The future of the North Korean space program, hahahah... no seriously

[xenomorph555]

So I wanted to start a thread about the future of the space program of the worlds favourite country, well our favourite one to joke about anyway, hehe.

So if you didn't know they have a space program, here's something to get you up to scratch:

1998: North Korea builds and launch's a rocket made from multiple small missiles, it is intended to place a satellite in orbit, it gets very close but the 3rd stage fails. The program is then cancelled for a decade.

2000's: Sometime in the 2000's they build a better dedicated large long range rocket launch site called Sohae satellite launch station.

2009: NK builds a new better rocket and launchs... it fails.

2012:With fat boy in charge he decides to ramp up the program with 2 more launchs... and one succeeds, somehow...

2013: Sohae begins massive upgrade works and NK gets an official agency called, wait for it, NADA!

2014: Some large engine tests happen and Sohae gets completed.

So that's their history but now what, maybe it was a one time thing, maybe it will grow. Here's stuff I am certain of:

They have a working rocket.

They can build sats.

They have a descent launch site.

Space is better propaganda then nukes.

Fat boys interested in space.

Their program runs off magic like most things in NK.

I personally think we will be seeing more space activitys from NK, especially since they will be probably want to race South (they have both launched 1 sat).

Edited October 12, 2014 by xenomorph555

[NFUN]

Eh, there might be more activity there for the time being, but it is looking a little like there might be a power struggle there, as Fat Boy hasn't been seen in more than a month. And if they scale up their space program, many will translate that into nuke capability, or at least normal missiles. Any more sabre rattling, which they are prone to do, might not end as well for them as it did last time a year or two ago.

But if they want to use space for peace, I wish them luck. At least they aren't Iran...

(Iran has a tendency to photoshop weapons, or use obviously fake plastic/wood models as real planes)

[xenomorph555]

That photo... lol

In all serious though Iran has a very descent and good space program.

[Kryten]

Iran have slightly more reliable rockets, but they don't have anything approaching the size of Unha. Their sats have to be put into orbits so low they only last a few months.

As for NK, I'm not sure we'll see more space launches until we see tangible progress on KSLV-II. I suppose we'll see soon enough, with the work at Sohae apparently being finished.

[Godot]

North Korean Question: Is there any hope for us to get to space?

Answer: Nada

[NFUN]

That photo... lol

In all serious though Iran has a very descent and good space program.

You play KSP, you should know the best way to get to space is up-- if you descend, you have a bad problem and will not go to space today.

It's 'decent', you said it twice

[CaptainKipard]

You play KSP, you should know the best way to get to space is up-- if you descend, you have a bad problem and will not go to space today.

It's 'decent', you said it twice

I think he was making a pun.

Also is that "photo" official?

Edited October 12, 2014 by Cpt. Kipard

[NFUN]

I think he was making a pun.

Also is that "photo" official?

No, this is the official photo.

Also, "this" "is" "Iran's" "steal"th "fighter:" "

/"laser"

//pay attention...

Edited October 12, 2014 by NFUN

[xenomorph555]

Iran have slightly more reliable rockets, but they don't have anything approaching the size of Unha. Their sats have to be put into orbits so low they only last a few months.

As for NK, I'm not sure we'll see more space launches until we see tangible progress on KSLV-II. I suppose we'll see soon enough, with the work at Sohae apparently being finished.

It's theorized they could launch another Unha-3 by the end of the year, but as you say they may go for something better.

North Korean Question: Is there any hope for us to get to space?

Answer: Nada

Hahahaha

You play KSP, you should know the best way to get to space is up-- if you descend, you have a bad problem and will not go to space today.

It's 'decent', you said it twice

Haha, yeah thanks, typo error.

No, this is the official photo.

http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m119/flyfort17/IranMissile.jpg

XD these photoshops are too funny!

[Scotius]

Heh, I remember first presentation of that "fighter". First i laughed, then i got angry because those people obviously took the whole audience for idiots, and didn't even try to make this thing somewhat convincing. Then i started laughing again - bitterly this time. Apparently it was I who underestimated number of idiots\ignorants out there - surprisingly large amount of commenters on internet forums apparently believed the propaganda, and thought it was the real thing.

[Kryten]

What's supposed to be up with it? It's a reverse-engineered F-5 we knew they already have, with some pretty minor changes to reduce RCS, along with some freaky wingtips. An F-22 it is not, but I don't see why it can't be called a 'stealth fighter' when something like the F-117 can.

[CptRichardson]

What's supposed to be up with it? It's a reverse-engineered F-5 we knew they already have, with some pretty minor changes to reduce RCS, along with some freaky wingtips. An F-22 it is not, but I don't see why it can't be called a 'stealth fighter' when something like the F-117 can.

It's literally too small. Smaller than most cars small. If it was made out of balsa wood or plastic it might fly, but would be worthless as a military aircraft if it was.

In short, if it was a genuine attempt at a fighter it's ambitious, but rubbish.

[Kryten]

It is made of plastic, quite clearly. A mockup not being full-scale doesn't mean there's not a real program.

[magnemoe]

Eh, there might be more activity there for the time being, but it is looking a little like there might be a power struggle there, as Fat Boy hasn't been seen in more than a month. And if they scale up their space program, many will translate that into nuke capability, or at least normal missiles. Any more sabre rattling, which they are prone to do, might not end as well for them as it did last time a year or two ago.

But if they want to use space for peace, I wish them luck. At least they aren't Iran...

http://neveryetmelted.com/wp-images/IranMissiles.jpg

(Iran has a tendency to photoshop weapons, or use obviously fake plastic/wood models as real planes)

North Korea has been taken in the same bluff, some rocket used in a parade looked like cheap mock up.

Now the famous Iranian picture is even more fun if you think about it. The rockets used is not something very high tech. Its an short range artillery rocket based on an old Soviet design. More modern design uses multiple rockets in closed tubes.

Everybody do some test firing of this systems every year mostly to see that they work and to satisfy the crews.

One of the rockets did not fire, this is not uncommon, you use old rockets close to it use-before-date for training.

Someone Photoshoped this non event so it showed all rocket firing. Then it was used in propaganda to show Iran's power some months later.

So you use an picture of an yearly military exercise where you do stuff everybody else do, photoshop away an common problem, then use it in propaganda internationally.

The result was entertaining.

[magnemoe]

It is made of plastic, quite clearly. A mockup not being full-scale doesn't mean there's not a real program.

Its probably an real program however its far from producing an jet fighter even an simple one.

You probably have multiple effects, the program present an mock up to get more funding, mock up is designed to impress politicians.

Politicians uses this for internal propaganda, news goes international and experts look at it and laughs.

Iran has an long tradition of presenting mock ups or even 3d models as real weapon systems.

Everybody who make weapon systems make lots of designs who is never leaves the mock up level, few present them as real.

[Kryten]

It wasn't presented as real, just a few news sites decided to act as if it is and the rest jumped on the easy propoganda bandwagon. Instead of real analysis, we get people slapping each other on the back about how footage explicitly stated to be of a sub-scale prototype isn't a real plane, and coming up with guff about Iran having no aircraft manufacturing capability at all. It's the same kind of substandard, lazy 'journalism' that effects almost every story about Iran or NK.

[Godot]

Its probably an real program however its far from producing an jet fighter even an simple one.

You probably have multiple effects, the program present an mock up to get more funding, mock up is designed to impress politicians.

Politicians uses this for internal propaganda, news goes international and experts look at it and laughs.

Iran has an long tradition of presenting mock ups or even 3d models as real weapon systems.

Everybody who make weapon systems make lots of designs who is never leaves the mock up level, few present them as real.

YOu forget the further step in North Korean propaganda:

Mockup is used to produce a Youtube propaganda video with special effects to make it appear as if the mockup is a piece of really working machinery

The special effects are so lousy, that only north koreans take the propaganda video for real

The international publis laughs at the propaganda video

[xenomorph555]

Alright lets get back on track, we have started talking about iran and photoshopping when the threads about NK's space program.

[Kryten]

What is there more to say? Unless activity starts at Sohae, we might as well be reading tea leaves.

[NASAFanboy]

North Korea's space program is as laughable as a actual Kerbal Space Program run by Kerbals (If anything, they have a success rate that is lower than my Kerbals when I first started)... Methinks Kim Jong Un plays KSP, very bad player, very much reason for many hilarious failures since he takes it so literally.

*sarcasm*

Edited October 13, 2014 by NASAFanboy
Had to clarify

[Sky_walker]

Spoken like a true NASA fanboy.

[Kryten]

North Korea's space program is as laughable as a actual Kerbal Space Program run by Kerbals (If anything, they have a success rate that is lower than my Kerbals when I first started)... Methinks Kim Jong Un plays KSP, very bad player, very much reason for many hilarious failures since he takes it so literally.

Hush, adults are talking.

Seriously, do you not know anything about the history of space travel? The US' own first vehicle had six of it's first seven launches fail, and your third attempted vehicle had a 100% failure rate out of six launches. The Brazilians had three consecutive failures barely a decade ago, but I don't see people saying Dilma Rousseff must play KSP.

[NASAFanboy]

Hush, don't be aggorant or snobby about this.

Can't believe you took me seriously. Do you people even detect sarcasm or humor at all?

Otherwise, I believe that North Korea's space program is promising, however, they lack the industrial capability and resources to put a dedicated effort towards their space program. They are different from their neighbors - they, atleast, can rely on imports from their allies and a well-developed industry to draw from, but North Korea is poor in resources and the pariah of the world. A loss of a North Korean rocket will be more devestating to North Korea than a explosion of a Atlas V to the United States, even if it is smaller or less capable.

Thus, by this, North Korea cannot afford as many failures, as they have no reliable imports, no allies, and little if any industrial capability that will allow them to replace their losses or failures. Their leadership is also a issue; under the constant pressure of purges or execution, they cannot possibly achieve high morale amongst anyone inside their space programs, which will affect them adversely in the long run.

Edited October 13, 2014 by NASAFanboy

[xenomorph555]

Hush, don't be aggorant or snobby about this.

Can't believe you took me seriously. Do you people even detect sarcasm or humor at all?

Otherwise, I believe that North Korea's space program is promising, however, they lack the industrial capability and resources to put a dedicated effort towards their space program. They are different from their neighbors - they, atleast, can rely on imports from their allies and a well-developed industry to draw from, but North Korea is poor in resources and the pariah of the world. A loss of a North Korean rocket will be more devestating to North Korea than a explosion of a Atlas V to the United States, even if it is smaller or less capable.

Thus, by this, North Korea cannot afford as many failures, as they have no reliable imports, no allies, and little if any industrial capability that will allow them to replace their losses or failures. Their leadership is also a issue; under the constant pressure of purges or execution, they cannot possibly achieve high morale amongst anyone inside their space programs, which will affect them adversely in the long run.

Very good analysis, however with these problems how does the program run in the first place, NK's a very confusing country when it comes to money...

[NASAFanboy]

Very good analysis, however with these problems how does the program run in the first place, NK's a very confusing country when it comes to money...

North Korea is not...very focused with the common citizen. They have no welfare or social programs, and almost it's entire GDP is directed into a few hands. North Korea also happens to be amongst the largest black markets and the worlds biggest exporter of illegal drugs, which helps them get money. And then there is the foreign aid - although small and minimal due to them having bad relations with those sending the aid in the first place, it helps the country keep itself together and not collapse into famine and rebellion. Such an collapse would flood its neighbors with refugees and cause trouble, and the powers of the world don't want that. So for now, they somehow remain in power, or until it is more beneficial to their neighbors to let them just collapse than to keep them standing.

I'll guess the North Korean Government spends up to around 20-35% of its GDP on the space program. As I've said, they don't really fund anything but the military, government, and one or two extra programs, and the Space Program appears to be one of them. The United States, on the other hand, has to spread funding out amongst hundreds of agencies and programs, which divvies up the funds.