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Leganeski

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  1. I recently started a career mode save in this system, and it's amazing! The challenges starting from Mesbin are totally different than on Kerbin, and it's really fun to explore them. For example, after setting up a refueling base at Thresomin, I eventually got it to work, but not before running into problems that I totally didn't see coming. (Minor spoilers for docking in Thresomin orbit. Everything I describe is a logical consequence of information already on this thread, but it was fun to discover for myself, and you might feel the same way.) Also, I really like the diversity of moons in the system. So many other planet packs focus too much (in my opinion) on the planets, with only a few moons. Whirligig World does the exact opposite: there are moons everywhere, of all shapes and sizes, making the system feel so much more complete. The Mesbin-Derbin system, for instance, has nine explorable bodies plus a binary trojan and an asteroid belt, and its diversity is completely unmatched by any other planetary system I've ever seen in KSP.
  2. In Whirligig World, delta-V isn't the only challenge in getting to other planets. The home planet's high gravity means that to avoid prohibitive cosine losses, you need either a lot of periapsis kicks (which run the risk of accidentally encountering a moon) or extremely high TWR (which is impractical to maintain throughout the ~4500 m/s burn). However, unlike most other systems I've seen, the inner planets are packed full of moons, and the home planet has a small moon pretty close to the surface. Establishing a refueling base there makes the trip to almost anywhere else a lot cheaper, and breaks down the long ejection burn into manageable ~1500-2000 m/s pieces. If you don't want to do that either, there's also an option to start on a habitable Kerbin-sized moon that's significantly less deep in the planet's gravity well. Edit: The homeworld Mesbin is an unusual case because it has so much gravitational compression, but the rest of the bodies have densities and atmospheres consistent with stock scale (0.1x RSS scale).
  3. Wow, even more resonances? Including Cerberus-Haven (which is 0.03% away from a 5:3 resonance), I count ten of them already. I don't see too many places left where a new resonance would even make sense, although some (like Prometheus and Rime) certainly do exist.
  4. Part 21: Otho and Hox TGGT goes to Otho's remaining moons, as well as Hox. (21.1) Hephaestus Theoretical Δv: 1870 m/s Actual Δv: 3019 m/s As it turns out, my previous "actual Δv" calculations were in some cases off by up to 0.1 - 0.2% because I was ignoring the 282 kg mass of the crew members and their personal equipment. Now that I've fixed this, my future calculations should be more accurate. This means that TGGT's true Δv capacity, assuming full crew and oxidizer storage, is 8843 m/s. (21.2) Hox Theoretical Δv: 2267 m/s Actual Δv: 2323 m/s (21.3) Icarus Iota Jannah Theoretical Δv: 2123 m/s Actual Δv: 2898 m/s Flags remaining: 27 (3 planted this chapter)
  5. Nice! I've been thinking about doing a Whirligig World grand tour, but it looks like you got to it well before me. These landers look really well designed, and follow the same basic layout as what I would have done except that they have many improvements I wouldn't have thought of (such as the floatation pad for Imterril and the asteroid capture arm). How are two ion landers going to get to three places? Those bodies are nowhere near each other, and I don't see any extra xenon on Kilonova that could be used to refuel the landers. Getting to Fophie is certainly really inconvenient, but using a Gememma assist to get into a polar Kaywell orbit and then meeting Fophie at its apoapsis seems like it would be well within the capabilities of Kilonova itself without the need for a dedicated lander. Is that parachute going to be enough for Lowel's thin atmosphere? If Workhorse uses rocket braking to land there, the delta-v margins for ascent seem pretty tight.
  6. Part 20: Hadrian Hadrian doesn't really fit into either of the adjacent chapters, and I have a lot to say about it, so it gets its own chapter. Why is Hadrian so special? It's the only body with a dense inert atmosphere, and this combined with its low gravity makes flying there completely different from anywhere else. In fact, the conditions are so unusual that I've often said one could fly a brick there. Well, TGGT is shaped approximately like a brick. It's time to find out whether or not that's true! (20.1) Reaching Gratian Hadrian Theoretical Δv: 2485 m/s Actual Δv: 3340 m/s (20.2) Descent Theoretical Δv: 985 m/s (from elliptical polar orbit; all of it is easily aerobrakable) Actual Δv: 135 m/s (20.3) Ascent Theoretical Δv: 816 m/s (from pole) Actual Δv: 1559 m/s TGGT is now in low Hadrian orbit, ready to go to the next moon, Hephaestus. However, the trip to Hadrian has left some unresolved questions. Can TGGT really fly there? It was certainly using lift to steer, but it never managed to entirely stop its vertical descent. That can't really be called "flying". Yet it did manage to get close, and that was with moderately full tanks. What if the tanks were empty? (Spinoff 1) Flying the brick (Spinoff 2) Flying an actual plane instead Flags remaining: 30 (1 planted this chapter)
  7. I totally agree; a gravity assist chain would be much more safe and effective. As long as the incoming speed isn't too crazy (the upper limit is somewhere around 20-25 km/s), a craft could get captured around the Sun with a Jupiter assist. After that, a series of alternating gravity assists between Jupiter and Saturn could slow the craft down enough relative to Saturn that it would be able safely aerobrake at Titan. From there, it can simply parachute down to Titan's surface. This trajectory would take decades if not centuries, but is quite safe (with enough assists, the final aerobraking speed can be as low as ~3200 m/s), and requires only minimal fuel for correction maneuvers.
  8. I don't have experience with RSS specifically, but what I personally do to get to moons orbiting the home planet at a lower inclination than the launch site's latitude (for example, Iota from GPP) is to estimate the launch timing as best as I can, but then launch into orbit without worrying much about inclination. Once in low orbit, I wait until the moon is 65-70 degrees behind a relative node, and eject entirely prograde at the previous node in order to meet the moon there. It's certainly slower in terms of total mission duration, but is more efficient for achieving a flyby than changing inclination during ascent. Also, at least for me, it's a lot easier to perform.
  9. Part 19: Argo and some large moons TGGT reaches Argo and continues its ever more systematic journey through the Ciro system. I'm beginning to run out of things to say about the mission, so I'll try to include fun facts about the bodies I visit in addition to commentary. I'll also compare the theoretical Δv cost of each leg of the trip (ignoring aerodynamic drag, TWR constraints, inclination, timing inaccuracies, and gravity assists) to how much Δv I actually spent. (Yes, Argo is the smallest body in this chapter. However, it's the only one that technically qualifies as a planet, so it got the chapter title.) (19.1) Argo Theoretical Δv cost (Icarus to Argo): 9307 m/s Actual Δv cost: ~6220 m/s (19.2) Augustus Theoretical Δv: 2662 m/s Actual Δv: 3708 m/s (19.3) Catullus Ceti Theoretical Δv: 4723 m/s Actual Δv: 4120 m/s (19.4) Ciro Eta Gael Gauss Geminus Theoretical Δv: 3479 m/s Actual Δv: 2630 m/s TGGT is now on the surface of Geminus with full tanks. The next target is Hadrian, which provides a temporary return to aerodynamic rather than orbital challenges. Gravity assists so far: 23 (6 performed this chapter) Flags remaining: 31 (4 planted this chapter)
  10. Eeloo's SOI is pretty big; a maneuver of that size could be accomplished over the course of up to four hours. The craft has quite a few ion engines, which look like enough to achieve the necessary 0.9 - 1.0 m/s2 acceleration. Of course, if the burn starts before entering Eeloo's SOI, then there's effectively no time limit.
  11. There seems to be a misunderstanding. The A1 orbit has more energy than the A3 orbit. An important point to remember here is that the gravitational potential energy is always negative, decreasing from zero as the position gets closer to the body from far away. In this case, the A3 orbit is deeper than the A1 orbit in Earth's gravitational well, causing its total energy to be more negative. This means that it is in fact a lower-energy orbit than A1. The straightness of the threshold lines demonstrates the fact that total energy is dependent only on the semi-major axis (the average of periapsis and apoapsis), and not eccentricity.
  12. This is a great explanation! Conversely, on the opposite side of your planetary orbit, you're moving around the sun slower than the planet. This means you've effectively discarded a bunch of energy for free, helping you lower your solar orbit if for example you want to get to Venus or Eve.
  13. Part 18: Thalia and Icarus Now completely unencumbered, TGGT has enough Δv (8840 m/s in total) to get past any problem that might come its way. For example: Icarus is hard to reach safely. However, I can avoid the problem by refueling on Eta, which is relatively close by. Thalia doesn't have any ore, so I can't refuel there. However, I can circumvent the problem by refueling on its moon Eta instead. Icarus orbits very close to Ciro, requiring a huge ejection burn to leave. However, I can mitigate the problem by ejecting only to Eta, and refueling there. Wait... that's not good. I can only refuel on Eta once. Maybe this is more of a problem than I was anticipating. However, the trip from Eta to Icarus costs quite a bit less than 8840 m/s. Maybe I can stick a Thalia landing in the middle. Getting back from Icarus can be accomplished using ... uh ... a lot of gravity assists, probably. (18.1) Eta (18.2) Thalia Due to the nature of Thalia, I end up encountering some of its features that can only really be discovered by actually going there. If you haven't been to Thalia yet and would like to avoid spoilers, you might want to skip this section. (18.3) Icarus (18.4) Leaving Icarus Now that I have a trajectory intersecting Tellumo's orbit, I have successfully made it out of the inner Ciro system. Tellumo is huge, so an assist can take me just about anywhere I want. In fact, that seems to be a problem with the rest of the mission: since I have no planes to worry about, I can go just about anywhere after each refueling stop. I could just go back to Niven with a more reasonable intercept speed, land on it and refuel, and then go to all the rest of the bodies in order. That would just be a bunch of outwards Hohmann transfers, and would get pretty boring. So instead of doing anything sensible like that, I'm going to land on all the remaining bodies in the Ciro system in alphabetical order, starting with Agrippina wait no I already went to Agrippina Argo. That will hopefully require more interesting transfers, and probably many more gravity assists. Gravity assists so far: 17 (9 performed this chapter) Flags remaining: 35 (3 planted this chapter)
  14. This effect also appears in stock, or more generally in any system when ejecting from a relatively large body. For example, burning to Duna from a solar orbit at the same place as Kerbin's orbit requires 920 m/s, while ejecting to Duna from Kerbin requires only 130 m/s more than reaching Kerbin's escape velocity.
  15. This is also true for small enough moons, such as Lili from Galileo's Planet Pack. Lili is on a very tight orbit around a much denser planet which it is tidally locked to, causing it to spin faster than orbital velocity at its equator. However, only the top 1-2 km of the equatorial ridge is actually above the synchronous orbit altitude, so the rock's internal strength can hold everything together. As @tomf said, land near the poles. I've done it successfully on Lili without much difficulty.
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