordering more Saturn V's

I regret not building a larger fleet of shuttles

I regret not following up the Space Race to Mars

I regret not launching the Venus flyby mission in 1980's.

I regret not using the NERVA to full potinetal

I regret cancelling the centerfuige module on the ISS

I regret downsizing the ISS

I regret moving the orbit of the ISS for political reasons and making it useless for orbital construction

I regret not funding the fuel depot proposal by ULA

I regret not following up with the promise to have a man on Mars by 2014

Most of all, I regret every NASA budget cut that has been made since the 1960's.

I am extremely frustrated at the progress of manned spaceflight since Apollo. I feel robbed, cheated, lied to too, scammed. Robbed of a future that should've happened by all respects. Robbed out of the rightful timeline. But most of all, deep dissappointment with NASA and the United States Government.

If you could take my anger about the fact that we are still stuck in LEO, and harness it as a fusion bomb, it would be enough to destroy the inner solar system, remove 20% of the sun's mass, and pulverize the asteroid belt and Jupiter and Saturn.

Edited February 11, 2014 by NASAFanboy

[AngelLestat]

I think he/she confused Venus with Mercury for a second there.

Yeah, that happens. I was answering to mdatspace, he was talking about mercury.

When reading this, I choked on the bagel I was eating and had a coughing fit. But its good now.

Venus is nasty as crap. Much more so than Mars. Let me give you some statistics.

If you could take my anger about the fact that we are still stuck in LEO, and harness it as a fusion bomb, it would be enough to destroy the inner solar system, remove 20% of the sun's mass, and pulverize the asteroid belt and Jupiter and Saturn.

Yeah, i know.. At venus surface there is a pressure compared to 1000m depth in our oceans.

But I was not talking about the surface..

At 50km height, Venus is a paradise compared to any other planet. The perfect place to place cities. But kept that discussion in the terroforming venus topic.

About regreats.. why so many want to go back to the moon? Just to get another picture?

[SargeRho]

Exept for the supreme dryness and lack of oxygen, yeah, a paradise. You can produce the oxygen from the air, but where do you get water from? Venus is bone-dry.

[NASAFanboy]

Yeah, that happens. I was answering to mdatspace, he was talking about mercury.

Yeah, i know.. At venus surface there is a pressure compared to 1000m depth in our oceans.

But I was not talking about the surface..

At 50km height, Venus is a paradise compared to any other planet. The perfect place to place cities. But kept that discussion in the terroforming venus topic.

About regreats.. why so many want to go back to the moon? Just to get another picture?

I'll give you a sense of scale here.

If the Moon was a beach, all the Apollo missions combined would be taking three footsteps on the beach and picking up a seashell.

We've explored less of the moon than there is space in the National Mall.

[SargeRho]

Also the Moon is an irradiated wasteland with no atmosphere...and it's relatively easy to reach. Oh, and things like aluminium, silicon, platinum, gold, copper, and also hydrogen and oxygen are all over the surface. It's a ressource pile waiting to be explored.

Venus in turn is basically a fake diamond. Looks shiny, is worthless.

[AngelLestat]

I'll give you a sense of scale here.

If the Moon was a beach, all the Apollo missions combined would be taking three footsteps on the beach and picking up a seashell.

We've explored less of the moon than there is space in the National Mall.

I know, is a cheap place where manned mission can be sent. But for now, for the same cost.

I prefer explore with unmanned vehicles titan, europa and venus. That there is a lot more chance that we can discover something of real value.

SargerRho: This is not the place to discuss such things. You are wrong.

Edited February 12, 2014 by AngelLestat

[architeuthis]

No regrets.

In many ways the Saturn V was only a minor corollary development of the ICBM. In fact the Redstone, Atlas and Titan rockets the Mercury and Gemini astronauts used for their rides to orbit literally were ICBMs. We took these machines designed with the express intent only of mass destruction, and which are still easily among the greatest and most powerful machines ever built, and used them to send ourselves (physically or otherwise) to other worlds. For the vast bulk of our species existence on this planet this wasn't even science fiction, this was beyond the scope of imagination. The planets of our solar system were just points of light, nebulae and galaxies were small smudges in the sky. No longer. As long as dreamers keep gazing upwards at the milky way and thinking if the future I will have no regrets.

[mdatspace]

Also the Moon is an irradiated wasteland with no atmosphere...and it's relatively easy to reach. Oh, and things like aluminium, silicon, platinum, gold, copper, and also hydrogen and oxygen are all over the surface. It's a ressource pile waiting to be explored.

Venus in turn is basically a fake diamond. Looks shiny, is worthless.

I concur. The moon is the most viable destination for colonization in the near future, in my mind. My regrets?

We never did any long-term stays on the moon. We should have followed up after Apollo.

Edited February 12, 2014 by mdatspace

[SargeRho]

Well, I think we shouldn't colonise the Moon so much as we should exploit it. Have large robotic mining operations, perhaps a manned radiotelescope station on the far side, and some solar power plants with microwave power transmitters on the poles. But I don't think it's a body we should live on, since it's a dead, radiation-bathed wasteland full of ressources. I equate the Moon with a desert. There's no good reason to live there, but it's awesome for solar power, and as a source of silicon.

Mars in turn, has an atmosphere, and can concievably be terraformed. It also recieves less radiation than the Moon.

Edited February 12, 2014 by SargeRho

[peadar1987]

When reading this, I choked on the bagel I was eating and had a coughing fit. But its good now.

Venus is nasty as crap. Much more so than Mars. Let me give you some statistics.

The Venera probes that landed on Venus were heavily armored. There is plently of speculation that they could even withstand an armor-piercing shell from a tank. They land on Venus, and guess what? The mere force of the atmosphere crushes them to a crisp within several hours. Same thing happened with the USA probes that landed. They come down, and within several hours, they stop relaying back data, because guess what? They are crushed into a simple metal disc on the surface. That's what the atmospherical pressure will do to you. And keep in mind, these are probes that are specially designed for the purpose of landing on Venus. They are compact, and armored like a heavy battleship. There is no type of spacesuit in service or for the foreseeable future that could last five minutes on the Venusian surface. Probably thirty seconds at most, if they were upright.

The surface temperature on Venus is hot enough to melt lead. You got thunderstorms, sulfuric acid everywhere. It is the living planetary emobodiement of hell at its finest. If we still had die-hard religon today, they would say that evil people are transport to Venus in the afterlife. That is, if the radiation didn't kill them. It would be much easier to have an planetary research base on Mars by 2050 than to have one on the surface of Venus by 2100. The only thing that is easier on Venus is probably terraforming. And that's not going to happen before 2070, at the earliest.

____________________________________________________________________________

Now, what do I regret?

I regret everything.

I regret that NASA did not continue the Apollo Missions

I regret budget cutting the Space Shuttle and overtasking it

I regret building the ISS instead of a Moonbase like Reagan wanted it

I regret not launching Skylab H to the moon

I regret cancelling Project Constellation

I regret cancelling the SEI

I regret not funding the Integrated Manned Programme

I regret not following up with the Saturn V

I regret not ordering more Saturn V's

I regret not building a larger fleet of shuttles

I regret not following up the Space Race to Mars

I regret not launching the Venus flyby mission in 1980's.

I regret not using the NERVA to full potinetal

I regret cancelling the centerfuige module on the ISS

I regret downsizing the ISS

I regret moving the orbit of the ISS for political reasons and making it useless for orbital construction

I regret not funding the fuel depot proposal by ULA

I regret not following up with the promise to have a man on Mars by 2014

Most of all, I regret every NASA budget cut that has been made since the 1960's.

I am extremely frustrated at the progress of manned spaceflight since Apollo. I feel robbed, cheated, lied to too, scammed. Robbed of a future that should've happened by all respects. Robbed out of the rightful timeline. But most of all, deep dissappointment with NASA and the United States Government.

If you could take my anger about the fact that we are still stuck in LEO, and harness it as a fusion bomb, it would be enough to destroy the inner solar system, remove 20% of the sun's mass, and pulverize the asteroid belt and Jupiter and Saturn.

The probes weren't crushed like pancakes, because they were subjected to hydrostatic pressure, not a pure compressive force. They probably would have been crushed more like tomatoes. The ones that were crushed in the atmosphere anyway.

The ones on the surface would have most likely failed due to the heat. If something is subjected to a constant mechanical load, like the pressure on the surface of Venus, it will generally either fail instantly, or not at all. Only a few mechanisms allow it to fail further down the line, like melting, creep, corrosion, or stress corrosion cracking. My guess is that the structure of the probes softened and crept under the high temperatures, resulting in a catastrophic failure due to the pressure shortly afterwards.

[Aghanim]

I think, most of those space programs fails because of the US politicians are not bold enough. Take China for examples. The environmentalists, heck even the entire world river organization oppose the building of Three Gorges Dam, yet their politicians basically doesn't give a damn about it and here we are now, with the largest dam which is also the largest concrete structure in the world generating a huge amount of electricity only matched by nukes. Now, China went to the moon.

Note: I'm not saying those environmentalists are wrong, and I doesn't live at US. But with my country still at solid fuel rocket stage, and its still yet to deliver its own satellite into orbit, you know by yourselves...

I regret that those politicians are even accepted into US I don't really understand government system

And Centrifuge Accommodation Module.

[peadar1987]

I think, most of those space programs fails because of the US politicians are not bold enough. Take China for examples. The environmentalists, heck even the entire world river organization oppose the building of Three Gorges Dam, yet their politicians basically doesn't give a damn about it and here we are now, with the largest dam which is also the largest concrete structure in the world generating a huge amount of electricity only matched by nukes. Now, China went to the moon.

Note: I'm not saying those environmentalists are wrong, and I doesn't live at US. But with my country still at solid fuel rocket stage, and its still yet to deliver its own satellite into orbit, you know by yourselves...

I regret that those politicians are even accepted into US I don't really understand government system

And Centrifuge Accommodation Module.

Which country is this, out of interest?

[kBob]

Hmmm three gorges seems to have a lot of problems I recently read it is silting up fast among others.

Anyway my regrets are the low priority the search for extra-terrestrial life seems to get and...

I regret how low the priority seems to be to have gotten data about global warming from satellites we (the US especially but the world in general) should have been doing heavy research and specialist satellite launches starting back in the 80's but you know Regan and Thatcher et el. Heck learning about (the chemistry of) global warming was part of my chem101 class in like '88.

[AngelLestat]

we already had plenty of data about global warming, is time to take measures, not gather more data.