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wadedidit

Should I Try Real Solar System?

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So I've landed on everything, unlocked everything and made huge space stations and added Life support mods and I just can't seem to be as challenged as I used to. So should I try RSS?

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I didn't like it. It makes everything harder, but to me, it is too hard, with the contracts you get. Getting into orbit in the early game is nearly impossible, let alone doing anything else.

Although strangely, having gotten the idea again, now I kind of want to try it again.

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Yes. Definitely do get some aircraft expansions to go along with it though. Otherwise in the early game career you'll just be grinding up until you can start to get into orbit with more significant payloads.

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If you're using CKAN, it's a pretty easy installation. I decided to try it on a whim, and had a bunch of fun just getting into orbit in sandbox. Maybe it isn't the sort of thing that works with Career mode (unless certain mods are used? insufficient data for me to say), but if you're wondering whether you should, why not try it experimentally?

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If you're using CKAN, it's a pretty easy installation. I decided to try it on a whim, and had a bunch of fun just getting into orbit in sandbox. Maybe it isn't the sort of thing that works with Career mode (unless certain mods are used? insufficient data for me to say), but if you're wondering whether you should, why not try it experimentally?

Im trying the USI Kolonization mods right now and they just aren't as much fun as I thought they'd be.

But the TAC Life support apparently doesn't have a greenhouse. So I like the life support but would rather a self sustaining easy life support mod!

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yes. its a whole new learning curve but once you've gotten used to the idea of ~9500 dV to achieve orbit its not that much harder. Just look up real world rocket concepts like ullage, ignition count and untrottleable engines and plan your missions out with those new limits in mind.

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Its easier if you have part packs like Procedural parts, KW or tweak scale. Using all stock is really tricky (My Mars probe required 54 of the largest SRBs KW Rocketry could offer and some other stuff, just to reach Mars orbital speed)

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Im trying the USI Kolonization mods right now and they just aren't as much fun as I thought they'd be.

But the TAC Life support apparently doesn't have a greenhouse. So I like the life support but would rather a self sustaining easy life support mod!

SETI-greenhouse is not closing the loop but good enough for all practical purposes. I play TAC-LS with it.

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Yes. It's worth it although it's really hard.

I am very interested in RSS but the even more sparse planets puts me off massively. Any news on this issue?

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SETI-greenhouse is not closing the loop but good enough for all practical purposes. I play TAC-LS with it.

That's what I was after! Close enough!

What about the delta v question? Is it changed?

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Is the ISP delta v the same or upscaled as well?

The realistic progression packs give you a set of real world rocket engines and fuels which do give you a bit better ISP that you're used to in the main game. You'll still need much bigger craft though. Fortunately the procedural fuel tanks make this a lot easier and help reduce the part count too. Fuel Density becomes a factor too. Liquid hydrogen is very light but needs a lot of tank volume, Kerosene is denser so smaller tank size but less dV. once you get your head around the pros and cons of the three main fuel groups (kerosene/Liquid Ox, Hydrogen/liquid Ox, UDMH/IWFNA) its not too tricky.

The main downside I'd have to say is the launch times. building up to an orbital velocity of 7500m/s takes a long time especialy when the high part count at launch is causing physics to slow the game right down.

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So I've landed on everything, unlocked everything and made huge space stations and added Life support mods and I just can't seem to be as challenged as I used to. So should I try RSS?
I would say yes, but...

Real Solar System and Realism Overhaul are two separate mods. They're often used together but you don't have to use RO to use RSS. RO adds a lot of complication and wants more part packs to get the best out of it. As alternatives SMURFF rebalances the stock parts to be closer to reality, while Cryogenic Engines adds some more efficient engines. Or you can play RSS with the stock parts, you'll just need really big rockets to get to places.

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Personally, I'd say yes. Do it.

A lot of people say RSS/RO is too hard, but all it is- is relearning KSP. Your first few rockets in the game where hard, and it's the same here. You simply have to figure out how to get there. What I would suggest is getting the FULL RO package, RealHeat, RealFuels, RealChutes, FAR, AJE, and so on. Procedural parts, and especially the fuel tanks are key. Without it you'll have a much harder time, but it's not impossible. Playing with these essential mods can make RSS SO[\B] much easier! Since the stock KSP ISPs and such are EXTREMELY unrealistic in how weak they are. Lastly don't be crushed that getting into orbit is hard- NASA and the CCCP struggled in the beginning of the space race to make working, reliable rockets.

Now if you want to enhance the game, there are other mods to add to the experiance. Id suggest failure mods like Dangit, KerbalMechanics and LaunchFailure. So every experiance is unique. Along with Environmental Visual Enhancements. As to your life support issue, I suggest using Minable Resouces (I believe it's called) which allows you to use the mining set to mine for life support. AtomicAge may be another mod for you to use as it adds .5m, 1m and 2m nuclear engines. You just have to get them to burn real propellant and it would be good for RSS.

I can add to this list as you need, but this is what I have to suggest for now.

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What's to lose by giving it a go?

Copy your KSP folder and add the mods to its gamedata folder. No risk of wrecking your current saves then.

Not done it myself yet mind you, but I plan on trying it at some point.

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RO can be a bit confusing at the beginning, considering how much it differs from the stock game. I suggest first trying RSS on its own, and then maybe if you feel comfortable with it, you can go for the full RO package.

Definitely give RSS a try, while it is very challenging at first you'll soon get used to it and it will be OK.

To avoid having monstrous rockets for orbiting the smallest satellite, I suggest installing SMURFF (balances engines mass in a more realistic way) or Real Fuels. Even though RF is the closest you'll get to having realistic masses and Isps, it is a complete overhaul of the fuel system so, try not to get too lost at the beginning should you use it.

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You've seen the xkcd cartoon about knowlege of orbital mechanics? If you have to ask the question, your graph is flattening out. Fix any errors that may have crept in via Kerbal's unobtanium lithosphere with real-solar-system. Expect to require a ton more realism mods (you need a ton more delta-v, the current fuel tanks are unrealistically heavy).

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Real Solar System with Realism Overhaul and a bunch of the attendant, supported mods is the only way I can play this game anymore; the toy solar system and the unrealistic parts and engines are pretty much a joke at this point. For career mode, RP-0 plus KCT offers a really solid experience, even if it is very much an unfinished product.

I didn't find it harder, per se, perhaps because I was involved in the "scene" from very early on and learned while RO grew. Aside from learning new ways to build things, the correct ways to launch, and adjusting to realistic methods of operation, not much is really different. I still fly everything manually, even with RemoteTech installed. Removing signal delay helps immensely, then you get to deal with occlusion and range, but not programming your probes (don't care if it's unrealistic, I program for a living, I play KSP to relax). Ullage and limited ignitions looks scary until you've done it a few times and understand the concepts (and remember to bring along some extra RCS fuel for minute maneuvers and adjustments).

Basically it's the game KSP should have been all along.

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You've seen the xkcd cartoon about knowlege of orbital mechanics? If you have to ask the question, your graph is flattening out. Fix any errors that may have crept in via Kerbal's unobtanium lithosphere with real-solar-system. Expect to require a ton more realism mods (you need a ton more delta-v, the current fuel tanks are unrealistically heavy).
To be honest when it comes to orbital mechanics one of KSP's most significant faults is it treats the patched conic approximation as reality. Real Solar System and Realism Overhaul won't change that; you're still playing in a simplified and not fully realistic system - even the Moon has a considerably inaccurate orbit in RSS. Principia will, but it's very much an in-development mod.

Then again, if you want realism maybe you should get Orbiter. And if you want realism combined with space rocket building, well there's nothing, even RSS/RO/whatever in KSP is still firmly at the "toy" level when it comes to the design of rockets.

Edited by cantab

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To be honest when it comes to orbital mechanics one of KSP's most significant faults is it treats the patched conic approximation as reality.
I don't consider that a fault in that KSP actually runs at a reasonable speed. The problem with the system as it stands is the translation between double-precision and single-precision floating point numbers.
Principia will, but it's very much an in-development mod.
Maneuver nodes are being worked on, which will make it much more viable for actual use in the sim. Otherwise, eggrobin et al have actually achieved fairly accurate (in time) eclipses. Not sure if they've done axial tilt yet, they might still be using RSS' technique of tilting the entire solar system.

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