[1.12.X] Tantares - Stockalike Soyuz and MIR [16.1][28.05.2024][Mars Expedition WIP]

[hraban]

2 hours ago, Callistoan said:

I am very confused about Polyus. I know it had an FGB module to dock with, but what was the purpose of the larger black module. In some pictures, I've seen it as some sort of laser cannon while other show it as habitable space. What was at the end of the polyus spacecraft. What were the two radial tanks on the side for? Where are the engines that they had to use? Like the little engines on the Salyut? 

The meaning of the long Polyus module consisted in several main tasks.

First, there was no laser cannon but a laser target illumination and aiming system. Furthermore there were glare lasers.

Secondly, the radial cylinders contained test bodies which were to be ejected with different vectors without recoil and captured with the target system.

Thirdly, Polyus is said to have had a system for the delivery of nuclear re-entry bodies (MOBS), the statement is doubtful, especially since a permanent stationing of nuclear weapons in orbit was and is prohibited by treaties. On the other hand, Polyus could potentially be used for this task due to its size alone.

Fourthly, Polyus is said to have been equipped with various self-protection devices, such as space mines and a recoilless machine gun and active radar.

Polyus itself only had stabilization and attitude control systems and two compact RCS blocks.
The two main engines of the FGB were to be used to finalize the orbit and to modify the orbit.

Edited April 4, 2019 by hraban

[Beale]

3 hours ago, Callistoan said:

I am very confused about Polyus.

Welcome to my world

There's very little information online, little good information, and a lot of really bad information (Including maybe me! But, this is just what I gathered).
Appreciate any corrections if anybody has some good sources.

There is a good info here (But, I don't know the source).
http://www.buran-energia.com/polious/polious-desc.php

From what I have found the IRL Polyus that flew was a kind of half functional / dummy payload and a basic model for the real anti-satellite Skif-DM spacecraft further in the future.
It was missing a lot (I think 10 tons lighter than the actual Skif-DM?).

The layout for the real craft (never flown IRL) is something like this maybe? (Thanks Zorg for the picture).

The FGB section is made from re-used components from the earlier TKS / Kosmos tests (And as far as I know it was fully functional in every regard).

The black section is a real mystery. Some sources have said it's the hull from an in-development MIR-2 project.
(but this is the hull only, no habitable section)(Why MIR-2 was written on Polyus may be a similar story to why "Salyut" was written on Almaz).

There are other sources in Russian, but if I remember correctly  - the descriptions of these are quite vague (I.E. "Equipment section").
Worth to say these diagrams also show the FGB section incorrectly, so it's easy to question the whole thing.

The tanks on the side contain little canisters containing noble gasses (?), that can be fired ahead - I think this was for the calibration of the laser?

 

 

I hope you can appreciate it is a very confusing picture
But, the real thing is shrouded in a little mystery, and for the real Polyus that flew, it's likely its bark was louder than its bite.

 

And for KSP...

The Polyus in Tantares is designed  for a misc / multi-purpose role. With the hollow hull / science lab, you can confgure it for a ISRU / Space station maybe. There are other mods out there to give it weapons, if that's your thing also.

Some reall cool stuff from Jay the Amazing toaster with that:

And from little old me:

 

Edited April 4, 2019 by Beale

[TK-313]

3 hours ago, Callistoan said:

I am very confused about Polyus. I know it had an FGB module to dock with, but what was the purpose of the larger black module. In some pictures, I've seen it as some sort of laser cannon while other show it as habitable space. What was at the end of the polyus spacecraft. What were the two radial tanks on the side for? Where are the engines that they had to use? Like the little engines on the Salyut? 

The big black module IRL was a prototype anti-satellite laser cannon (correction - as @hraban notes, onboard Polyus it wasn't a functional cannon, just an illuminating test piece), there never were any habitable modules based on it (although the Baikonur crew slapped on the Mir-2 inscription, apparently in hope that there would be). The FGB on the upper end was, AFAIK, not habitable either, only meant to receive Progress resupply crafts with the working substance for the laser, and the lower end housed the targeting antenna and the jaser's working end. The pieces that work as RCS on @Beale's Polyus are actually momentumless vents, to bleed off said overheated substance after the laser does its work without changing the station's orbit. And the small tanks were IRL practice target launch containers - the prototype would drop some then test the laser cannon on them. Perhaps there would be none on later stations or they would contain something else - we'll never know.

Edited April 4, 2019 by TK-313
some vital specifics

[Beale]

The current decouplers are really(!) old!

A couple of changes for the new, little visual greeble to come in the centre, but gameplay wise:

• Hollow colliders (On those >= 1.25m)
• Hot-stage cap versions, so you can do things correctly.

These will replace both the current yellow generic decouplers and the N1 red decouplers.

 

Edited April 4, 2019 by Beale

[Legcutter]

4 hours ago, TK-313 said:

The pieces that work as RCS on @Beale's Polyus are actually momentumless vents, to bleed off said overheated substance after the laser does its work without changing the station's orbit.

Yup.
Gas dynamic laser with some amount of single-use overheated gas generating cartridges - a good solution for high-power laser with no need for huge batteries or God 4give me nuclear reactors on orbit (we tried it before and figured that not everyone abroad were happy).
A storage for cartridges, feeding and initiation systems are the middle of the Polyus craft.

Edited April 4, 2019 by Legcutter

[Pointblank66]

Anyone here who can help me out identifying these deprecated parts?
I would like to use them again for a different station project but I feel like these parts have been removed or completely reworked beyond recognition.(See attachment below in the spoiler)

Spoiler

I would like to know if those parts are still available somewhere and if I can still get them is the colours like they are in the spoiler, so gray and beige-ish

Edited April 4, 2019 by Pointblank66

[golkaidakhaana]

10 hours ago, Pointblank66 said:

Anyone here who can help me out identifying these deprecated parts?
I would like to use them again for a different station project but I feel like these parts have been removed or completely reworked beyond recognition.(See attachment below in the spoiler)

  Reveal hidden contents

I would like to know if those parts are still available somewhere and if I can still get them is the colours like they are in the spoiler, so gray and beige-ish

Those are all old FGB and Salyut parts, I believe Beale started removing them in the Almaz update, so just use whatever update was before that (I think it was the Progress update?).

[Beale]

17 hours ago, Pointblank66 said:

Anyone here who can help me out identifying these deprecated parts?
I would like to use them again for a different station project but I feel like these parts have been removed or completely reworked beyond recognition.(See attachment below in the spoiler)

  Hide contents

 

I would like to know if those parts are still available somewhere and if I can still get them is the colours like they are in the spoiler, so gray and beige-ish

It is approx. something like this:

[Pointblank66]

10 hours ago, sslaptnhablhat said:

Those are all old FGB and Salyut parts, I believe Beale started removing them in the Almaz update, so just use whatever update was before that (I think it was the Progress update?).

Welp, that is sad, I really liked the textures of it.. Couldn't really find any patch notes about it too. (Maybe I looked over it)

I hope he will expand the texture pack to more parts

 

3 hours ago, Beale said:

It is approx. something like this:

I tried it and it does kinda look like the old version yes.

[Beale]

27 minutes ago, Pointblank66 said:

I tried it and it does kinda look like the old version yes

Oh, those should be the exact replacements for the old parts, what sslaptnhablhat wrote was not correct.

White / beige texture incoming in the future.

 

 

 

[Beale]

Decouplers!
The styling is heavily inspired from Restock, because immitation is the highest form of flattery.

Edited April 5, 2019 by Beale

[Beale]

[golkaidakhaana]

12 hours ago, Beale said:

Oh, those should be the exact replacements for the old parts, what sslaptnhablhat wrote was not correct.

No, I'm pretty certain you began depreciating those parts around the Progress revamp/Almaz update, starting with the old Salyut forward adapter, and I never said anything about you not replacing those parts, which I know you did.

Edited April 6, 2019 by golkaidakhaana

[Beale]

8 hours ago, sslaptnhablhat said:

No, I'm pretty certain you began depreciating those parts around the Progress revamp/Almaz update, starting with the old Salyut forward adapter, and I never said anything about you not replacing those parts, which I know you did.

Aaah okay I see what you mean, I thought you had said they were removed entirely (as in, the concept / basic class of part).

Yes you are right on the deprecation.

[Beale]

I might leave out the grey version? There is not really any grey rockets, but it could be useful for spacecraft?

His coconut gun, it fires in spurts, if he shoots ya, it's gonna hurt!

Edited April 6, 2019 by Beale

[TK-313]

2 hours ago, Beale said:

I might leave out the grey version? There is not really any grey rockets, but it could be useful for spacecraft?

This. There's plenty of grey spacecraft, after all.

[Beale]

3 hours ago, TK-313 said:

This. There's plenty of grey spacecraft, after all.

Your wish is my command - shalakazam.

 

Github!

New tweaked Kosmos.
New decouplers.

Decprecated old decouplers.
Deprecated old Kosmos.
(Both still in-game existing crafts, textures crunched to 0.25x)

 

 

[Beale]

[Beale]

Verniers & Co.

Still issues with emissives to resolve, but basing the numbers on IRL Kosmos produces some, er... energetic numbers.
Good for a converted ICBM I guess!

[TK-313]

2 hours ago, Beale said:

Verniers & Co.

Still issues with emissives to resolve, but basing the numbers on IRL Kosmos produces some, er... energetic numbers.
Good for a converted ICBM I guess! 

Are the weights all right as well? Because the real thing has a modest 1.39 TWR without the payload (if the info on Wikipedia is anything to be believed)

[Beale]

6 hours ago, TK-313 said:

Are the weights all right as well? Because the real thing has a modest 1.39 TWR without the payload (if the info on Wikipedia is anything to be believed)

That's the most likely cause, I will give it a play around.

[GJdude]

I've identified a problem with a the USI-LS habitation and life support options - namely that they don't exist. I think the config for it needs some fixing to match the changes in that USI-LS February update.

I managed to patch it myself by swapping out some module names, and as far as I can tell it works fine, but it might be missing some things I'm not aware of since I didn't include the stuff about swappable converters. Needless to say, my coding knowledge is nonexistent at best.

Would anyone like a pastebin of the changes, or should we wait on a more official patch?

[Beale]

6 hours ago, GJdude said:

I've identified a problem with a the USI-LS habitation and life support options - namely that they don't exist. I think the config for it needs some fixing to match the changes in that USI-LS February update.

I managed to patch it myself by swapping out some module names, and as far as I can tell it works fine, but it might be missing some things I'm not aware of since I didn't include the stuff about swappable converters. Needless to say, my coding knowledge is nonexistent at best.

Would anyone like a pastebin of the changes, or should we wait on a more official patch?

Thanks for taking a look at that! The truth is they weren't updated in a long-time, so if there were updates on the USI side it may be the cause.

The USI patch for Tantares is currently not maintained by anyone AFAIK, so if you have fixes yourself I'm more than happy to integrate them into the main release! If you want of course.

 

 

Github

Play with a worryingly high TWR kosmos right now, still a lot to balance, but fixed emissives.

[GJdude]

20 minutes ago, Beale said:

Thanks for taking a look at that! The truth is they weren't updated in a long-time, so if there were updates on the USI side it may be the cause.

The USI patch for Tantares is currently not maintained by anyone AFAIK, so if you have fixes yourself I'm more than happy to integrate them into the main release! If you want of course.

I was looking through the thread for USI-LS and there certainly was mention of some lines of code I haven't included, but I think they're only necessary for things that actually swap modules (like MKS parts), which I don't think anything in Tantares does, so everything should be, and with some testing does indeed appear to be, working perfectly.

On the integration front, that's absolutely fine! Here's the pastebin, it should just overwrite the code already in the patch;

https://pastebin.com/PF6WyE9N

[Beale]

22 hours ago, GJdude said:

I was looking through the thread for USI-LS and there certainly was mention of some lines of code I haven't included, but I think they're only necessary for things that actually swap modules (like MKS parts), which I don't think anything in Tantares does, so everything should be, and with some testing does indeed appear to be, working perfectly.

On the integration front, that's absolutely fine! Here's the pastebin, it should just overwrite the code already in the patch;

https://pastebin.com/PF6WyE9N

And it's official! Many thanks for that.
Credited you in the included patch.cfg.

Edited April 9, 2019 by Beale