Tier 1 KSC - a friendly discussion.

[Capt Snuggler]

So Squad recently did something very brave by showing us the work in progress for Tier 1 KSC.

response from the community has been... mixed.

So lets have a friendly discussion about what we like, don't like and what we would change.

what I like:

• the Tailors- I really like these. They make great cheap temporary office and work spaces. I have seen these used on work sites many times. maybe include some shipping containers also. they are perfect for early early days when you don't know whats required or how the facility is going to expand.
  
• the temporary look of things.- its day one. the public probably don't know and likely don't care about this "space program" thingy. nor do the kerbals know where this is going or what to expect in the future.
  
• practical industrial feel. the kerbals are unraveling the mystery of space flight. all they know is they will need tools.
  

what I don't like:

• the textures - they're overstretched and low-res. I believe these are place holder textures.
  
• the odd shaped riveted panels - why? brick or corrugated iron would be a better choice. but again see textures^
  
• the VAB- its a barn? I guess, but I think this should have been more inspired by a warehouse or industrial workshop.
  
• no clear foundation. it seems like it just emerged up out of the ground. I don't think it should be purpose built but I don't really see any history here. what was it before? why did the kerbals pick this place.
  

how to improve it:

decide on clear foundation. lets think- what is it? or what was it before? where did it come from? why did the kerbals choose this place?

right now it looks like a farm/trailer park/junk yard/thing. it seems the kerbals don't have any military backing, so an airbase wouldn't be appropriate. and no huge financial backing, so its not likely to be purpose built.

for these reasons I think a better template would be a decommissioned mine site or quarry.

why a mine site?

first of all, it would be a tip of the hat to October Sky and the rocket boys (watch it). they launched rockets in an old mine site. but also mine sites have things the kerbals would want in their first launch site.

• lots of clear space mostly covered in gravel, so less likely spread fire.
  
• large workshops. back in the day, mine sites had large fully equipped workshops for building and repairing heavy machinery. perfect for building rockets
  
• heavy equipment for earth moving. in the beginning they're going to be building most of this stuff them selves so they'll want the equipment and machinery.
  
• slag mounds to use for a launch site. just like the rocket boys used.
  
• large road network between buildings for moving large equipment.
  
• a few sheds for admin, lodging, storage, etc. open sheds and stuff.
  
• good distance from other habbited areas. explaining the vast expanse of nothing-ness around KSC.
  large spread out site. mine sites are usually a sprawling mess of industry and would help explain why things are so far apart even at the humble beginnings.
  

Launch pad = slag mounds and/or a vertical mine shaft with tower for early launch tower.

Runway = old torn up railway line.

VAB = large wear house/repair shop.

Admin and support buildings = temporary offices and trailers.

support vehicles = cranes, dozers, excavators, water trucks etc

R&D facility = explosives store bunker. so things can go bang without damaging anything else.

and flood lights all over the site.

This is just my view on improving it. what do you guys think? how would you improve this and make it great?

keep it constructive and polite guys.

*edit*

this is kinda what i had in mind:

Edited November 11, 2014 by Capt Snuggler

[steve_v]

a good distance from other rabbited areas.

LOL

Sorry, couldn't help myself

I like the idea though, a mine site makes a lot of sense..

That said, if Squad do stick with the farm concept, I hope the textures and models get a bit of work...

[Capt Snuggler]

LOL

Sorry, couldn't help myself

fixed. thanks for pointing that out

[Commissioner Tadpole]

I agree. In my opinion, the Tier 1 KSC should be more of an old factory with '20s technology, whereas Tier 2 would be more industrial from the '70s, and Tier 3 would be the technologic 2013's space center. Like users said, Kerbals do know how to make technology, they just don't have the means to do so in the beginning, thus they know better than to make rockets in a wooden shack.

[CapCornsnack]

Tier 3 would be the technologic 2013's space center.

Sorry, what is that exactly?

[FishInferno]

Sorry, what is that exactly?

One big iPhone

[razark]

I'm not a fan of the whole craptastic junky space center. The concept would work if we were starting with very early experimental rockets that go up and come back down. However, the game presents creatures that are able, from the very first minute, to launch a crewed vehicle with a pretty high chance of successful recovery. The presented facilities just do not fit in with that level.

As for the actual models/textures, I'm not that worried. I'll mostly be seeing them from a distance for a short time during the ascent. If the building interiors are done poorly, I might have more of an issue with it.

[Pthigrivi]

You guys are way, way, way overthinking this. Its supposed to look junky. Its humble and its a mess. As things progress, you'll get tier 2, 3, 4, 5 models which will look probably first industrial and then spaceage and then glitzy modern. For them to be visually distinguishable you have to start out at the bottom. If this is the bottom it looks hilarious and effing amazing.

Its like looking at the first simcity buildings that go down and being like THESE LOOK OLD AND JUNKY THIS GAME SUCKS.

[RocketPilot573]

I really hope they improve these textures before release. I think it's time for Squad to stop adding placeholders and just finish it in the first place.

[CaptainKipard]

You guys are way, way, way overthinking this. Its supposed to look junky. Its humble and its a mess.

I'm with Snuggler, except I think the early KSC should be more like Baikonur. That's where it all began for the russians afterall, and it has kind of a on-the-cheap feel to it without being ridiculous.

[prophet_01]

I am happy with some of the stuff. The trailers are kinda cool (reminds me of the public launches). The cover around the building close to the launch pad are quite funny. The crappy looking telescope (srsly silo?) is ok although not my favourite.

The barn... rly, a barn? Simply too much imo. Oh and before I forget the shiny white/clean space suite looks like the one thing in the picture that does not match

Btw has anyone noticed the windmills in the background? I like those allthough again, those don't fit in there that early

[Capt Snuggler]

I don't think it needs to look "crappy" it just needs to look "not for purpose"

[prophet_01]

I don't think it needs to look "crappy" it just needs to look "not for purpose"

Exactly. That's what I would have expected (and what I would like to see). But judging from the pictures the buildings don't rly look like that.

[KSK]

There's a couple of reasons why the kerbals would have picked that site. It's by the sea, which gives you a nice safe place to aim your prototype rockets. It's also on the equator, for ease of launching your eventual orbital missions (kerbals are nothing if not optimistic!) Personal preference - I prefer the farm to the mine but, as many other people have pointed out, a brick/stone/corrugated iron barn would make more sense than a wooden one. Something like this perhaps, but maybe not quite as shiny.

On the whole though, I do like the Tier 1 KSC. It's pretty close to how I've always imagined the KSP starting up.

One extra building that I think might be nice, is somewhere for the crowds to watch your launches. Starting off with a set of simple wooden bleachers at Tier 1 and building up to a proper grandstand at Tier 5. The number of spectators could depend on your reputation. You'd need to be careful where you put them, so they don't interfere with likely approaches to the (eventual) runway, but it would be a bit of a visual indication of the growing popularity (or indeed waning popularity) of your space program.

[Commissioner Tadpole]

Sorry, what is that exactly?

Current Space Center... the one we have right now... and the one that you automatically get when starting sandbox mode... I thought it would be obvious.

[CapCornsnack]

Current Space Center... the one we have right now... and the one that you automatically get when starting sandbox mode... I thought it would be obvious.

I don't often read the forums and had never heard the term, thanks though