[1.0.x] [V1.9f] Kerbal Foundries wheels, anti-grav repulsors and tracks

[DocMop]

May I ask why? Just curious.

[Gaalidas]

I'm afraid it's been talked about way too many times. It's an engine limitation. We'd need to find a way to trick the engine into thinking that the wheel has lost contact with the ground for a split second to re-set the new settings, which wouldn't be something that would be easy to do without bringing on the kracken.

As for functionality toggles, I'm all about adding more power to the end user and to the future modders of these things. I'll be exposing more and more as configurable options in the future if possible.

[ArkaelDren]

In the old Bobcat rovers you had the ability to adjust the friction levels.

MODULE

{

name = ModuleCleverWheeledVehicle

forwardTorque = 5.0

backwardTorque = 6.0

brakeTorue = 8.0

frictionTorque = 0.025

forwardFriction = 0.9

sidewaysFriction = 0.6

Made it possible to reduce the "catch a rail" rover deaths when a slight bounce or turn in a very slight direction happened. I am not aware of a cfg edit within the KerbalFoundries parts unless I'm missing something. Seen a post or two asking or attempting to find out. Please tell me we have an option, or something close to it, because these tracks at any speed over the "(rated at X=speed), or kerbal stuff will happen" values and they stick a rail and pirouette rather spectacularly. We do have the ability to adjust this,

rollingResistance

{

key = 0 10 0 0

key = 15 33.84891 4.694316 4.968345

key = 25 200 30.06485 31.3923

}

In this example the resistance is 10 up until you reach 15ms, but what are the other two values for?

Edited September 14, 2015 by ArkaelDren

[Gaalidas]

Yes, but that's at the config level. In-flight is another matter entirely.

You also have to consider that KF doesn't suffer from the same "catch a rail" issues due to the advanced suspension and anti-roll systems in place, along with the smooth turning speed and the heavy turning reduction with high speeds.

As for the float curves... your guess is as good as mine. We'll need lo-fi for that one.

Edited September 14, 2015 by Gaalidas

[lo-fi]

Gaalidas, Aqua, expect some communication later in the week with account details for all the KF stuff if you're interested in taking it over? There's a gmail account I've used for most, so you're welcome to that. Few last bits I need to transfer. I'm about to rebuild my PC, sans game development tools, so that's it from me. Been a privilege, guys, but this is where my KSP modding journey ends

Gaalidas, I suggest you start a new thread so you have control over the OP and I'll ask a mod to lock this one. Up to you whether it's release or development. I'll put a note in the OP here too clarifying the license and my blessing to pick it up. Good luck with U5 if you decide to tackle that when it comes up!

[riocrokite]

we, who continue to enjoy your work tremendously salute you o/

[V8jester]

Thanks for everything Lofi!

[DocMop]

I'm afraid it's been talked about way too many times. It's an engine limitation. We'd need to find a way to trick the engine into thinking that the wheel has lost contact with the ground for a split second to re-set the new settings, which wouldn't be something that would be easy to do without bringing on the kracken.

As for functionality toggles, I'm all about adding more power to the end user and to the future modders of these things. I'll be exposing more and more as configurable options in the future if possible.

I guess, for a start it would be good enough to enable the editing of grip inside the editor only.

[Gaalidas]

Gaalidas, Aqua, expect some communication later in the week with account details for all the KF stuff if you're interested in taking it over? There's a gmail account I've used for most, so you're welcome to that. Few last bits I need to transfer. I'm about to rebuild my PC, sans game development tools, so that's it from me. Been a privilege, guys, but this is where my KSP modding journey ends

Gaalidas, I suggest you start a new thread so you have control over the OP and I'll ask a mod to lock this one. Up to you whether it's release or development. I'll put a note in the OP here too clarifying the license and my blessing to pick it up. Good luck with U5 if you decide to tackle that when it comes up!

Dangit... you're leaving us for good? I can't imagine ever leaving this stuff permanently. Honestly, this mod will likely go nowhere as far as new content if you're giving up on it. I can add new features and what not, but once they update and break things I'm going to be completely lost. What brought on this sudden interest in not continuing?

EDIT: I'll continue updating this mod as long as I can, I just really think it's going to be way over my head when KSP is updated to Unity 5.

Also, I'd really be interested in getting a hold of the source for the texture animation plugin that you distribute with KF, and any work in progress assets you've been working on lately. Also, I'd be interested to see the current progress on the tie-downs and the hitch. At the very least, if I have your latest work on that I might be able to put up a plugin-dev thread to try and get the community involved in polishing that up. Ideally I'd like to get a basic framework of this plugin put together that other developers could then hook into in order to add features to the base mod. That way things like DustFX, water sliders, new types of steering or load-bearing modules, etc. could be created independently as plugins for the overall KF mod. That's my long-term idea right now anyway, and it would allow the end user to pick and choose what features they want to install based on preference and performance needs.

I'd suggest you update the content repository on github with anything you've been working on that you're willing to release to us, and then just make sure that any WIP code is in your development branch of the KF_plugin repository. I'd hate to see those features go missing completely when you take off, even if I am unable to make them work myself. The KSP modding community has lost so much good stuff when people have disappeared and I don't want to see our work go that way when this is all over. Besides, I fully intend to use my work here in whatever portfolio I build when I'm trying to get employed after college.

- - - Updated - - -

I guess, for a start it would be good enough to enable the editing of grip inside the editor only.

Well, first thing I'm going to do is simply make sure that everything that can be tweaked in an form is exposed to the part configs. Editor controls are a more tricky matter and will have to come later. At this time almost everything is already available, and those that aren't are simply calculated from the parameters that are. What I'd really like to do is try and expose even the calculations themselves to the configs, but that's going to be a tricky matter of converting strings to ints/floats and such. I'm sure it could be done though.

Edited September 15, 2015 by Gaalidas

[DocMop]

I guess would party even if the forward and sideways grip is edible via .cfg only. Even if it's only the stiffness multipliers for both, it would be a big improvement imho. I'm looking forward to the stuff you can let us access

[Gaalidas]

It'll all be on hold for a week or so while I figure out what we're going to do about loosing our fearless leader and all, but I ain't done with this mod yet. I did take a look at the KFModuleWheel module and I actually don't think there's much more than can be exposed at this time. It may be that everything you need is in those float curves, but I need to get a crash course in how those float curves work, especially in regards to the third and fourth numbers in the data. I'm also vaguely aware that some of those parameters are actually in the model configuration as well, but I'm unsure if our modules are working alongside those parameters or overriding them completely. I'm a bit out of my element with most of what was done to make these wheels work before I joined the project (that's about a month worth of development that I never saw).

[DocMop]

My guess would be that the four values are

• asymptoteSlip
  
• asymptoteValue
  
• extremumSlip
  
• extremumValue
  

as shown here: http://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/WheelFrictionCurve.html

[lo-fi]

Look.. Ever seen a wheel where you can change the grip of the tyre? Nope. The modules are not built for it and you'd have a tough job not messing up the dynamics of most of the tracks by making it adjustable. By all means write yourself a module to over-ride the values, but IMO it has no sane place here; that's why I never included that as an adjustment. Gaalidas, it's your call if you're taking over, of course, but I'd advise against causing yourself the headache and simply put this one to bed... U5 will no doubt cause you enough!

- - - Updated - - -

Also, having looked back a page: thanks for the kind words guys.

I'll probably develop some more stuff at some point, but purely for my own amusement. Releasing it is just too much stress and demand for what is largely a thankless task!

[Gaalidas]

Well, if you ever come up with something truly amazing, send it out my way and I'll see if it can be spread around. Feel free to back-seat mod, if you catch my meaning.

As for the other stuff, I'm not through messing with it, but I'm definitely not thinking anything will be doable during flight. I'm aiming more for extra control in the editors and/or for part makers in the future. Also, I've grabbed local copies of your development branches and I fully intend to post up some of the more complicated stuff and see if the community can make any sense of the various final pieces of the puzzles. I also really want to see about getting crawler steering working again somewhere down the line. I have another week before school starts, so I might as well brave a possible headache once more.

Don't remind me about U5. That's scary stuff. I'm in way over my head in that regard.

[lo-fi]

Go easy dude. Been a pleasure

[sumghai]

[MOD - lo-fi has requested that this thread be closed. In the meantime, be sure to check out Gaalidas's continuation soon!]

[DespairingSquid]

Wish you luck Gaalidas, this mod was amazing while it lasted

[lo-fi]

Thread re-opened as Gaalidas is AWOL and I couldn't update the OP on the other thread. 1.0.x download link is live, plus info about 1.1 status.

We're back in business! I'd forgotten how gargantuan this thread was. Good to be back

 

EDIT: and a small thanks to @sumghai for working his moderator magic!

Edited April 29, 2016 by lo-fi

[V8jester]

Just now, lo-fi said:

Thread re-opened as Gaalidas is AWOL and I couldn't update the OP on the other thread. 1.0.x download link is live, plus info about 1.1 status.

We're back in business! I'd forgotten how gargantuan this thread was. Good to be back

 

EDIT: and a small thanks to @sumghai for working his moderator magic!

I thought I sensed a disturbance in the force

Welcome back to "The Thread"

[lo-fi]

"Asteroids do not CONCERN me, Admir.... " Oh wait....

So to bring you guys up to date, I'm collaborating on a custom wheel collider with Shadowmage. Which seems completely and utterly bonkers, but that's nothing new to me.

[Stone Blue]

1 hour ago, lo-fi said:

Thread re-opened as Gaalidas is AWOL and I couldn't update the OP on the other thread. 1.0.x download link is live, plus info about 1.1 status.

We're back in business! I'd forgotten how gargantuan this thread was. Good to be back

 

EDIT: and a small thanks to @sumghai for working his moderator magic!

@lo-fi @sumghai Just a thought, would it be possible, and pros/cons of MERGING the other thread into THIS one?... I wouldnt think they would overlap time-wise too much... ???

That way it would have the continuity, and you wouldnt lose any relevant info/disscussion from that thread? and it might cause less confusion with TWO lengthy threads on the same mod out there...???

Edited April 30, 2016 by Stone Blue

[lo-fi]

I've no idea how that kind of moderator shenanigans works tbh!

[Stone Blue]

1 minute ago, lo-fi said:

I've no idea how that kind of moderator shenanigans works tbh!

Ok, but in your opinion would it even be worth it?

[Neutrinovore]

1 hour ago, lo-fi said:

"Asteroids do not CONCERN me, Admir.... " Oh wait....

So to bring you guys up to date, I'm collaborating on a custom wheel collider with Shadowmage. Which seems completely and utterly bonkers, but that's nothing new to me.

Lol, no worries!  If you can pull off with Unity 5 and KSP1.1.X what you did with your wheels in Unity 4, that'll be par for the course for you, plus we'll once again have wheels that we can lobby for Squad to make stock instead of the dreck they give us.  No pressure, though...  

[Imperium_Titan_Roma]

8 hours ago, DespairingSquid said:

Wish you luck Gaalidas, this mod was amazing while it lasted

Indeed, I hope for the best, and wish the best of luck, the Mod was beautiful, and enabled so much more possibilities ingame