parts [1.2] USI Survivability Pack (Formerly DERP) [v0.6.0]

[forsaken1111]

Whoever suggested using DERPs for rescue missions is a genius. I just pulled off a 3x rendezvous and rescue mission sending 3 DERPs back home.

I am considering giving DERPs the mechjeb landing assist module. It makes sense for an emergency escape capsule.

[goldenpsp]

Whoever suggested using DERPs for rescue missions is a genius. I just pulled off a 3x rendezvous and rescue mission sending 3 DERPs back home.

I am considering giving DERPs the mechjeb landing assist module. It makes sense for an emergency escape capsule.

You think that is fun. Make a multi-DERP, karbonite based rescue vehicle. Put like a half dozen derp modules on it. You can have it skimming the atmo at 72km collecting karbonite to refill the tanks while waiting. Then when a rescue mission pops up you can burn up a little to rendevous, kerbal hops in one DERP, then go back down to 72km to refill the tanks again.

[Aedile]

I am thinking:

1. 2x hitchhiker cans with 4x DERP each.

2. Pressing abort button (mapped to Evacuate)

3. Popcorn

Bonus points if you attach them as grapes...

[JeffreyCor]

Incorrect. It is more comparable in size to the smaller landing can (as noted below), and larger than my bubble pod (which will *barely* fit one Kerbal - and no helmet allowed). The DERP is sized not only for just the Kerbal, but has to support the layer of ablative material, the inner wall (as it's an inflatable), plus enough space for monoprop, TAC-LS supplies, power source, etc.

Stock has already shown the size of the pods no not directly correlate to how many fix within and a control pod would have far more than lifeboat, by that reasoning a lifeboat could hold equal or less than the capacity of the bridge) I don't see how it's incorrect when I even showed it in the picture. The TAC-LS amounts appear to be already adjustable in the config file. Certainly not arguing or anything of that nature, but don't see the logic of insisting 1 parson only fixed while the amount of supplies can be changed. I didn't intent to create this situation so just forget I mentioned it

[Aedile]

Are the life pods supposed to have no food?

foodAmount = 0.0001?

Also they seem to always end the hatch down, and haven't found a way to turn them over.

[goldenpsp]

Stock has already shown the size of the pods no not directly correlate to how many fix within and a control pod would have far more than lifeboat, by that reasoning a lifeboat could hold equal or less than the capacity of the bridge) I don't see how it's incorrect when I even showed it in the picture. The TAC-LS amounts appear to be already adjustable in the config file. Certainly not arguing or anything of that nature, but don't see the logic of insisting 1 parson only fixed while the amount of supplies can be changed. I didn't intent to create this situation so just forget I mentioned it

Maybe the logic is that Rover felt it should be a 1 person escape module, as it is his mod. Luckily the way it is licensed you are free to change it to a 15 kerbal escape pod if you wish.

And while you may try and argue that there is no direct correlation in stock, I would throw out that there is still SOME correlation. IE the 3 man capsule is physically bigger than the 1 man capsule. It may not scale perfectly but they are in fact bigger and heavier. In that vein the DERP is physically smaller and lighter than even the 1 man capsule, so it absolutely could be argued that it isn't capable of holding more than one kerbal.

From a playability standpoint I personally feel it being 1 man is fine.

Also I don't see how being able to adjust supplies is an argument for fitting more people. I would say that feature would be more suited to allowing a longer lifespan in the instance that you had DERP modules for far away planets where a rescue operation would take longer to get to the kerbal.

[goldenpsp]

Are the life pods supposed to have no food?

foodAmount = 0.0001?

Also they seem to always end the hatch down, and haven't found a way to turn them over.

1. Yes it has been explained numerous times in this thread. A kerbal can last 30 days without food using TAC-LS, which is why food is at 0.

2. That is what the kickstand is for. To keep the hatch from being blocked when landing. (also explained throughout this thread).

[Aedile]

Even extending kickstand keeps the hatch blocked unfortunately. Maybe just landed on the wrong place.

[goldenpsp]

Even extending kickstand keeps the hatch blocked unfortunately. Maybe just landed on the wrong place.

Rover said a page or so back to extend the kickstand before landing. But there were other people saying the kickstand is sometimes clipping into the ground so maybe there are bees involved with the update.

[JeffreyCor]

Maybe the logic is that Rover felt it should be a 1 person escape module, as it is his mod. Luckily the way it is licensed you are free to change it to a 15 kerbal escape pod if you wish.

And while you may try and argue that there is no direct correlation in stock, I would throw out that there is still SOME correlation. IE the 3 man capsule is physically bigger than the 1 man capsule. It may not scale perfectly but they are in fact bigger and heavier. In that vein the DERP is physically smaller and lighter than even the 1 man capsule, so it absolutely could be argued that it isn't capable of holding more than one kerbal.

From a playability standpoint I personally feel it being 1 man is fine.

Also I don't see how being able to adjust supplies is an argument for fitting more people. I would say that feature would be more suited to allowing a longer lifespan in the instance that you had DERP modules for far away planets where a rescue operation would take longer to get to the kerbal.

I don't recall asking you anything and the original request for it to be a config option addressed exactly this without having to create a new dll.

Your failure to see the connection between supplies and crew is an utter failing on your part so perhaps you should consider learning some deductive reasoning and logic before mouthing off.

[forsaken1111]

I don't recall asking you anything and the original request for it to be a config option addressed exactly this without having to create a new dll.

Your failure to see the connection between supplies and crew is an utter failing on your part so perhaps you should consider learning some deductive reasoning and logic before mouthing off.

Somebody's cranky today. For the record, you are on a public forum so anyone is free to chime in. You don't have to directly address us. If you wanted a one-on-one conversation you could have used a PM, so this "I don't remember asking you" crap, you can check that at the door.

RoverDude explained why he has the capacity set at one. You disagree. I get it. Now you're angry because someone else doesn't agree with you? Fork the mod and make your changes if you're so fired up about it.

[RoverDude]

Stock has already shown the size of the pods no not directly correlate to how many fix within and a control pod would have far more than lifeboat, by that reasoning a lifeboat could hold equal or less than the capacity of the bridge) I don't see how it's incorrect when I even showed it in the picture. The TAC-LS amounts appear to be already adjustable in the config file. Certainly not arguing or anything of that nature, but don't see the logic of insisting 1 parson only fixed while the amount of supplies can be changed. I didn't intent to create this situation so just forget I mentioned it

Because I actually measured:

- The size of the pod

- The size of a kerbal

- The actual volume required to store all of those other bits

- It does in fact have navigational stuff

- And those supplies actually have a direct impact on mass. It's mostly there to support TAC-LS changes.

Compare the size of the AES pod and HERP bubble pod to a DERP. Note the former are not inflatable, and are extremely fragile.

The inner wall of a DERP is pretty darn close to the outer diameter of that hard-shell bubble you see above and to the left of it. And that one is the Kerbal equivelant of a B-17 tailgunner's ball - it is freaking cramped. You can't even move your legs.

I personally would never add an option for the DERP to hold more than one - it doesn't jive. If you want to, just change the crewcapacity of it to 10 or whatever, and rock on. I personally would feel it's cheaty.

Are the life pods supposed to have no food?

foodAmount = 0.0001?

Also they seem to always end the hatch down, and haven't found a way to turn them over.

Yes, and kickstand deployed before you land. Or just turn SAS on and roll them over. I'll make the next collider pointy

Maybe the logic is that Rover felt it should be a 1 person escape module, as it is his mod. Luckily the way it is licensed you are free to change it to a 15 kerbal escape pod if you wish.

And while you may try and argue that there is no direct correlation in stock, I would throw out that there is still SOME correlation. IE the 3 man capsule is physically bigger than the 1 man capsule. It may not scale perfectly but they are in fact bigger and heavier. In that vein the DERP is physically smaller and lighter than even the 1 man capsule, so it absolutely could be argued that it isn't capable of holding more than one kerbal.

From a playability standpoint I personally feel it being 1 man is fine.

Also I don't see how being able to adjust supplies is an argument for fitting more people. I would say that feature would be more suited to allowing a longer lifespan in the instance that you had DERP modules for far away planets where a rescue operation would take longer to get to the kerbal.

See image above. Three would not physically fit in that pod unless you ran them through a vitamix and poured them in, and assumed the walls were paper thin.

I don't recall asking you anything and the original request for it to be a config option addressed exactly this without having to create a new dll.

Your failure to see the connection between supplies and crew is an utter failing on your part so perhaps you should consider learning some deductive reasoning and logic before mouthing off.

Now was that really necessary?

[goldenpsp]

I don't recall asking you anything and the original request for it to be a config option addressed exactly this without having to create a new dll.

Wow, need moar coffee? Forsaken pretty much covered this already though, so I won't repeat the sentiment.

Your failure to see the connection between supplies and crew is an utter failing on your part so perhaps you should consider learning some deductive reasoning and logic before mouthing off.

Again WOW. I guess I could say the same about your basic reading skills. My comment was not a failure to see a connection between supplies and crew. My comment was to show there is more than one reason to change the supplies amount that does not involve more crew. Therefore since adding more crew is not the ONLY reason you may want to adjust the amount of LS in a DERP pod you cannot really use configurability as an argument that it should hold more than one Kerbal. I think my logic is fine thanks.

[dzikakulka]

As I haven't found a solution for the issue I outlined in post #373, I'd like to ask anydoby here for a working FAR config for the module. You can get them by launching a flight with these two modules, saving and the searching for the vessel name in the persistence file. Just copypasting whole vessel data ould be fine and may help me getting stuff to work as I have this issue in my main (important for me) save. Thanks!

[RoverDude]

As I haven't found a solution for the issue I outlined in post #373, I'd like to ask anydoby here for a working FAR config for the module. You can get them by launching a flight with these two modules, saving and the searching for the vessel name in the persistence file. Just copypasting whole vessel data ould be fine and may help me getting stuff to work as I have this issue in my main (important for me) save. Thanks!

What version of FAR? Because I actually test with FAR installed...

[Nori]

Now was that really necessary?

Dang RoverDude you are so chill!

Anywho, I to had FAR warnings popping up when using the DERP. Have the latest non-dev FAR installed and have the same errors showing up as were previously posted.

I can get you a log file tonight if you like (not at home right now).

[RoverDude]

Dang RoverDude you are so chill!

Anywho, I to had FAR warnings popping up when using the DERP. Have the latest non-dev FAR installed and have the same errors showing up as were previously posted.

I can get you a log file tonight if you like (not at home right now).

Please do, I'll pester Ferram4 in channel

[ModZero]

What version of FAR? Because I actually test with FAR installed...

Actually, I'm with 0.14.1.1 and adding FAR to RealChutes and full USI pack causes the everything-is-on-and-firing bug on PodEngine in VAB. I'm still poking at it, but I'm now sure it's not related to MM version.

[forsaken1111]

I used FAR with my own DERP rescue mission and didn't have any issues beyond the rocket being a bit unbalanced because I am .... at balancing things.

[Mischief]

If I need more supplies in a DERP I can just put a small life support module between it and the engine/support section. That simple. The whole point of TAC is adding the *complexity* of supplying food, water, power and waste disposal to my crew. If I didn't want to have to worry about it I'd turn it off.

Currently working on an AES/HERP commanded micro-lander for Minmus exploration. HERP needs an independent generator like the DERP does though.

[RoverDude]

Actually, I'm with 0.14.1.1 and adding FAR to RealChutes and full USI pack causes the everything-is-on-and-firing bug on PodEngine in VAB. I'm still poking at it, but I'm now sure it's not related to MM version.

It's RealChutes.

[Mischief]

Oh! Also - the DERP propulsion module. Can it have linking points on both sides? I know it's radial but sometimes you want to put it on the nose of a command pod or somewhere similar for aerodynamic reasons. Without a linking point on the back end it always ends up slightly off for weight/drag positioning. Can it have a linkage point on top and bottom? Would allow for more reliable positioning when you want it in a specific spot and not just radial.

[RoverDude]

Oh! Also - the DERP propulsion module. Can it have linking points on both sides? I know it's radial but sometimes you want to put it on the nose of a command pod or somewhere similar for aerodynamic reasons. Without a linking point on the back end it always ends up slightly off for weight/drag positioning. Can it have a linkage point on top and bottom? Would allow for more reliable positioning when you want it in a specific spot and not just radial.

It breaks the decouplers so it's an either or... that's kinda the rub

[Arron Rift]

Very nice update! Out of curiosity, how well do the new floaties work with Hooligan Lab's water?

Also, what's the difference between the airbags and the floaties aside from shape and color? Do the airbags not float, and/or do the floaties pop easier?

[Arron Rift]

Because I actually measured:

- The size of the pod

- The size of a kerbal

- The actual volume required to store all of those other bits

- It does in fact have navigational stuff

- And those supplies actually have a direct impact on mass. It's mostly there to support TAC-LS changes.

Compare the size of the AES pod and HERP bubble pod to a DERP. Note the former are not inflatable, and are extremely fragile.

http://i.imgur.com/ZzklzHX.png

The inner wall of a DERP is pretty darn close to the outer diameter of that hard-shell bubble you see above and to the left of it. And that one is the Kerbal equivelant of a B-17 tailgunner's ball - it is freaking cramped. You can't even move your legs.

I personally would never add an option for the DERP to hold more than one - it doesn't jive. If you want to, just change the crewcapacity of it to 10 or whatever, and rock on. I personally would feel it's cheaty.

Yes, and kickstand deployed before you land. Or just turn SAS on and roll them over. I'll make the next collider pointy

See image above. Three would not physically fit in that pod unless you ran them through a vitamix and poured them in, and assumed the walls were paper thin.

Now was that really necessary?

OooOOO, where can I get that "herp"? Is that from the exploration pack?

(Edit: Hey hey, I'm #400! Do I get a prize? )