Will x64 get updated with .25?

[Ketsa]

Linux 64bit KSP (chewing about 7GB of KSP in RAM) is running at least as good as 32bit Win for me and I haven't seen any drawbacks yet. Win x64 was crashing after at least 2min for me.

Every mod I ever wanted is now installed

What is your graphics card ? I tried this with an AMD radeon 7700 and i get constant crashes :/

[magnemoe]

Yeah, just because you don't like the games doesn't make the point any less valid. Look, if you want to keep drinking the Kool Aid, go right ahead. If your looking for the 64-bit games, don't filter by Windows, filter by XBOX, because that's basically a 64-bit only PC.

Both Xbox One and PS4 uses an 64 bit x86 cpu, neither of them run windows.

And yes its look like its something ksp does with unity who generates problems in 64 bit. My main problem was probably mod compatibility problems.

[Sky_walker]

Well guys, I have no idea why you are all complaining abot KSP x64 crashes and mods not working. My x64 version works perfectly. Yup, sometimes I have crashes, but not more often than on x32 version. And even more: finaly I can install all my favorite mods without that ugly "No more memory avalible!!!" loading crash. You guys say that this is some sort of Russian roulette? In that case, I think I won it.

Usually people posting in a topics like that are those that have a problem with something not working for them. Even if 64 bit version works perfectly for 99% of people and doesn't for 1% - you'd still have pages, and pages of discussion about how broken and bad it is.

If issues with 64 bit version would be a common place - we'd see multiple simultaneous topics popping all the time.

[John FX]

Last night I tried the `fix` of changing all the image files in my install to .png from .tga etc.

Forgot I was running KSP when I went to bed last night and it was still running this morning.

I only noticed when MJ did a burn I had set up last night with no `auto warp`.

Seems pretty stable if you can do that on a heavily modded install...

[marce]

What is your graphics card ? I tried this with an AMD radeon 7700 and i get constant crashes :/

GTX780 w. prop. drivers.

I never got good results with AMD cards in Linux or FSX (on Win of course, those are just my two reasons to switch) and had no problems since I switched to Nvidia.

[Alshain]

One thing to remember, is that list of games is pretty much of finished games. Granted what we get with each update is polished, whenever they upgrade the engine, there are going to be additional hiccups to overcome, especially with the change to 64-bit. I am sensing an underlying impatience and/or resentment that Squad isn't delivering on all the goods where 64-bit is concerned. It may not even be intentional.

KSP doesn't need 64-bit. With the current layout, we have been doing just fine. But it should be considered that they are implementing it into the game, and it may take some time for it to run smoother. I, myself, am already seeing an incredible performance increase, and I am fine with that.

Let's be careful with this thread, in that it doesn't turn into something more than it is intended. Too many people tend to enjoy hopping on bandwagons and making them out more than they are meant to be, and it can end up working against us.

No, your not sensing correctly. The complaint here is not not that x64 doesn't work, the complaint is that every time someone asks a valid question like the one in the OP, the first few responses is "It's Unity, Squad can't do anything." which the person saying that generally doesn't know what they are talking about. That's all we are discussing here. Squad said x64 wouldn't work 100% right away, we know that and we are fine with that. The OP's question is still perfectly valid and I don't buy that all the problems with KSP are because of Unity. Sure, Unity probably has a few issues, but people really need to stop blaming Unity for everything as a way to dismiss everyone.

Remember when the decoupler force bug was all Unitys fault and then someone came along and made a mod to fix it, then squad almost immediately released 24.1?

Edited September 24, 2014 by Alshain

[samstarman5]

I do not remember, as I never had a problem with that bug.

[nine_iron]

im using 64 bit to run a load of mods but I get 2-3 stealth crashes a night with the odd one being a normal crash instead. 90% are VAB or SPH so I am guessing its a part issue.

I tolerate it as .25 is not THAT far away and I am too lazy to find the route as it might just be KSP itself and I want all my mods on.

[John FX]

No, your not sensing correctly. The complaint here is not not that x64 doesn't work, the complaint is that every time someone asks a valid question like the one in the OP, the first few responses is "It's Unity, Squad can't do anything." which the person saying that generally doesn't know what they are talking about. That's all we are discussing here. Squad said x64 wouldn't work 100% right away, we know that and we are fine with that. The OP's question is still perfectly valid and I don't buy that all the problems with KSP are because of Unity. Sure, Unity probably has a few issues, but people really need to stop blaming Unity for everything as a way to dismiss everyone.

Remember when the decoupler force bug was all Unitys fault and then someone came along and made a mod to fix it, then squad almost immediately released 24.1?

Lots of this. There seems to be a knee jerk reaction to any suggestion that there may be ways of programming by SQUAD or mod devs that could reduce crashing and that everything is the fault of unity

Myself I have the opinion that, even if the unity 64 bit is unstable, there are programming methods and techniques that would reduce the amount of crashes and that programming with the 64 bit client in mind is advised, rather than just saying `64 bit is just unstable because of unity` every time someone using the 64 bit client reports a bug.

I may be suffering from confirmation bias but the mods where the devs say they test the mod on a windows 64 bit client seem to cause less crashes on 64 bit windows. YMMV.

this deserves repeating

`Sure, Unity probably has a few issues, but people really need to stop blaming Unity for everything as a way to dismiss everyone.`

[Renegrade]

Endless Legend is one of the games on that list, and it uses Unity 64-bit. It runs smooth as silk, and it looks beautiful.

But does it use more than 4G of memory? If it does, we have something to show Squad. If not, another example will be needed.

Yeah, just because you don't like the games doesn't make the point any less valid. Look, if you want to keep drinking the Kool Aid, go right ahead. If your looking for the 64-bit games, don't filter by Windows, filter by XBOX, because that's basically a 64-bit only PC.

Nathan addressed the X-bone issue (and I presume what's what you mean by 'xbox', as the others were 32-bit machines). Wouldn't surprise me to find out it was just a 32-bit OS using PAE though (would be a first for Microsoft though!).

Anyhow, you can go on whining at Squad, but without solid proof, they're just going to go, "Oh, it's a Unity problem." And hey, go easy on me, I'm not a member of the Squad Defense Force. I'd love to be able to pull up some solid proof and wave it in Squad's collective faces and say, "LOOK, Blargmaster 2K runs perfectly fine with 8.5 gigabytes consumed, and Whatevertron 9000 won't crash even with a 20 gigabyte world loaded, and they're using an older version of Unity Win64!"

I've just never seen any such evidence. If someone can come up with something solid, I'll gladly join the cause and prepare a document of proof to flourish everytime someone brings the "It's Unity" argument.

For the record, I immediately started using the x86-64 version when 0.24 hit, and didn't change back to x86 until problems cropped up with mods and graphical glitchiness. And science transmissions.

Until then though, we get this:

In 0.25, the Win64 build is actually more unstable than in 0.24.x.

Whereas in 0.24.x we'd see it being pretty reliable with stock but crashing with add-ons/plugins, in 0.25 it crashes for nearly everyone and almost at the exact same point. We've spent a significant amount of time in Experimentals, both on a tester and developer side, looking into it, chasing leads, narrowing down reproduction cases and generally digging deeper and deeper into probable causes. However, despite the efforts of a handful of the testers who have tirelessly (and I mean tirelessly) worked on it since the beginning of Experimentals, we have yet to hammer this one out, find the cause and fix it. The dastardly issue that causes it to crash still eludes us.

x86 until Unity 5, it seems..

Although at this point, this may all be pointless as we may very well be running Unity 5 by the time we can motivate Squad to fix the issues on their end. That could very well be their plan, in fact.

Myself I have the opinion that, even if the unity 64 bit is unstable, there are programming methods and techniques that would reduce the amount of crashes and that programming with the 64 bit client in mind is advised, rather than just saying `64 bit is just unstable because of unity` every time someone using the 64 bit client reports a bug.

There are many, many problems that cannot be worked around. The actual bug reports with any meat I've ever seen are these two:

1. There is a pointer casting bug which is (presumably) truncating pointers. There is literally no sane solution do this if it's for anything important like the ship, or render context, or planets or such.

2. Various exceptions cannot be caught. Well, if you can't catch an exception, it falls back down through the stack until something CAN catch it. If it's something nasty, game over, program exits.

If it weren't something serious, then yeah, you can often simply avoid calling certain broken parts of an API, or rig your data to be compatible with a broken specification or such..but these two things I've heard are not inconsequential.

[Krosulhah]

Am i seriously the only person who doesn't get crashes with x64? I've got loads of mods installed, and it's only ever crashed once.

[Ar_Taq]

Am i seriously the only person who doesn't get crashes with x64? I've got loads of mods installed, and it's only ever crashed once.

Windows 7, 8, 8.1 or Linux? There are times I can't go into any of the buildings, and there are times that I can go for hours without a problem. And it doesn't matter if it is modded or not.

Alshain was right that the non official x64 .23.5 version worked like a dream most Windows users. I don't remember it working well for Linux users though. So what changed between .23.5 and the official release? SQUAD's integration of x64. So now the Linux users are confused why the Windows users won't stop complaining and we Windows users are confused as to how it was working and now it is not. I want x64 back after playing it in .23.5 because it ran smoother, faster, and removing the Active Texture Management made it even better.

So, I'm sure SQUAD has placed x64 on the back burner, as even during the live streams today, they avoided any talk about x64. No matter how many people asked.

Edit: I went back and looked at the KSP .23.5 x64 DIY thread and came to the conclusion that SQUAD did not update the Unity Engine that KSP was running on. To be precise, it currently uses 4.5.2.157915 and when we were all running that it was at least 4.5.3 or many people went with 4.3.3. I am going to try the same fix of sorts and see if that takes care of the problem. Not sure why with .25 probably just a day or two away, but if the problem persists, I want to have another step taken care of that may have an actual answer instead of no one having any.

Edited October 5, 2014 by Ar_Taq

[Northstar1989]

I run x64 without any increase in crashes over x32, and haven't looked back since x64 was released.

Notice I said *increase* in crashes- I still get quite a few crashes, but almost all of them were ones I experiences for exactly the same reasons (usually after a lot of reverts and visits to the VAB) as in x32.

Clearly, the problem is at least partially specific to particular system configurations. I have a Lenovo/IBM laptop (IBM's are known for their quality and stability), if that helps...

Regards,

Northstar

[xtoro]

Am i seriously the only person who doesn't get crashes with x64? I've got loads of mods installed, and it's only ever crashed once.

No crashes, ever, 50 mods running, over 5GB of RAM used..... On Linux 64bit.

[skeevy]

No crashes, ever, 50 mods running, over 5GB of RAM used..... On Linux 64bit.

I knew I couldn't be the only one rockin a bunch of mods with Linux. Lately I've been trying to actually find my mod limit.

Currently, I'm around the 70 mod mark, 2850 MM patches, around 5300GB of RAM used, no Active Texture Management, and my settings.cfg is tweaked to be in between high and medium graphics (and a different conics mode). About to run all that with Kerbin Side. Hopefully all goes well.

I dual boot and have played every KSP version except OSX. Linux 64 bit is, IMHO, the only way to play KSP...modded or unmodded. The only real problem with Linux is when mods have hard coded keys that conflict with Linux keyboard shortcuts.

[xtoro]

I knew I couldn't be the only one rockin a bunch of mods with Linux. Lately I've been trying to actually find my mod limit.

Currently, I'm around the 70 mod mark, 2850 MM patches, around 5300GB of RAM used, no Active Texture Management, and my settings.cfg is tweaked to be in between high and medium graphics (and a different conics mode). About to run all that with Kerbin Side. Hopefully all goes well.

I dual boot and have played every KSP version except OSX. Linux 64 bit is, IMHO, the only way to play KSP...modded or unmodded. The only real problem with Linux is when mods have hard coded keys that conflict with Linux keyboard shortcuts.

Yeah, I will never play on anything else but Linux. I have all the pretty cloud mods etc and I'm running Kerbin Side no problems. As for Linux shortcuts, the only problem I had was the alt key(Alt+click, Alt+F5/F9....), which I changed to mod in the Linux settings, and now instead of Alt I use the Right-Shift key, which I'm used to using.

Edited October 5, 2014 by xtoro